law gone mad?

[rhermans]

It's a whole new brave world.

I don't even want to comment on those ****** stupids who think this way off scaring "their own" people will prevent bad things happening. Oh sorry just did.

[Rick]

Originally Posted by JahJahwarrior

...but I'm quite good at arguing (made it to nationals in debate this last year) and love to fight things to the end, so if someone told me to stop taking pictures, I'd politely refuse until they could prove I was breaking the law. At which point, I would gladly delete any pictures I had taken while I broke any laws, but I would never let them take my camera. If they did, I'd dial 4-1-1 and ask for a lawyer, any lawyer. Right there, on the spot. I'd ask for the officers name and tell the lawyer I want to file a lawsuit against the city/state/county, whatever, to the amount of a few thousand (so it'd be in small claims court) because this officer acting on behalf of this area has taken my property. I'd be a dick about it, basically. I figure it'd be an easy lawsuit to win and even if it wasn't I'd gladly spend years in court fighting it just for fun, as long as I thought I could win and make the city pay my legal fees

Criminal law is not the "nationals in debate this last year". Real life does not resemble television.

Police do not have to prove ANYTHING to you at the time they approach you - what they will do if you push it is arrest your ass, search you, and throw you in a tank with assorted drunks, hypes, and whatever else the catch of the night is. If you want to go hand to hand with them over your camera... well, go for it. I'm sure you're a strapping 18 year old lad, but you're gonna lose - and be able to add to your 18 years of experience in the process. Don't count on calling 4-1-1 or anything else on your cellphone... it's difficult to do with your hands handcuffed behind your back. You'll get your call once you're in cells, but it will be a free call - you won't be using your cellphone. And you'll probably want to discuss the criminal charges first, not your planned civil action.

If you're REALLY lucky, they'll be so far off base in their actions that the state won't proceed with any charges, including anything like causing a disturbance or resisting arrest, or whatever. If you're REALLY, REALLY lucky, you might even have grounds for a civil action for excessive force or whatever. Police generally are given broad ammunity as long as it can be shown they were acting in a reasonable belief that what they did was appropriate to the time and situation.

If you're not so lucky, you'll be doing some jail time. Probably worse, you'll have a criminal record, possibly even a felony record. That can screw you up for life - and being a great debator back in high school won't help you one iota. In fact, your lawyer will probably tell you to keep your cakehole shut and not say anything other than "I want my lawyer".

A lawyer to represent you in small claims court? First of all, many states exclude lawyers in small claims court. Second, good luck getting a lawyer who will represent you in small claims court if he can. A contingency fee ain't going to amount to much, given the limits on small claims in many jurisdictions, and not many lawyers are going to lose money helping you "be a dick about it". If you have deep enough pockets to pay the going rate - which I doubt - then you probably can find a lawyer who will take your money to fool around in small claims, assuming he's allowed there in the first place.

Furthermore, in many jurisdictions, small claims tends to avoid dealing with anything other than real damages - in other words, good luck on getting a judgement with punitive damages for your hurt feelings or whatever in small claims.

In this day and age with the PATRIOT Act and all the other security oriented legislation, zones, etc, presuming you have a right to be taking pictures can be very risky business indeed. The prudent thing is to comply with police instructions at the moment and then pick better ground to fight on. Stay out of jail, out of handcuffs, and then start the business of laying formal complaints and whatnot AFTER you're home and free, without any charges pending. If you choose to go head to head with police, on the spot, you're going to lose just about every single time..

Having said all of the above, there's no doubt that our personal rights and freedoms have been under attack in England, the US, and Canada for several decades now - dating back to long before 9/11. We have given up what we have lost so far in exchange for vague promises of security, and of course in the end we will have neither our privacy nor security.

[MRRiley]

Originally Posted by JahJahwarrior

..... However, the Xray guy ALWAYS passed my bag through again. I think it was either the 500mm lense or the batteries I keep in a box....

I know how you feel JahJah... When I came back from the Bahamas in April they x-rayed my camera bag twice, then 2 guys hand-searched it, ran a sniffer over it and swabbed it for explosive residue (good thing I use a different bag for my handguns... LOL).

In my earlier life in the USAF I sometimes had to carry classified materials on commercial flights. Even back in the 90s it gave security fits that they could not search, metal detect or x-ray my briefcase. I hate to think of the scene that would generate in an airport these days. LOL

[daacon]

Pictures of the Golden Gate Bridge at sunset with a Bigma is going to prompt questions. Same with pictures of kids playing in a park (assuming they are not yours - even then you would have to prove it) - the age of innocence has long gone buy replaced by guilty by association or location and remain so until proven innocent. (Even then you feel like you did something wrong) .

There are several sport fields where I live I and I want to go practice my photography but don't most times for fear of someone calling 911 - there is a man taking pictures ...... sometimes I ask the coach if they mind , other times it is just not worth the effort - a shame.

I don’t live in a highly desirable terrorist target area. Around here there are several refineries I want to go out and take some night shots with a tripod - we will see if I can get some pictures without being kicked out or undergo some sort of interrogation.

Common sense in a lot of places has been lost and replaced by paranoia – sure ask me what I am doing and why if I offer a reasonable explanation let me be.

edit: on a recent trip at the airport (in Tampa) I got pulled aside and scolded because I left a tube or oragel (I had a tooth ache) - other times my electronic carry on bag has been pulled aside and manuall search with comments - you have alot or cabels here ... ummmm yeah I do - ethernet , patch , chargers , AC adapters ......sheeeeeeeesh

[DigiFilm]

Originally Posted by aabram

... and that's the reason "post your pics" forum is filled with just bugs, plants and babies ;-)..

What? No ducks?