Oly... answer - micro 4/3 - Page 3

Art Vandelay II · 06-08-2009, 02:40 PM

I think I like Samsungs actual prototype more then that more than that CG mock up. I love retro and all, but that mock up takes it too far. For example; why would anyone want the LCD to stick out from the body instead of making it flush with the body? The Samsung prototype is nowhere near as cool looking as the Olympus EP-1, but it does look more functional. We still don't know if the EP-1 has an aperture control dial...if it doesn't I'm sure that will be a deal breaker for any enthusiast looking for a small camera to go along with their SLR. Samsung just needs to borrow some styling cues from their NV24 compact and they could easily out do Olympus.

But I keep reading Pentax/Samsung on here. According to interviews I've read Samsung is going in alone on this system, which I think is a mistake by both Samsung & Pentax. This is why I'm more excited about m4/3's than I am the Samsung NX. IMHO Samsung needs Pentax just like Panasonic needs Olympus. Samsung and Panasonic may be electronics powerhouses, but their names don't carry a lot of weight in the photography world. But partnering up with great camera/lens makers like Olympus & Pentax is a sure fire way to get accepted and ease photographers worries about lens quality/selection.

nathancombs · 06-08-2009, 03:51 PM

Pentax HAS a good small camera w/ interchangeable lenes just make it a digital

*Light_Horseman* · 06-08-2009, 05:25 PM

At the rate technology is miniaturizing, I'm sure A K1000/ME size Pentax DSLR is only a few years away.

I really don't see the need to jump on this purely because of size!

MikePerham · 06-08-2009, 05:49 PM

Originally Posted by cateto

In my book there are clearly two key cameras this year: one is the K-7, and the other is the Olympus E-P1. I would love to buy both, although these are not ideal days to spend loads of money on cameras.

I agree, and what they both have in common is they both go back to their roots. The E-P1 to the Olympus Pen and the K-7 seems to me to be a digital LX.

MikePerham · 06-08-2009, 05:58 PM

Originally Posted by nathancombs

Pentax HAS a good small camera w/ interchangeable lenes just make it a digital

Nice little camera that used the 110 cassette system that never took off ...notice Pentax never repeated the mistake with APS.

I suspect if Pentax were to introduce a digital version of the auto110, it would have to have a sensor similar to that used in P&S cameras, and wouldn't compete with the image quality of 4/3 systems ...4/3 is about as small as I would want to go for a sensor.

As much as everyone liked the Auto 110, it never sold well, but the 1/2 frame Oly Pen did. I suspect the same results would happen in the digital era with their modern digital counterparts.

*er1kksen* · 06-08-2009, 07:50 PM

Art, it's been confirmed that there is a control dial on the right-hand-side (you can see it in the photo from the side) which would presumably control aperture in A mode (in P it would shift the program, S control shutter, M control either aperture or shutter switching when you press the exp. comp. button).

As much as I'd rather have a small camera with something like the samsung 14mp sensor than the panasonic 12mp sensor, I really don't like the look of the NX concept. It really is just a pared down DSLR with no mirror box. The zoom lenses displayed so far look huge compared to the m4/3 lenses we've seen so far. If I can't stick it in my pocket, then I'd rather have a K-7. If a pocketable large-sensor compact like this one doesn't emerge from samsung sooner or later, I'll buy the E-P1 or one of its successors. No big loss, I like Olympus too.

*Votesh* · 06-08-2009, 11:48 PM

I have quite a different outlook on the target market of these cameras. I'd venture to guess that a good portion of the people that buy Rebels, D40s and higher end bridge cameras are very much swayed by impulse/brand appeal. In the store the buy is probably largely based on the salesperson's preference/effectiveness as well as the buying impulse. Online the buy is probably motivated largely by brand appeal.

The two people I know that have Rebels are actually college photography majors, funny enough. That said, they don't seem to be the types that would do much research and rather just buy what someone "in the know" told them to buy. I'm pretty sure they won't even hear about the E-P1.

For those that do their research, the new Oly might be appealing if it fits their wants and price range. With a rumored initial msrp of near $1000 I find it hard to believe that it will often edge out cameras that can be had for much cheaper, even if they are larger, or not quite as capable.

I see it as more of an enthusiast camera than anything. It's features will probably be nice, but for those that live outside the camera obsessed world that most of us reside in, I think it will be a hard sell. Higher end Olympus cameras aren't very prominently displayed, and at the rumored price I think many of those that do find out about this camera will pass it up for something else. I could be completely off though, and maybe every camera store, consumer electronics store, and internet retailer will be pushing these new, hybrid cameras.

Just my share of speculation. It sure is fun

Originally Posted by Art Vandelay II

Obviously my numbers are completely made up; this whole forum section is nothing but rumors, opinions, and wild speculation.

That said, judging by the success of the Canon Rebel, Nikon D40 and various higher end bridge cameras I'd say there are a great deal number of non-geeks that want better IQ with faster AF and are willing to spend over $500 to get it. My opinion on the matter (based on people I know with Rebels/D40's) is that most of those users would rather have something like the Oly EP-1. It just hasn't existed until now.

RMabo · 06-09-2009, 02:22 AM

>Seriously, if these leaked photos are real then this camera makes all entry level SLR's >look down right clunky, outdated, and even cheap in comparison. Can you imagine any >casual shooter choosing and SLR over one of these? I can't. SLR's will soon be relegated >to the realm of camera geeks, enthusiast and pros.

Well, the same could be said for the compact rangefinders - and while there were quite popular, SLR's was still the main choice. There is a market for both.

24x36 did not kill APS-C.
m4/3 will not kill APS-C.
There is room in the market for several systems.

thibs · 06-09-2009, 04:18 AM

IMO: if people want small, those m4/3 are a lot too pricey. Changing lens is also a "no way" for a lot of people.

Otherwise: they don't look alike anthing serious, since they are small. People will still buy low end DSLR just because it looks serious (even if dumb low end).

For serious photographers however, this is different. But for the mass market I just don't see those m4/3 (or Samsung kind) taking any major market share.

Samsungian · 06-09-2009, 07:08 AM

I did my BestBuy loop last weekend. While pricing new laptops I wandered over to Cameras section, as I always do. Lots of Olympus, Canon including 5D MarkII, Nikon including Nikon D700 &

Zero Pentax

Not everyone will be willing to drop $1,000 plus on a camera they cannot find locally. How will Pentax compete for this market: People who want to touch and buy locally? Supposedly my local Walmarts carry Pentax, but none exist in the store displays. You have to buy it online, pay the local fees, it gets delivered to the store for pickup.

As far as m4/3 Oly at $990 that also includes kit lens. The $1,299 K-7 is body only. K-7 is weathersealed with weather sealed lens only. I wonder what the weather sealed kit lenses will launch at price wise? Less than the last kit lens or more? For a newbie the weathersealed aspect of K-7 easily puts you at $1,500 to start, then add one additional lens over the WR kit lens and you over $2,000, add another WR lens and you're pushing $3,000...

Just like that.

Anyways I find the m4/3 Oly far more interesting than simply offering color choices on a low end dslr like White and Olive Drab

Drill down and the comparision shopper finds this:

E-3 for $1,249 versus K-7 with the HD people here complain about having included for $50 more:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...al_Camera.html

Originally Posted by Votesh

I have quite a different outlook on the target market of these cameras. I'd venture to guess that a good portion of the people that buy Rebels, D40s and higher end bridge cameras are very much swayed by impulse/brand appeal. In the store the buy is probably largely based on the salesperson's preference/effectiveness as well as the buying impulse. Online the buy is probably motivated largely by brand appeal.

The two people I know that have Rebels are actually college photography majors, funny enough. That said, they don't seem to be the types that would do much research and rather just buy what someone "in the know" told them to buy. I'm pretty sure they won't even hear about the E-P1.

For those that do their research, the new Oly might be appealing if it fits their wants and price range. With a rumored initial msrp of near $1000 I find it hard to believe that it will often edge out cameras that can be had for much cheaper, even if they are larger, or not quite as capable.

I see it as more of an enthusiast camera than anything. It's features will probably be nice, but for those that live outside the camera obsessed world that most of us reside in, I think it will be a hard sell. Higher end Olympus cameras aren't very prominently displayed, and at the rumored price I think many of those that do find out about this camera will pass it up for something else. I could be completely off though, and maybe every camera store, consumer electronics store, and internet retailer will be pushing these new, hybrid cameras.

Just my share of speculation. It sure is fun

Art Vandelay II · 06-09-2009, 08:48 AM

Originally Posted by Samsungian

I did my BestBuy loop last weekend. While pricing new laptops I wandered over to Cameras section, as I always do. Lots of Olympus, Canon including 5D MarkII, Nikon including Nikon D700 &

Zero Pentax

Not everyone will be willing to drop $1,000 plus on a camera they cannot find locally. How will Pentax compete for this market...

For a newbie the weathersealed aspect of K-7 easily puts you at $1,500 to start...

Anyways I find the m4/3 Oly far more interesting than simply offering color choices on a low end dslr like White and Olive Drab

I always make the rounds at Best Buy myself. I usually overhear the sales clerk pushing Canon more than any other brand. And I've often wondered how Pentax plans to compete with that. Then it finally dawned on me they're not trying to compete with that. They seem to be content living in a sub 10% market share spot. And that is fine so long as they remain profitable.

The K-7 is by no means a camera geared towards the masses. It's an enthusiast camera. Enthusiast will have no problem learning about it and finding one. They sure is shite wont look for advice from a 20 year old Best Buy employee on a $1300+ camera.

As far as Olympus goes, I think they'll be just fine. The main Wolf Camera here has (or had?) a huge Olympus section. Before Circuit City closed they also featured Olympus prominently, so someone will pick up that slack now. Best Buy carries a fair share of their cameras. Plus, my local store, Biggs Camera (which is excellent if you're anywhere near Charlotte), also has a prominent section of Olympus gear. Of course they also have Pentax Gear, but they tell me they cant sell it :-/

Also, love them or hate them people know all about DPR. And I don't know anyone that doesn't do a bit of online research these days before plunking down $600+ for a camera. So, I believe people will find out about the EP-1 no problem. Of course a few TV ads like I see Canon & Nikon run all the time wouldn't hurt either.

RMabo · 06-09-2009, 08:49 AM

I hardly believes that those in the market for a K-7 even thinks about comparing it to a Oly m4/3. The K-7 is a professional built APS-C with 100% optical viewfinder, 1/8000 shutter, fast autofocus even in low light and fast continous shooting and 14.6Mp sensor for those big wall-sized posters that Mr Ben here has showned off so great. Honestly, I have a hard time believing that the Oly m4/3 would be the choice for professionals - like the outdoor photographer selling photos to National Geographic, the typical wedding photographer or the fashion photograher a'la Mr Ben. It may surely be a great camera for consumers and casual shooters where stylie is more important than quality, but for advanced photo enthusiasts and professional photographers - I have a really hard time believing that the Oly m4/3 would make an impact in this high-end market segment, despite it's cuteness and range of available colours for the exterior look.

*redpigeons* · 06-09-2009, 09:01 AM

Originally Posted by RMabo

I hardly believes that those in the market for a K-7 even thinks about comparing it to a Oly m4/3. The K-7 is a professional built APS-C with 100% optical viewfinder, 1/8000 shutter, fast autofocus even in low light and fast continous shooting and 14.6Mp sensor for those big wall-sized posters that Mr Ben here has showned off so great. Honestly, I have a hard time believing that the Oly m4/3 would be the choice for professionals - like the outdoor photographer selling photos to National Geographic, the typical wedding photographer or the fashion photograher a'la Mr Ben. It may surely be a great camera for consumers and casual shooters where stylie is more important than quality, but for advanced photo enthusiasts and professional photographers - I have a really hard time believing that the Oly m4/3 would make an impact in this high-end market segment, despite it's cuteness and range of available colours for the exterior look.

it will be used for sure by street shooters and photojournalists .. these small hybrids are the perfect cameras for the job
the kit lens in the picture is a wide fast prime makes it even more perfect..
obviously those ppl were on olys mind when designing this camera

Art Vandelay II · 06-09-2009, 09:07 AM

I agree that its kind of odd comparing the K-7 and the EP-1, but thats exactly what I'm doing at the moment. I'm trying to decide if I want to keep my D200 and pick up the EP-1 to go along with it, or sell off my D200 and just buy the K-7 and use it as a jack of all trades camera.

I also agree that I don't think that m4/3's will be used by many pros, but neither will the K-7 for that matter. For every "Ben" using a K-7 there are 50 photogs using D700's/5D's/1D's/etc. I did read about some nature photographer that chose to use an Oly E-3 to travel around the world with recently. If the IQ is good enough for that, and they make a m4/3's body tough enough to stand up to pro rigors then never say never. I also read about a photo journalist in Iraq that got fed up with the bulk of DSLR's and switched to a Leica M8. I imagine if I were a photo journalist in the middle of a war I'd rather travel as light as possible myself so long as the camera can do what I need it to do.

*redpigeons* · 06-09-2009, 09:17 AM

Originally Posted by Art Vandelay II

I also read about a photo journalist in Iraq that got fed up with the bulk of DSLR's and switched to a Leica M8.

I think photojournalists in Iraq started with leica and probably still sticking with leica

if you saw this week the anne curry Iran movie on CBS (if I am not mistaken)

she had a beautiful leica M8 on her the all time