Courtesy and friendliness costs nothing... and silence is an option, too

**BigMackCam** · 02-06-2016, 04:04 PM - **7 Likes**

I'm sure I'll open myself up to some flaming with this post, but I figure that's a risk I'm willing to accept...

I just read a post where a UK-based forum member (been on here since the middle of last year, I think) offered up, free of charge, a Vivitar Series 1 zoom lens - full of fungus, and on a Canon FD mount - to anyone who might be interested in it as a repair / restoration project. The first two answers he got were dismissive and - in my view - rude, even if the thought process behind them made sense. I have nothing against the people that posted those replies, but I dislike how they responded. I'm sorry, but I do.

I love this forum - I really do. I enjoy the wide range of discussions, I've learned so much, and I've been helped by many other forum members. I'm genuinely grateful for this. But a small though significant number of the posts I see are unnecessarily caustic. Usually I just let it go, but this time, no.

Some of us are more direct than others, I appreciate that, and some of us are more subtle, but all of us can and should show a little courtesy (and I acknowledge that most of us do, most of the time - I also know that I'm not perfect in this regard and I regret a couple of posts I've made in the past). It's so easy to be terse and harsh, sat behind a screen and keyboard, but I wonder how many of the overtly direct posters would be quite so direct stood face-to-face with the person they're conversing with? Where I come from, I know exactly how that situation would develop.

In closing, I really wish that everyone would think twice about what they're posting. Is there really any need to say something if it's not likely to be constructive? It doesn't have to be a response the OP wants to hear, but there are simple ways and means to get a point across without being unnecessarily brusque.

OK, I'm putting my crash helmet on ready for the onslaught

Thanks for reading this.

Last edited by BigMackCam; 02-06-2016 at 04:33 PM.

bertwert · 02-06-2016, 04:07 PM - **1 Like**

I agree with you.

You could always ignore those users but can you boriscleto boriscleto?

**monochrome** · 02-06-2016, 04:12 PM

There are two people on this Forum it is unwise to call out in a thread.

:-popcorn:

**BigMackCam** · 02-06-2016, 04:13 PM

Originally posted by bertwert

I agree with you.

You could always ignore those users but can you boriscleto boriscleto?

He he. No, I don't have an "ignore list"... I have a watch list.

---------- Post added 02-06-2016 at 11:15 PM ----------

Originally posted by monochrome

There are two people on this Forum it is unwise to call out in a thread.

:-popcorn:

I appreciate your comment, but unwise how? I don't think the behaviour is appropriate. The thread is there for anyone to read. I don't expect to be popular for saying something, but I get a little tired of discourteous conduct wherever I see it.

EDIT: Sorry, I took that comment a bit seriously, then read your "popcorn" signature... LOL

Last edited by BigMackCam; 02-06-2016 at 04:22 PM.

bertwert · 02-06-2016, 04:15 PM

Originally posted by BigMackCam

He he. No, I don't have an "ignore list"... I have a watch list.

I don't ignore people either, sometimes the stupidness (not in this case though) makes me smile.

**BigMackCam** · 02-06-2016, 04:18 PM

Originally posted by bertwert

I don't ignore people either, sometimes the stupidness (not in this case though) makes me smile.

Yes, me too. Me too.

Unregistered User 8 · 02-06-2016, 04:20 PM

Originally posted by BigMackCam

I love this forum - I really do. I enjoy the wide range of discussions, I've learned so much, and I've been helped by many other forum members. I'm genuinely grateful for this. But a small proportion of posts I see are unnecessarily caustic. Usually I just let it go, but this time, no.

I also agree BigMackCam. This forum is huge with so many different cultures and many members don't have English as their 1st language. That said. free speech is very important. What I find offensive, others may not. I think we must trust the moderators to weed out the truly nasty posts but still allow for a difference of opinion. PS. It is very difficult taking photographs in a crash helmet !!!

**BigMackCam** · 02-06-2016, 04:26 PM

Originally posted by pjv

I also agree BigMackCam. This forum is huge with so many different cultures and many members don't have English as their 1st language. That said. free speech is very important. What I find offensive, others may not. I think we must trust the moderators to weed out the truly nasty posts but still allow for a difference of opinion. PS. It is very difficult taking photographs in a crash helmet !!!

You make a good point - what's offensive to one person may not be offensive to another. Given the range of members we have here, I'm always conscious that what I say could be taken in different ways. Don't get me wrong, I'm happy to have a friendly argument with someone - disagreement isn't a problem. And free speech is most certainly important. But so is being nice to each other. The milk of human kindness, and all that. And if I can't find anything constructive to say (which may, sometimes, be in constructive disagreement), I say nothing... or, at least, I try to - but sometimes my mouth gets the better of me!

Unregistered User 8 · 02-06-2016, 05:02 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by BigMackCam

Given the range of members we have here, I'm always conscious that what I say could be taken in different ways.

This is very important. I also have concerns about participating in some threads. Then I remembered the emoji's. I think they are there for exactly this reason. A smile, laugh, frown etc are universal whereas words are not. Words can be daggers, but tempered with the correct emoji, the right meaning can be seen.

**Mr. Ed** · 02-06-2016, 06:46 PM

I didn't read the thread but I agree with you completely. Seems it would have been easier to not reply if they had no interest in the lens. Many people on this site have varied interest and things that might not interest me are sometimes interesting to others. Much talent on this site.

Rupert · 02-06-2016, 06:49 PM - **2 Likes**

I agree with your post.....and try not to be cross with others here or insulting.......or instigate trouble.....and sometimes fail. I work at not failing....Otis...not so much, but he does mean well....I think?

When I started this thread I stepped on a lot of toes, but it is as true today as it was then....
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/132-pentaxian-lounge/301157-ugly-posters-...post-here.html

Ugliness comes in many shades and failure to recognize the work of others is one of those that is still seriously abused at PForums. When people interact with each other they become friends, and friends treat their friends with some dignity.

Otis has enough friends that he can take chances.....I don't, so I have to try my hardest to get along and not rock the boat.

It's not that hard, this is a nice Forum with tons of great members. If you can't get along here you most likely have a real problem.

Regards!

Unregistered User 8 · 02-06-2016, 07:41 PM

Originally posted by Rupert

If you can't get along here you most likely have a real problem.

Amen.

**csa** · 02-06-2016, 09:24 PM - **3 Likes**

Originally posted by pjv

I think we must trust the moderators to weed out the truly nasty posts but still allow for a difference of opinion.

We can also help the Moderators by reporting posts that are truly nasty, etc. by clicking the yellow triangle at the left/bottom of posts.

**csa** · 02-06-2016, 09:46 PM

Originally posted by pjv

This is very important. I also have concerns about participating in some threads. Then I remembered the emoji's. I think they are there for exactly this reason. A smile, laugh, frown etc are universal whereas words are not. Words can be daggers, but tempered with the correct emoji, the right meaning can be seen.

Very well said, and very true!

alamo5000 · 02-06-2016, 10:56 PM - **2 Likes**

I agree with the overall meaning of your post. For sure. There is no need to be unjustly rude. Most of the posters here, upwards of 90%+ all have their quirks and personalities but those same people I have found are very polite and open to discussion.

That said among the select few that are thin skinned and/or rude they come out swinging sometimes for no apparent reason.

Overall though I think this forum is good and is full of people who have patience. For example for me sometimes all the same things get rehashed here over and over again and sometimes it kind of makes me roll my eyes. Basically some topics have been beaten to death and with those I just refrain from participation. Sometimes people just want to be obtuse.

Then there is the 'new guy/girl' who posts the 'what lens should I buy' thread... with those it's a different story because even though we've been asked 900 times, that might be the first time that person asked. They might be new and have a genuine question and I personally don't want to turn anyone off of photography because of my attitude. If anything, even though I am far from being a good shooter I want to be a good mentor and friend to whoever that new guy/girl might be.

Again though I will reiterate the 90-10 rule here. 90% of the people are extremely cordial towards each other. 10% though can get on the fringes.

Threads like this though are a good reminder from time to time that there is a no @ss**** rule here so fortunately that stuff doesn't get too much out of control for the most part. Plus the mods are generally pretty good about not letting people stir things up too much.

02-06-2016, 04:04 PM - 7 Likes	#1
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,674	Courtesy and friendliness costs nothing... and silence is an option, too I'm sure I'll open myself up to some flaming with this post, but I figure that's a risk I'm willing to accept... I just read a post where a UK-based forum member (been on here since the middle of last year, I think) offered up, free of charge, a Vivitar Series 1 zoom lens - full of fungus, and on a Canon FD mount - to anyone who might be interested in it as a repair / restoration project. The first two answers he got were dismissive and - in my view - rude, even if the thought process behind them made sense. I have nothing against the people that posted those replies, but I dislike how they responded. I'm sorry, but I do. I love this forum - I really do. I enjoy the wide range of discussions, I've learned so much, and I've been helped by many other forum members. I'm genuinely grateful for this. But a small though significant number of the posts I see are unnecessarily caustic. Usually I just let it go, but this time, no. Some of us are more direct than others, I appreciate that, and some of us are more subtle, but all of us can and should show a little courtesy (and I acknowledge that most of us do, most of the time - I also know that I'm not perfect in this regard and I regret a couple of posts I've made in the past). It's so easy to be terse and harsh, sat behind a screen and keyboard, but I wonder how many of the overtly direct posters would be quite so direct stood face-to-face with the person they're conversing with? Where I come from, I know exactly how that situation would develop. In closing, I really wish that everyone would think twice about what they're posting. Is there really any need to say something if it's not likely to be constructive? It doesn't have to be a response the OP wants to hear, but there are simple ways and means to get a point across without being unnecessarily brusque. OK, I'm putting my crash helmet on ready for the onslaught Thanks for reading this. Last edited by BigMackCam; 02-06-2016 at 04:33 PM.

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02-06-2016, 04:07 PM - 1 Like	#2
bertwert Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Golden, BC Posts: 15,173	I agree with you. You could always ignore those users but can you boriscleto boriscleto?

02-06-2016, 04:12 PM	#3
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	There are two people on this Forum it is unwise to call out in a thread. :-popcorn:

02-06-2016, 04:13 PM	#4
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,674 Original Poster	Originally posted by bertwert I agree with you. You could always ignore those users but can you boriscleto boriscleto? He he. No, I don't have an "ignore list"... I have a watch list. ---------- Post added 02-06-2016 at 11:15 PM ---------- Originally posted by monochrome There are two people on this Forum it is unwise to call out in a thread. :-popcorn: I appreciate your comment, but unwise how? I don't think the behaviour is appropriate. The thread is there for anyone to read. I don't expect to be popular for saying something, but I get a little tired of discourteous conduct wherever I see it. *EDIT: Sorry, I took that comment a bit seriously, then read your "popcorn" signature... LOL* Last edited by BigMackCam; 02-06-2016 at 04:22 PM.

02-06-2016, 04:15 PM	#5
bertwert Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Golden, BC Posts: 15,173	Originally posted by BigMackCam He he. No, I don't have an "ignore list"... I have a watch list. I don't ignore people either, sometimes the stupidness (not in this case though) makes me smile.

02-06-2016, 04:18 PM	#6
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,674 Original Poster	Originally posted by bertwert I don't ignore people either, sometimes the stupidness (not in this case though) makes me smile. Yes, me too. Me too.

02-06-2016, 04:20 PM	#7
Unregistered User 8 Closed Account Join Date: Mar 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,694	Originally posted by BigMackCam I love this forum - I really do. I enjoy the wide range of discussions, I've learned so much, and I've been helped by many other forum members. I'm genuinely grateful for this. But a small proportion of posts I see are unnecessarily caustic. Usually I just let it go, but this time, no. I also agree BigMackCam. This forum is huge with so many different cultures and many members don't have English as their 1st language. That said. free speech is very important. What I find offensive, others may not. I think we must trust the moderators to weed out the truly nasty posts but still allow for a difference of opinion. PS. It is very difficult taking photographs in a crash helmet !!!

02-06-2016, 04:26 PM	#8
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,674 Original Poster	Originally posted by pjv I also agree BigMackCam. This forum is huge with so many different cultures and many members don't have English as their 1st language. That said. free speech is very important. What I find offensive, others may not. I think we must trust the moderators to weed out the truly nasty posts but still allow for a difference of opinion. PS. It is very difficult taking photographs in a crash helmet !!! You make a good point - what's offensive to one person may not be offensive to another. Given the range of members we have here, I'm always conscious that what I say could be taken in different ways. Don't get me wrong, I'm happy to have a friendly argument with someone - disagreement isn't a problem. And free speech is most certainly important. But so is being nice to each other. The milk of human kindness, and all that. And if I can't find anything constructive to say (which may, sometimes, be in constructive disagreement), I say nothing... or, at least, I try to - but sometimes my mouth gets the better of me!

02-06-2016, 05:02 PM - 1 Like	#9
Unregistered User 8 Closed Account Join Date: Mar 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,694	Originally posted by BigMackCam Given the range of members we have here, I'm always conscious that what I say could be taken in different ways. This is very important. I also have concerns about participating in some threads. Then I remembered the emoji's. I think they are there for exactly this reason. A smile, laugh, frown etc are universal whereas words are not. Words can be daggers, but tempered with the correct emoji, the right meaning can be seen.

02-06-2016, 06:46 PM	#10
Mr. Ed Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 563	I didn't read the thread but I agree with you completely. Seems it would have been easier to not reply if they had no interest in the lens. Many people on this site have varied interest and things that might not interest me are sometimes interesting to others. Much talent on this site.

02-06-2016, 06:49 PM - 2 Likes	#11
Rupert Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 25,123	I agree with your post.....and try not to be cross with others here or insulting.......or instigate trouble.....and sometimes fail. I work at not failing....Otis...not so much, but he does mean well....I think? When I started this thread I stepped on a lot of toes, but it is as true today as it was then.... https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/132-pentaxian-lounge/301157-ugly-posters-...post-here.html Ugliness comes in many shades and failure to recognize the work of others is one of those that is still seriously abused at PForums. When people interact with each other they become friends, and friends treat their friends with some dignity. Otis has enough friends that he can take chances.....I don't, so I have to try my hardest to get along and not rock the boat. It's not that hard, this is a nice Forum with tons of great members. If you can't get along here you most likely have a real problem. Regards!

02-06-2016, 07:41 PM	#12
Unregistered User 8 Closed Account Join Date: Mar 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,694	Originally posted by Rupert If you can't get along here you most likely have a real problem. Amen.

02-06-2016, 09:24 PM - 3 Likes	#13
csa Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Montana mountains Posts: 10,133	Originally posted by pjv I think we must trust the moderators to weed out the truly nasty posts but still allow for a difference of opinion. We can also help the Moderators by reporting posts that are truly nasty, etc. by clicking the yellow triangle at the left/bottom of posts.

02-06-2016, 09:46 PM	#14
csa Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Montana mountains Posts: 10,133	Originally posted by pjv This is very important. I also have concerns about participating in some threads. Then I remembered the emoji's. I think they are there for exactly this reason. A smile, laugh, frown etc are universal whereas words are not. Words can be daggers, but tempered with the correct emoji, the right meaning can be seen. Very well said, and very true!

02-06-2016, 10:56 PM - 2 Likes	#15
alamo5000 Pentaxian Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 2,962	I agree with the overall meaning of your post. For sure. There is no need to be unjustly rude. Most of the posters here, upwards of 90%+ all have their quirks and personalities but those same people I have found are very polite and open to discussion. That said among the select few that are thin skinned and/or rude they come out swinging sometimes for no apparent reason. Overall though I think this forum is good and is full of people who have patience. For example for me sometimes all the same things get rehashed here over and over again and sometimes it kind of makes me roll my eyes. Basically some topics have been beaten to death and with those I just refrain from participation. Sometimes people just want to be obtuse. Then there is the 'new guy/girl' who posts the 'what lens should I buy' thread... with those it's a different story because even though we've been asked 900 times, that might be the first time that person asked. They might be new and have a genuine question and I personally don't want to turn anyone off of photography because of my attitude. If anything, even though I am far from being a good shooter I want to be a good mentor and friend to whoever that new guy/girl might be. Again though I will reiterate the 90-10 rule here. 90% of the people are extremely cordial towards each other. 10% though can get on the fringes. Threads like this though are a good reminder from time to time that there is a no @ss**** rule here so fortunately that stuff doesn't get too much out of control for the most part. Plus the mods are generally pretty good about not letting people stir things up too much.