HOYA to sell Pentax - Page 5

creampuff · 11-04-2009, 05:18 PM

Originally Posted by PeterAM

For whatever it's worth: JVC may sell tunes unit, buy Pentax | The Japan Times Online

But if you read the article carefully, the article DOES NOT name any sources by name... Much like a lot of huff and puff rumours circulating here... no credible sources = incredible stories.

BB_Zone28 · 11-04-2009, 08:39 PM

Originally Posted by rawr

Meh.

I suppose I could get used to it:

Just change the model to "J" instead of "K" and leave the Pentax name on the pentaprism.

Then we'd have J-x, J-7, etc

*isteve · 11-04-2009, 11:24 PM

Originally Posted by falconeye

I hope negotiations fail and fail quickly.

Pentax has been delayed by Hoya aquisition in the past and this would delay them again. One further delay may be fine. But not an avoidable "we try everything" approach by a camcorder maker to find a future. They cannot be the final destination for the Pentax brand.

There is no need for any delays this time. Its not a hostile takeover.

JVC would be a good complimentary partner. Pentax would bring a whole new business line with much expertise and optics for their camcorders (currently bought from Konika Minolta!) and JVC have the mass production capacity, electronics expertise etc.

The biggest benefit by far would be the immense distribution channel that JVC already has and the willingness/desire to compete head on with Sony in all markets. This would mean JVC investing heavily in Pentax and Pentax being back on the shelf in every store across the world.

I hope they keep Pentax as a brand, like Kenwood. Pentax has more cachet on the camera circuit. However, I guess they could make digicams JVC and SLRs Pentax?

JVC are also big in security cameras, another Pentax product area. This would expand their market overnight.

Kunzite · 11-05-2009, 02:07 AM

I'm with falconeye on this.
Hoya's was not a hostile takeover either. But, it put Pentax through a time consuming reorganization which, afaik, hasn't even ended. Just reorganizing the sales channels, it's not a simple task.
Besides, I'm not so sure if JVC would be "investing heavily" in Pentax. Do they have the money? They don't even make a profit...
So IMO the best thing is for Pentax to stay with Hoya.

ftpaddict · 11-05-2009, 02:16 AM

I'm fine with wherever they go as long as Pentax as a brand and ideology don't cease to exist.

dycz · 11-05-2009, 02:43 AM

Man! Release the 645D first before doing such things.... and.... reprice the lenses...

jeffkrol · 11-05-2009, 07:29 AM

Originally Posted by Kunzite

I'm with falconeye on this.
Hoya's was not a hostile takeover either.

That is debateable..Pentax board went kicking and screaming into the merger.
The company was looking hard at "white knights" to bail them out. also they had a 'poison pill" scheme which they threatened to use. But their main investors and banks turned on them. Hoya even at one point said "merge willingly or we will just take you"....... hoya also said they would keep Pentax independent which they did for about a month and then totally absorbed the company. The company was supposed to be called Hoya/Pentax BTW.
SPARX was the driving force of the M&A.... It was a bloodless battle (unless you consider the loss of the entire Pentax board and any Pentax old management influence dying) but a battle nevertheless... I would consider all this hostile, at least to someone

Originally Posted by Kunzite

But, it put Pentax through a time consuming reorganization which, afaik, hasn't even ended. Just reorganizing the sales channels, it's not a simple task.

IF Hoya intend to eliminate Pentax Camera they would already have organized it solely for sale. It won't be as messy this time.
for JVC it will just be another line in their group. Sales channels will be the same. It was Hoyas lack of retail and Pentax lack of skill that made the sales channel thing difficult.

Originally Posted by Kunzite

Besides, I'm not so sure if JVC would be "investing heavily" in Pentax. Do they have the money? They don't even make a profit...
So IMO the best thing is for Pentax to stay with Hoya.

JVC Kenwood, which posted a group net loss of 18.80 billion yen in fiscal 2008, has been pushing a downsizing program under which it has been shrinking its television business at home and abroad and cutting back on its workforce.
It expects a net loss of 20 billion yen in fiscal 2009 through next March.
3RD LD: JVC Kenwood mulls selling music software unit Victor Entertainment

Kunzite · 11-05-2009, 08:23 AM

I agree it wasn't a hassle-free take over; they reached an agreement though, even if forced by Sparx. Not a friendly take over, not really a hostile one - should we say, somewhere in between? (you see, IMO the hostile part was Sparx; Hoya just made an opportunistic move).
If Hoya wanted to sell Pentax, why didn't they keep it as a separate entity? Yes, they would make sure it won't be as messy, it would not take as long, but it would still have a negative impact, disrupting the operations flow (e.g. switching to JVC's distribution channels, revising the strategy, changing the branding) and it would damage customer's trust. Just when things are starting to move, again (they lost K10D's momentum).
My guess is, Hoya don't want to sell Pentax. They don't completely rule out this possibility, either; but I'd like to think they will try a partnership, before a sell-out.

*isteve · 11-05-2009, 08:58 AM

Originally Posted by Kunzite

I agree it wasn't a hassle-free take over; they reached an agreement though, even if forced by Sparx. Not a friendly take over, not really a hostile one - should we say, somewhere in between? (you see, IMO the hostile part was Sparx; Hoya just made an opportunistic move).
If Hoya wanted to sell Pentax, why didn't they keep it as a separate entity? Yes, they would make sure it won't be as messy, it would not take as long, but it would still have a negative impact, disrupting the operations flow (e.g. switching to JVC's distribution channels, revising the strategy, changing the branding) and it would damage customer's trust. Just when things are starting to move, again (they lost K10D's momentum).
My guess is, Hoya don't want to sell Pentax. They don't completely rule out this possibility, either; but I'd like to think they will try a partnership, before a sell-out.

The Hoya takeover was hostile because it forced the resignation of the Pentax board, and the delays were very costly.

This time, partnership is far more likely. They may even form a new company, Pentax Cameras Inc, which is partly owned by both companies with Hoya owning 51%.

Although JVC is one potential partner there are others potentially more suitable. However I can see how JVC would be complimentary and would provide an excellent sales channel for Pentax.

knoxploration · 11-05-2009, 09:59 AM

Hoya has already bluntly denied this rumor:

http://www.hoya.co.jp/english/news/latest/20091104.pdf

*Jonson PL* · 11-05-2009, 10:04 AM

Originally Posted by *isteve

There is no need for any delays this time. Its not a hostile takeover.

JVC would be a good complimentary partner. Pentax would bring a whole new business line with much expertise and optics for their camcorders (currently bought from Konika Minolta!) and JVC have the mass production capacity, electronics expertise etc.

The biggest benefit by far would be the immense distribution channel that JVC already has and the willingness/desire to compete head on with Sony in all markets. This would mean JVC investing heavily in Pentax and Pentax being back on the shelf in every store across the world.

I hope they keep Pentax as a brand, like Kenwood. Pentax has more cachet on the camera circuit. However, I guess they could make digicams JVC and SLRs Pentax?

JVC are also big in security cameras, another Pentax product area. This would expand their market overnight.

Could be interesting for sure

kevinschoenmakers · 11-05-2009, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by *isteve

This time, partnership is far more likely. They may even form a new company, Pentax Cameras Inc, which is partly owned by both companies with Hoya owning 51%.

That might just be the best possible outcome. Have a big optics company and a big electronics company own Pentax.

cateto · 11-05-2009, 10:07 AM

Originally Posted by knoxploration

Hoya has already bluntly denied this rumor:

http://www.hoya.co.jp/english/news/latest/20091104.pdf

If you read carefully, they only say that the media reports on the sale of Pentax are "not a fact". This is far from denying bluntly: it simply says it is not something factual, but it does not discard the possibility of negotiations or explorations in that direction.

They could have used a much stronger wording in order to actually deny this rumour.

Time will tell.

*Igilligan* · 11-05-2009, 10:11 AM

Originally Posted by knoxploration

Hoya has already bluntly denied this rumor:

http://www.hoya.co.jp/english/news/latest/20091104.pdf

They always deny the rumours until the ink is dry on the contracts.

If I am not mistaken Pentax and Hoya both denied the rumors of Hoya's takeover, right up until the announcement! That is just the way it is done.

knoxploration · 11-05-2009, 10:31 AM

Originally Posted by cateto

If you read carefully, they only say that the media reports on the sale of Pentax are "not a fact". This is far from denying bluntly: it simply says it is not something factual, but it does not discard the possibility of negotiations or explorations in that direction.

They could have used a much stronger wording in order to actually deny this rumour.

Time will tell.

That's your reading of it. I tend to disagree - I'd see a two sentence press release as being extraordinarily blunt. I also see a JVC deal as making very little sense at all - particularly when one considers that JVC already tried and failed in the digital camera business once before, and that was in the simpler point-and-shoot segment before things got as competitive as they are these days.

Originally Posted by Igilligan

If I am not mistaken Pentax and Hoya both denied the rumors of Hoya's takeover, right up until the announcement! That is just the way it is done.

You're mistaken. The Hoya / Pentax merger was very public, with several updates from both companies on the state of play over a period of six months or more, as they negotiated for a deal.