monitor suggestions anyone?

*NaClH2O* · 11-01-2007, 12:35 PM

It looks like my monitor is starting to go. Well, not the monitor, but actually the power supply. Unfortunately I own a fairly old Sun Microsystems 21" analog CRT monitor and I doubt I can find a power supply for it. Therefore: I'm in the market for a new monitor, and I'd like some suggestions. I haven't been following the technology of monitors in some years so I have no idea whether or not I should get a CRT or a LCD. I do want at least the same screen size as my old Sun.
I have a few quesitons:
Is it still true that you cannot change the resolution of a digital LCD monitor? Does that make a difference?

Is it easier to calibrate a digital monitor or an analog one?

What kind of price should I expect to pay for a decent 21" analog? How about the equivalent digital? And by decent I mean upper mid level, not top of the line graphic arts machine, nor bargan basement clunk either.

NaCl(any help greatly appreciated)H2O

little laker · 11-01-2007, 12:49 PM

Just my $0.02 worth Salty,

My system is HP everything, and it was pretty much calibrated right from the factory.

When I upgrade my screen I'll probably stick to HP, and I'd be surprised if it isn't close right from the box again.

I'm not suggesting that you buy an HP, I'm suggesting that you look into what your computer manufacture recommends.
That way with a little luck you won't have to calibrate a thing

konraDarnok · 11-01-2007, 12:54 PM

Sony GDM-FW900. Finest monitor ever made. Period. Bar-none. Huge. Heavy. Not for faint of heart.

I got a fairly decent deal on eBay a couple of years ago -- makes a good HDTV too.

*NaClH2O* · 11-01-2007, 01:18 PM

Originally Posted by little laker

Just my $0.02 worth Salty,

My system is HP everything, and it was pretty much calibrated right from the factory.

When I upgrade my screen I'll probably stick to HP, and I'd be surprised if it isn't close right from the box again.

I'm not suggesting that you buy an HP, I'm suggesting that you look into what your computer manufacture recommends.
That way with a little luck you won't have to calibrate a thing

Hi Stu
Since I built my own rig, that's not terribly helpful as the manufacturer's recommendation is:
"I haven't a clue"

NaCl(and unfortunately there are very few "saltybuilt" monitors available!

)H2O

imadethis · 11-01-2007, 01:30 PM

A lot of great questions there NaClH20, I would highly suggest investing in a LCD monitor either from Apple, Hanns*G, Dell, or Samsung to name a few. CRT's are old technology and although they used to be able to display a large gamut of color, the technology for today's LCD's has surpassed CRT's.

little laker, it does not matter if you stick to computer brands because your monitor will still go out of profile right out of the box. All monitors constantly change in color hence the reason for purchasing a colorimeter. Also, CRT's need calibration more often than LCD's and calibrating one is no more difficult than calibrating the other.

The most important thing along purchasing a monitor is purchasing a colorimeter to calibrate your monitor. Adobe gamma is not a substitute for hardware calibration.

Resolution can be changed for LCD's, but their maximum resolution cannot. Some LCD's are 22" but have a small resolution, so when you shop for one, you'll need to compare these.

I recently went through the same dilema replacing my old 21" Sony Trinitron with a new LCD, and the difference between them is like night and day. Most notably, I saw the difference in contrast throughout the range of colors. There's a rebate going on with the 22" widescreen HDMI Hanns*G HG216D if you search around for 200 AR.

If you'd like more information, check out my blog at:Out with the CRT and in the LCD

chrisman · 11-01-2007, 02:56 PM

When I decided to upgrade from my Mitsubishi DiamondPlus CRT I settled on the Samsung SyncMaster 226BW (22" FP) and I've been delighted with its performance.

I also use a colorimeter (Spyder) which is essential if you want to get the best out of your monitor.

SpecialK · 11-01-2007, 10:02 PM

I recently got a Samsung 216BW LCD that is pretty nice, replacing a Viewsonic 22" CRT.

I've only ever used on-line calibration tests on my monitors. They have always passed all the tests (white ---> black gradations, etc, with essentially no tweaking, and everyone's images here look fine (and mine blend right in fine in another forum I post in). Shrug. However, this Samsung is really bright, so I have the brightness turned to zero. And, the other "pre-set" modes, such as "gaming"or "internet" are even brighter.

It has the DVI option but I'm on analog with this box.

After switching monitors, my trusty Pentax Photo Browser and Photo Lab (smirk) do not operate as before. The preview is dingy and dim. After I convert a RAW image, however, then change a setting (even just clicking the rotation checkbox), the preview brightens up and looks right. And Photoshop indicates the profile is bad. That is the only problem I have with it. I suppose I'll try the setup yet again some day.

Widescreen is definitely a plus.

konraDarnok · 11-02-2007, 08:51 AM

CRT's are old technology and although they used to be able to display a large gamut of color, the technology for today's LCD's has surpassed CRT's.

No freaking way. You don't know what you're talking about.

Most notably, I saw the difference in contrast throughout the range of colors.

This is a bad thing. LCDs have less dynamic range; that's why you see "contrast" -- it's like posterizing a picture in photoshop.

DO NOT buy a CRT monitor - they can not come close to the clarity, resolution and brightness of a good LCD.

Not true. My CRT has a native resolution of 2,304 x 1,440

I'm not totally advocating CRTs. They are heavy and draw lots of power. If I didn't already own the best CRT ever made, I would go with LCD myself. But don't feed the dude nonsense about color and resolution -- it simply isn't true. Trust me, I happen to know much more about graphics than I do photography -- it's what I do for a living, and there isn't a LCD out there that can out perform an excellent quality CRT in terms of color and resolution.

Clarity on the other hand? I'd say any good LCD is better for everyday activities like reading text -- they are much easier on the eyes. But they don't display photos as well -- they just don't.

I too would go with LCD right now -- the price and sizes are very attractive. But he did mention CRTs. If you even consider CRT, go with a good used Sony GDM-FW900 -- it's leaps and bounds above other CRTs as well. The thing cost over 5000 dollars new and can be had for less than 250 now if you look around.

*NaClH2O* · 11-02-2007, 10:17 AM

Originally Posted by konraDarnok

snip
I too would go with LCD right now -- the price and sizes are very attractive. But he did mention CRTs. If you even consider CRT, go with a good used Sony GDM-FW900 -- it's leaps and bounds above other CRTs as well. The thing cost over 5000 dollars new and can be had for less than 250 now if you look around.

Actually I wouldn't be in the market for a new monitor at all if it weren't for the fact that my Sun is heading south. It is a VERY good monitor. More dynamic range and better color nuances than ANY digital monitor I've ever seen. I bought it 2nd hand over 7 years ago for a mere $100. The best money I've ever spent on any computer component. I'd go with another CRT if I could find a good one for a good price. Unfortunately, people are holding on to the because so few new ones are being made.

NaCl(like some of that excellent old pentax glass)H2O

konraDarnok · 11-02-2007, 11:12 AM

Actually, I think the high-end Suns were Sony Trinitrons. You may have the last high-end 4:3 monitor. Mine is the last (and only really) 10:16 monitor. They don't really make CRTs anymore -- I know Sony doesn't.

Well in case you're interested.

This is Sun's Version: GDM-90W10

This is HPs Version: A7217A

And this is the Original Sony Version: GDM-FW900

They are all the same monitor. I happen to have the HP one. It's 24" corner to corner, weighs close to 100 pounds, is approx. 2.5' wide, 2' high, and 2' deep.

If you could find one on ebay for less than 200 bucks and it's within driving distance of where you live to remove shipping costs, and you could test it out to make sure it's still sharp, and you don't mind having a HUGE friggen monitor, I promise you this thing will be as good if not better than your Sun.

That all said. LCDs are getting better, they use way less power, are easier to stare out for hours on end, and they have a much smaller foot print. You know all this, but I don't think LCDs are up to muster when it comes to color and dynamic range yet.

If anybody has a link or review proving me wrong, I'd be very much interested in reading it.

imadethis · 11-02-2007, 04:29 PM

konraDarnok, there's no need for personal attacks here.

For color, LCD's are now 8-bit in depth being able to display 16.7 milllion colors the equivalent to a CRT. 5 years ago, LCD's may have faired differently when compared to CRT's in many aspects.

CRT's are getting old now, so finding a used CRT will most likely have tube degradation in it equating to a degradation in display. I would not suggest purchasing a used one due to their age. If the CRT works now, will it still be working a few years from now? After all of my years of use of my Sony, it just couldn't perform the way it used to.

Yes, the high end CRT's are amazing, but at such a huge price tag it's just not sensible for the average user. With the current time and age, you can find LCD's which will perform just fine for photographers for a great price.

Link: CRT vs. LCD Monitors: Which Monitor is the Best to Buy?

konraDarnok · 11-02-2007, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by imadethis

konraDarnok, there's no need for personal attacks here.

For color, LCD's are now 8-bit in depth being able to display 16.7 milllion colors the equivalent to a CRT. 5 years ago, LCD's may have faired differently when compared to CRT's in many aspects.

CRT's are getting old now, so finding a used CRT will most likely have tube degradation in it equating to a degradation in display. I would not suggest purchasing a used one due to their age. If the CRT works now, will it still be working a few years from now? After all of my years of use of my Sony, it just couldn't perform the way it used to.

Yes, the high end CRT's are amazing, but at such a huge price tag it's just not sensible for the average user. With the current time and age, you can find LCD's which will perform just fine for photographers for a great price.

Link: CRT vs. LCD Monitors: Which Monitor is the Best to Buy?

You shouldn't take it personally dude. But I believe the statement below is inaccurate.

CRT's are old technology and although they used to be able to display a large gamut of color, the technology for today's LCD's has surpassed CRT's.

I agree with the rest of your post.

imadethis · 11-02-2007, 06:20 PM

No worries, you are correct in that I should have said LCD color has caught up to CRT's, but in respect to the technology put into the LCD's has surpassed CRT's. Thanks.

Originally Posted by konraDarnok

You shouldn't take it personally dude. But I believe the statement below is inaccurate.

CRT's are old technology and although they used to be able to display a large gamut of color, the technology for today's LCD's has surpassed CRT's.

I agree with the rest of your post.

*NaClH2O* · 11-03-2007, 04:39 AM

Originally Posted by imadethis

snip

For color, LCD's are now 8-bit in depth being able to display 16.7 milllion colors the equivalent to a CRT. 5 years ago, LCD's may have faired differently when compared to CRT's in many aspects.

I agree with the rest of your post, but the above statement isn't correct. My Sun monitor, being analog, is capable of displaying nearly an infinite variety of color. I would say infinite range of color, but that is unmeasurable, but nearly infinite is pretty close. I've got my graphics card (a decent 3yr old ATI) set at it's highest level; 32 million colors, and my monitor has nary a problem with that. However my power supply is going, and unfortunately the day when you could go to a computer swap meet and pick up a very good 21" CRT are gone. There are still some CRT's being made for the graphics industry, but they are close to 1K by the time you factor in shipping, that's a fair bit above my buget.

NaCl(but if I hit the lotto........)H2O

**J.Scott** · 11-03-2007, 05:52 AM

This type of question gets asked here and on most other forums on a daily basis; what lens, camera, bag, memory card and yes, even what monitor should I get? The responses are not usually technically correct or even accurate depictions of items noted, but rather they are opinions of the poster. And to quote 'Benjikan', "... opinions are like a$$holes - everyone has one."

I am not sure what you expected to hear or even what you need to hear but the short answer is if you need in-depth technical information I would kindly and politely suggest you do your own homework. Read manufacturer websites for specifications and then research sites like Cnet for more (hopefully) unbiased reviews. Members on forums sites will offer their opinions usually based on a personal purchase. They will (usually) defend their purchase of a certain item because it is just human nature. "I bought model XYZ and it is a great monitor." That is easier to say then, "I just blew $350 on a piece of crap monitor."

Of course, after you complete your online research I would humbly suggest you go to retail outlets and actually see the monitor. Your eyes (and possibly your wallet) will be the final decision maker in this case.

I guess my point is that there are literally dozens and possibly hundreds of choices for a monitor today. It is just too broad of a question for this type of forum.

I wish you good luck in your endeavors.