Stop using plastic - Page 4

*graphicgr8s* · 11-02-2009, 09:12 AM

Gee why not just use paper bags? All the wood pulp comes from managed forests. And most kraft paper is from waste from other processes. Plus it is biodegradable. And is great as a mulch for veggie gardening. Hmm. Novel idea ain't it.

*graphicgr8s* · 11-02-2009, 09:15 AM

Originally Posted by Ratmagiclady

Or just a plain old 'Those darn liberals can't make me respect my surroundings and my kids' future, recycling's a hardship, so I'm darn well gonna just take out the trash five times as much!

So there are no conservative conservationists? Interesting to say the least. Or is this just another of your conservative bashings? Funny thing I am a Conservative. And I recycle as much as I can. And I try to get my customers to print on recycled whenever possible. And I do a heck of a lot of work for recycling companies. Go figure.

*Blue* · 11-02-2009, 12:05 PM

Meriam-Webster definition of Conservation is as follows.

Main Entry: con·ser·va·tion
Pronunciation: \ˌkän(t)-sər-ˈvā-shən\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Middle French, from Latin conservation-, conservatio, from conservare
Date: 14th century

1 : a careful preservation and protection of something; especially : planned management of a natural resource to prevent exploitation, destruction, or neglect

2 : the preservation of a physical quantity during transformations or reactions

The way some people act, one would think there was a political affiliation associated with it, but clearly there is not.

Mike L · 11-02-2009, 03:05 PM

Originally Posted by jct us101

Sorry but showing photos of something that could or couldn't have been caused by using plastic isn't going to change my mind about it. I really hate it when guilt trips are used to try and prove a point.

Obviously you looked at the photos but are you suggesting the birds all laid down on piles of plastic and died (maybe the little piles of plastic looked like a nice spot for a rest and they were hit by bolts of lightening) or do you think that the birds had a belly full of plastic and something else (possibly lightening) killed them?

*ve2vfd* · 11-02-2009, 04:38 PM

Originally Posted by graphicgr8s

Gee why not just use paper bags? All the wood pulp comes from managed forests. And most kraft paper is from waste from other processes. Plus it is biodegradable. And is great as a mulch for veggie gardening. Hmm. Novel idea ain't it.

I'm all for paper bags, the problem is that stores don't like them as they are much more expensive than plastic bags...

Around here the re-usable bag (large canvas or heavy duty woven plastic bag with webbing handles) is king. I'll admit I kind of like it as it carries a lot more than cheap plastic and thanks to the large webbing handles is a lot easier to carry than paper.

There is something to be said about those bags when even Walmart has jumped on board voluntarily.

Did he just say "voluntarily"??? Yup, you heard right there is no law against disposable plastic bags in most cities here... merchants just thought it was a good idea and most gave them up. A few still have disposable bags, but they encourage you to use re-usable bags by asking you if you really need a bag. It's amazing how many people (including myself) won't take a bag when given the choice.

Pat

PS: My old job was inspector for the city's Dept of Environment, and amongst other things part of my job was to oversee the garbage and recycling collection contracts... part of the reason most recyclers won't take disposable plastic bags is that they get stuck in and gum up the conveyors in sorting equipment at the plant.

jct us101 · 11-02-2009, 05:01 PM

Originally Posted by Mike L

Obviously you looked at the photos but are you suggesting the birds all laid down on piles of plastic and died (maybe the little piles of plastic looked like a nice spot for a rest and they were hit by bolts of lightening) or do you think that the birds had a belly full of plastic and something else (possibly lightening) killed them?

I don't expect how seeing that is going to make me suddenly want to drastically change my life. I'm sorry, but even if that sounds totally heartless, we rely on plastic for so many things, and it just really sucks for the birds. Not that I don't feel terrible about it or sorry for them, but I hate it when people use guilt trips like that to try and change something.

*Ratmagiclady* · 11-02-2009, 05:23 PM

Originally Posted by jct us101

I don't expect how seeing that is going to make me suddenly want to drastically change my life. I'm sorry, but even if that sounds totally heartless, we rely on plastic for so many things, and it just really sucks for the birds. Not that I don't feel terrible about it or sorry for them, but I hate it when people use guilt trips like that to try and change something.

There's no call for excusing carelessness or dumping. Whether anyone feels guilty or not. (Or in fact, saying that a belly-full of plastic scrap doesn't kill birds by slow starvation and other things: that happens is that the stuff may look like food under the surface of the water or otherwise be taken up in feeding. Or cause them to become entangled.

The fact is that the over-use of plastics, particularly in packaging, is for the short-term profits of a few, and a lot of it, particularly in packaging, doesn't make our lives any better or add to the economy. Whenever people try to pass restrictions on wasteful packaging, a few jobs are held hostage, but those jobs end up being lost overseas anyway.

I'm sorry, JCT, if you don't like to feel *bad* about it, ....who does, really. But that's how certain people sell the general *denial* of our environmental impacts on the world... I say, don't look away cause you feel *bad* about it, do what you can. Some of it seems pretty trivial, like maybe your household trash that could be kept out of the waste streams that lead to landfills and ocean dumping... wasting less electricity, choosing more locally made food and whatever else where you can... It adds up. That's how things got so messy, so what ordinary folks do does matter.

*Das Boot* · 11-02-2009, 05:37 PM

By the looks of the title, I thought this was going to be a thread about not using credit cards. I really don't think people are going to recycle until there is a incentive (money) for them to. Certainly at least one person that gives a crap about it has some sort of business savy to make it everyone's worthwhile.

*Ash* · 11-02-2009, 06:01 PM

Eventually, though we will need to strike a balance between economic advantage and conservation. The two are usually mutually exclusive (at the moment).

*pingflood* · 11-02-2009, 06:11 PM

Originally Posted by Mike Cash

Why is it that cynicism gets such a bad rap?

That which is assumed to be cynical often instead proves to have been prescient.

People used to accuse me of being cynical, I said "No, I'm just a realist."

*hwblanks* · 11-02-2009, 06:12 PM

When I saw the thread subject line, I have to admit that the first thing that came to mind was that this was going to be an appeal to those of us with LBA to quit using our credit cards to finance our habit.

BTW, I do participate in my city's recycling program.

Now, off to Fleabay to bid on a much wanted lens (Canon 50/1.8 mk1). For the record, should I win this auction, I don't plan on using plastic to finance it, as I hope to get an extremely good deal on it.

EDIT: I did win it and get an extremely good deal on it and the Canon Rebel S II film body that comes with it--$68.46, shipped!

Heather

*Das Boot* · 11-02-2009, 06:13 PM

Eventually, though we will need to strike a balance between economic advantage and conservation. The two are usually mutually exclusive (at the moment).

It will probably happen with tax credits - guaranteed government money to companies that in-turn give it to the public for recycling. This will probably be the next urgent matter in Washington after this health care debacle.

Mike L · 11-02-2009, 06:17 PM

Originally Posted by jct us101

I don't expect how seeing that is going to make me suddenly want to drastically change my life. I'm sorry, but even if that sounds totally heartless, we rely on plastic for so many things, and it just really sucks for the birds. Not that I don't feel terrible about it or sorry for them, but I hate it when people use guilt trips like that to try and change something.

You don't have to drastically change your life, no one is suggesting you sell all your possessions, wear organic hemp, eat yoghurt and hug trees.

Maybe if you see stuff like that you might realise that chucking a plastic bottle in the gutter can have an effect down the line - just think about the consequences of your actions.

*Ash* · 11-02-2009, 06:22 PM

Originally Posted by Mike Cash

Why is it that cynicism gets such a bad rap?

That which is assumed to be cynical often instead proves to have been prescient.

Hard to tell online, esp. without emoticons... extra esp. if you don't know the writer all that well...

But if Gooshin was not being cynical when he suggested mass suicide, then I'm a monkey's uncle.

*graphicgr8s* · 11-02-2009, 06:35 PM

Unfortunately a couple of folks have made this a Liberal/Conservative thing. I know a lot of liberals that are terrible environmentally and a lot of conservatives that have a respect and cherish the environment. And the opposite holds true also. I find myself about in the middle. When I am out fishing and I need to get rid of line I look for the recycle bin for it. When I ran my boat I held onto it and got rid of it ashore. I garden as organically as I can. And I recycle as much as possible. It's not really that hard. And it's not all about the environment. You really have two choices of what to do with any garbage. Toss it on the road or put it in a garbage can. Not really that difficult of a decision for me. It's not a lot more effort people.