Can I customize whitebalance in camera with a grey card

dkittle · 12-11-2008, 10:14 AM

Ok, I should really be reading the manual but have a shoot tonight and, in looking at some test shots from last night, have a bit of an orange cast being given off my a softbox I'd like to use tonight.

I have an 18% grey card with me and I'm wondering if I can set the whitebalance in camera using the grey card and a test shot. I know I can take a photo of the grey card and then use lightroom to get the correct temp and apply that to the pictures, but it's easier if I just do it in camera.

Thanks!
Don

Marc Sabatella · 12-11-2008, 10:27 AM

Yes. Go to the WB menu, the "custom" setting at the bottom, and ht the right arrow to set a new custom wb. It will prompt you to shoot a picture of your card, and if it is able to successfully set a white balance from that, it will say OK (otherwise it says NG for "no good" and you'll have to try again). Once you've set that as your custom wb, you can keep reusing that setting in the future without shooting the grey card again, assuming you'll be using tht same lighting setup.

dkittle · 12-11-2008, 12:05 PM

Marc, thanks for the info!

BBear · 12-11-2008, 12:42 PM

Isnt a 18% Grey Card different than a WB Card?

I thought 18% grey cards were for exposure balancing.. and WB Cards for, well, white balancing.

Could someone clarify?

RBellavance · 12-11-2008, 12:52 PM

The K10D manual clearly states that a white object (eg. piece of paper) should be used for setting custom white-balance. I don't believe an 18% grey card will give correct results.

dkittle · 12-11-2008, 12:58 PM

So, I admit to having seen the custom WB option in the WB menu, but never thought about using it until my 'emergency' today.

Like you, BBear, I knew about using the grey card for exposure, but never thought about it for WB. Then at a Toronto Pentaxian get together last month, Alfisti wanders over to my camera bag and asks if he can customize his WB off of a grey card clipped to the outside of the bag. Well, I got distracted and forgot to ask him about it, but apparently the card is good for both.

BBear · 12-11-2008, 01:37 PM

Originally posted by dkittle

So, I admit to having seen the custom WB option in the WB menu, but never thought about using it until my 'emergency' today.

Like you, BBear, I knew about using the grey card for exposure, but never thought about it for WB. Then at a Toronto Pentaxian get together last month, Alfisti wanders over to my camera bag and asks if he can customize his WB off of a grey card clipped to the outside of the bag. Well, I got distracted and forgot to ask him about it, but apparently the card is good for both.

I know how to use the custom WB, which is not hard at all.

The thing that i am confused is how you gonna use a grey card instead of a white card to set WB!

I know there are fancy WB / Exposures cards in the market, with 18% grey and pure white on the back... and even some focusing/contrasting adjustments...

But using a 18% Grey card sounds a bit wrong...

Could you please do the custom WB using the card and report results?

Thanks

alohadave · 12-11-2008, 01:50 PM

I typically don't bother setting a custom white balance. I find the closest preset and adjust in Lightroom if needed. It's trivially easy to set it after the fact.

If you are in a tricky lighting situation, you'll probably need to do some correction afterward anyway.

One trick is to use a translucent Pringles lid and set your Custom White Balance with it held over the lens.

dkittle · 12-11-2008, 02:03 PM

BBear, my 'card' is grey on one side and white on the other. I'll experiment tonight and report back on this thread. Hopefully my model doesn't come out with gargoyle-green skin :-)

AlohaDave, I agree with you about having to do corrections after the fact. I shot in an old brick-building area of town last summer and got a slightly different color cast from every building!

BBear · 12-11-2008, 02:24 PM

Originally posted by dkittle

BBear, my 'card' is grey on one side and white on the other.

Ha ha ha!

I am almost sure your friend used the white side of your card to adjust the WB... and not the grey side!

Left nut on the table on that one!

kjfaust · 12-11-2008, 02:28 PM

on my k100d super
i always set my custom WB on gray objects

at first when i read the manual, i was trying to set it on white objects like a bond of paper but for some reason its not working

but it seems to always work on gray objects

dkittle · 12-11-2008, 02:35 PM

Ah BBear, a simplification on my part.

My 'card' folds up like a reflector and is grey on one side, white on the other. It was actually in it's pouch at the time that Alfisti used it, which is black on one side and 18% grey on the other. I thought it was eaiser to leave the long winded story out of it, but obviously it just served to confuse the issue :-)

Cheerios, Don

BBear · 12-11-2008, 02:39 PM

don,

I dunno what to say. My left nut's on the line!!!!

Again, please do a quick experiment: white card, auto, grey card and post us the results!

emalvick · 12-11-2008, 03:16 PM

Here's the deal...

White balance shouldn't need white. It just doesn't need color. Anything gray or white will work for getting the white balance. All you are trying to do is correct the color cast and not specifically brightness or levels.

Afterall, very few things are truly white anyway. Just go to your local Staples, Office Max, or whatever office store and see how many varieties of "white" paper there are and the varying brightness they advertise.

flyer · 12-11-2008, 04:27 PM

Originally posted by emalvick

White balance shouldn't need white. It just doesn't need color. Anything gray or white will work for getting the white balance.

Your gray card needs to be a neutral grey (i.e. no color cast). Same thing for white card. Take sheets of paper of different type and place them side by side, and you won't find two sheets with the same "white". You have to be careful with what you use to set color temp. After all, newsprint is white, but I wouldn't use it to set white balance.

12-11-2008, 10:14 AM	#1
dkittle Inactive Account Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Toronto, Ontario Photos: Gallery Posts: 429	Can I customize whitebalance in camera with a grey card Ok, I should really be reading the manual but have a shoot tonight and, in looking at some test shots from last night, have a bit of an orange cast being given off my a softbox I'd like to use tonight. I have an 18% grey card with me and I'm wondering if I can set the whitebalance in camera using the grey card and a test shot. I know I can take a photo of the grey card and then use lightroom to get the correct temp and apply that to the pictures, but it's easier if I just do it in camera. Thanks! Don

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12-11-2008, 10:27 AM	#2
Marc Sabatella Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Denver, CO Photos: Gallery Posts: 10,685	Yes. Go to the WB menu, the "custom" setting at the bottom, and ht the right arrow to set a new custom wb. It will prompt you to shoot a picture of your card, and if it is able to successfully set a white balance from that, it will say OK (otherwise it says NG for "no good" and you'll have to try again). Once you've set that as your custom wb, you can keep reusing that setting in the future without shooting the grey card again, assuming you'll be using tht same lighting setup.

12-11-2008, 12:05 PM	#3
dkittle Inactive Account Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Toronto, Ontario Photos: Gallery Posts: 429 Original Poster	Marc, thanks for the info!

12-11-2008, 12:42 PM	#4
BBear Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: CT / NY Photos: Gallery Posts: 822	Isnt a 18% Grey Card different than a WB Card? I thought 18% grey cards were for exposure balancing.. and WB Cards for, well, white balancing. Could someone clarify?

12-11-2008, 12:52 PM	#5
RBellavance Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Near Montréal, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,716	The K10D manual clearly states that a white object (eg. piece of paper) should be used for setting custom white-balance. I don't believe an 18% grey card will give correct results.

12-11-2008, 12:58 PM	#6
dkittle Inactive Account Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Toronto, Ontario Photos: Gallery Posts: 429 Original Poster	So, I admit to having seen the custom WB option in the WB menu, but never thought about using it until my 'emergency' today. Like you, BBear, I knew about using the grey card for exposure, but never thought about it for WB. Then at a Toronto Pentaxian get together last month, Alfisti wanders over to my camera bag and asks if he can customize his WB off of a grey card clipped to the outside of the bag. Well, I got distracted and forgot to ask him about it, but apparently the card is good for both.

12-11-2008, 01:37 PM	#7
BBear Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: CT / NY Photos: Gallery Posts: 822	Originally posted by dkittle So, I admit to having seen the custom WB option in the WB menu, but never thought about using it until my 'emergency' today. Like you, BBear, I knew about using the grey card for exposure, but never thought about it for WB. Then at a Toronto Pentaxian get together last month, Alfisti wanders over to my camera bag and asks if he can customize his WB off of a grey card clipped to the outside of the bag. Well, I got distracted and forgot to ask him about it, but apparently the card is good for both. I know how to use the custom WB, which is not hard at all. The thing that i am confused is how you gonna use a grey card instead of a white card to set WB! I know there are fancy WB / Exposures cards in the market, with 18% grey and pure white on the back... and even some focusing/contrasting adjustments... But using a 18% Grey card sounds a bit wrong... Could you please do the custom WB using the card and report results? Thanks

12-11-2008, 01:50 PM	#8
alohadave Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Quincy, MA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,024	I typically don't bother setting a custom white balance. I find the closest preset and adjust in Lightroom if needed. It's trivially easy to set it after the fact. If you are in a tricky lighting situation, you'll probably need to do some correction afterward anyway. One trick is to use a translucent Pringles lid and set your Custom White Balance with it held over the lens.

12-11-2008, 02:03 PM	#9
dkittle Inactive Account Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Toronto, Ontario Photos: Gallery Posts: 429 Original Poster	BBear, my 'card' is grey on one side and white on the other. I'll experiment tonight and report back on this thread. Hopefully my model doesn't come out with gargoyle-green skin :-) AlohaDave, I agree with you about having to do corrections after the fact. I shot in an old brick-building area of town last summer and got a slightly different color cast from every building!

12-11-2008, 02:24 PM	#10
BBear Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: CT / NY Photos: Gallery Posts: 822	Originally posted by dkittle BBear, my 'card' is grey on one side and white on the other. Ha ha ha! I am almost sure your friend used the white side of your card to adjust the WB... and not the grey side! Left nut on the table on that one!

12-11-2008, 02:28 PM	#11
kjfaust Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: maryland Posts: 104	on my k100d super i always set my custom WB on gray objects at first when i read the manual, i was trying to set it on white objects like a bond of paper but for some reason its not working but it seems to always work on gray objects

12-11-2008, 02:35 PM	#12
dkittle Inactive Account Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Toronto, Ontario Photos: Gallery Posts: 429 Original Poster	Ah BBear, a simplification on my part. My 'card' folds up like a reflector and is grey on one side, white on the other. It was actually in it's pouch at the time that Alfisti used it, which is black on one side and 18% grey on the other. I thought it was eaiser to leave the long winded story out of it, but obviously it just served to confuse the issue :-) Cheerios, Don

12-11-2008, 02:39 PM	#13
BBear Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: CT / NY Photos: Gallery Posts: 822	don, I dunno what to say. My left nut's on the line!!!! Again, please do a quick experiment: white card, auto, grey card and post us the results!

12-11-2008, 03:16 PM	#14
emalvick Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Davis, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,642	Here's the deal... White balance shouldn't need white. It just doesn't need color. Anything gray or white will work for getting the white balance. All you are trying to do is correct the color cast and not specifically brightness or levels. Afterall, very few things are truly white anyway. Just go to your local Staples, Office Max, or whatever office store and see how many varieties of "white" paper there are and the varying brightness they advertise.

12-11-2008, 04:27 PM	#15
flyer Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Ste-Anne des Plaines, Qc., Canada Posts: 2,013	Originally posted by emalvick White balance shouldn't need white. It just doesn't need color. Anything gray or white will work for getting the white balance. Your gray card needs to be a neutral grey (i.e. no color cast). Same thing for white card. Take sheets of paper of different type and place them side by side, and you won't find two sheets with the same "white". You have to be careful with what you use to set color temp. After all, newsprint is white, but I wouldn't use it to set white balance.