I've always hated Apple's proprietary connectors, half of their profit must come from selling $29 dongles that cost $3 to make.
That said, Apple has brought a lot of design innovation to the PC world, introducing ideas that would eventually become the de-facto standard...
- all laptops had keyboards on the front edge of the case until Apple's Macbooks moved it back towards the screen
- all laptops had trackballs (or no mice at all!) until Apple introduced Trackpads
- the iPod set the standard for MP3 players' form factor and the benchmark in usability
- the iPhone has set the benchmark for smartphones - large, multiple-touch screen, rotatable display, icon, page, and table-based UI, etc...Has anyone after introduced any significant design innovation?
Are they perfect? No, they've done some pretty boneheaded things too - the first portable was awful, the 20th anniversay mac was a ripoff, they have no headless mac between the underpowered mini and the hulking Pro, the chrome backs of the iPods scratch too easily, the white Macbooks mar too easily, etc...
But they've had an influence on the industry that's far greater than their measly market share.
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Incidentally, in regards to hardware: remember how the PowerPC chip was so much better than that Intel crap Windows users were stuck with? And how Apple would never lower itself to using Intel? Remember that? Innovative.
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Yes, PowerPC processors are such a bad idea that all three major gaming consoles use them.
...Right now, Apple's security consists entirely of hope and lack of market share. Saying Apples are secure because of the genius of their makers is like saying Earth doesn't get hit by comets because we've got such a well-designed and defended planet. Not true. It's because there's a GBFO gas giant - Jupiter - in the way that's a much bigger and more attractive (literally) target.
If Apple's market share increases - and they start getting used for something important, like databases for credit card companies - watch the malware roll in.
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You could argue, however, that Microsoft released 3 new "versions" of Windows XP. Except they called 'em Service Packs. And they were free. They had the same effect. That was over a period of eight years.
In the seven years OSX has been around, there have updates every year. For thirty bucks a pop, let's say, so far, the OS has cost you $210. If it keeps on going, there's no limit to what it would cost you.
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Saying 10.6 is an update to 10.0 is like saying Windows 7 is an update to Windows 95. And a Service Pack is a bug fix, not a new version. Don't make excuses for the polished turd known as Vista being four years late.
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Of course, no one here's arguing that Windows is some sort of divine being, unlike the Apple cultists.
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Who here has claimed divinity? And two characteristics of cultist behavior are:
1. "Adjusting" facts to suit the current arguement.
2. Regurgitating "facts" without checking them.
FYI, there have been six new versions (not updates) of OS X since 10.0 was released eight and a half years ago, so you are guilty of at least one of the above, possibly both.
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Compaq should've sued Apple for stealing the innovative idea of a HDD-based DAP. Yes, Compaq.
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I find it funny that the Windows fans in this thread cannot understand that innovation does not require new technology.
Though there's plenty of innovation where Apple stands alone. The slot-loading drive, as mentioned. The inaccessible case.
So because you can't figure out how to open it it's inaccessible?
The massed convergence (and, therefore, lack of redundancy) of several items.
Simplification can be an innovation. Personally, I like things simple.
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A computer whose ports (USB and otherwise) were only accessible if said computer was turned upside down. Short mouse cords...coupled with laptops that only had USB ports on the left. Laptops you can fry eggs on. Batteries that scare airlines. Notoriously uncomfortable, unergonomic and unresponsive mice that seem to be designed for rectal insertion (hmmm...)
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Are these the worst design flaws that you can come up with? Let's see...
Dell laptops that actually catch fire!!!!!!!
Microsoft mice that try to force everybody to be right handed.
A poorly conceived and poorly executed GUI that is ergonomically dubious at best, a navigation nightmare, and that seems to get worse with each new version of Windows.
By the way, can you name a single "portable electronic device" that doesn't scare airlines? Also, I like Apples mice.
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Laptop keyboards...for desktops. Terrible misuse of desktop real estate.
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A large percentage of the population now prefer short throw, A.K.A. laptop, keyboards. Also, they are ergonomically superior. Short throw keyboards are now also supplied by Dell, HP, and many other computer companies.
In reality the keyboard style thing is a matter of personal taste. You can also thank Apple for the USB hub in the keyboard innovation, but I'm sure you hate that idea too.
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But you're right, Microsoft wouldn't do much innovating. Unlike Apple, it's users are able to do it, and tend not to really on some magic corporate god to tell them what they want and then provide it.
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There you go again, confusing ability with desire. The way Apple does things allows users of the Mac OS to focus their energy on actually getting work done. Personally I find it reprehensible that people find it normal to spend so much time maintaining their computer. And you are the only one throwing "god" into this.
Yes, PowerPC processors are such a bad idea that all three major gaming consoles use them.
Strawman argument, yay. What do gaming consoles have to do with this? Nobody said PowerPC was bad, just that Apple claimed they were better than x86 CPU's, and this was not true.
Dell laptops that actually catch fire!!!!!!!
Mac laptops that actually catch fire!!!!!!!This resulted in a class-action lawsuit.
Microsoft mice that try to force everybody to be right handed.
You make it sound like MS doesn't offer any other mice. They do. So do plenty of other companies, some even offer "lefty" mice.
A poorly conceived and poorly executed GUI that is ergonomically dubious at best, a navigation nightmare, and that seems to get worse with each new version of Windows.
Says you. Most people have no problems with the Windows interface, and Win7's GUI has won praise even from Mac-users.
A large percentage of the population now prefer short throw, A.K.A. laptop, keyboards. Also, they are ergonomically superior. Short throw keyboards are now also supplied by Dell, HP, and many other computer companies.
Would love to see the source for this "statistic". Most companies offer "short throw" and traditional keyboards.
There you go again, confusing ability with desire. The way Apple does things allows users of the Mac OS to focus their energy on actually getting work done. Personally I find it reprehensible that people find it normal to spend so much time maintaining their computer. And you are the only one throwing "god" into this.
I've no problems "getting work done" in Windows, and I guess the rest of the world agrees, since Windows is by far the dominant OS.
There's a lot more that could be mentioned, but the point isn't to bash Macs.
If you read my post again, you'll see that I'm saying that OSX is a Unix OS. I just found it interesting that when you gave a brief history of OSX, you neglected to mention Unix, instead choosing to stop with Next
I'd hardly call the way Apple acquired the GUI from Xerox stealing. It's more like accepting a gift. Regarding the rest of the paragraph, let's do something similar, but with a new car: "Only four tires. Innovative. Glass windshield. Innovative." Really? Can you not see the flaw in your argument? Also, there is a point to the non-repaceable battery. It's not a bad idea just because you don't like it.
I don't really think it's stealing, either. But the point is, many things in computing, as in life, are inevitable, and this includes aspects of an OS. Yet whenever MS does anything vaguely Apple-esque, the Macaholics scream "copycat!". Just childish. As far as batteries go, yes, nonreplaceable batteries are bad. If they weren't why aren't all Mac batteries nonreplaceable?
A quick quote from the three and a half year old article you linked to:
"Participants were given local client access to the target computer and invited to try their luck."
Please feel free to correct me on this one if you want, but I'm pretty sure that in May 2006 the current version of Windows was XP. Now tell me, if you gave the same caliber of hacker local client access to an XP box, exactly how long would it take for him to gain control? 2 minutes? less?
Mmm, strawman again. We were talking about OSX, remember?
Yes, and lots of people used computers in the 1970s, but there is a scale issue here. And the iPod itself has no DRM at all. Only some of the songs from the iTunes store do. I'm making a point about it being some of the songs, because Apple has push the record industry hard to eliminate DRM, and has been rather successful.
Rio & Creative labs both had popular MP3 players prior to Apple. Remember, the 1st iPod wasn't compatible with Windows, so it's popularity was limited.
At one time, all iTunes downloads had DRM. And Apple has been a follower, not a leading, in the non-DRM shift. Apple responded to pressure from other online music stores.
Go find a printer that could actually be purchased in a store before May of 1998 that had a USB port built in. Give up yet? Thats because they did not exist. Now let's see, when did the first iMac come out?
So you think Apple, with their (at the time) tiny market penetration, drove the USB revolution? I can remember using a workgroup printer in 1997 that was USB but I don't remember if it was HP, Ricoh, IBM...
I guess I just don't see the benefit of having a CD or DVD without electricity. Maybe Lithos needs it for a signal mirror?
Suppose you are working on a project and have a CD in the drive. The power goes out. Uh-oh, I need to get the CD and go to another computer. Can't readily do that with a Mac, yet you can in most PC's. Personally, I don't think this is a big deal, since you should have your Mac/PC connected to a UPS anyway.
10char 'cause I'm too lazy to reformat the quotes...
Edit: I'd like to see a source on the mac laptops that supposedly caught fire.
Actually, I'm not really bashing Macs. Check most of my comments in this thread and you'll see. I like Macs, just like I enjoy WinPC. IN fact, I can find only a couple of comments I made that could be construed as "bashing" Macs. Also please notice I've found fault with PC's also, and could easily find more.
I find it ironic that Steve Beswick gives full points to Apple for just being the first to introduce USB ports - even though they never made 'em popular. But on the same token, Apple gets credit for popularising MP3 players...but in this case, being the first to come out with one is irrelevant. Bit of a double standard, eh?
And..."Apple as a leader, not a follower, in DRM"? Give me a break. iTunes, anyone?
You know what other MP3 players don't have DRM on them? About all of them. My Samsung T10 is one example I can cite. Jeez, if Apple built a car tomorrow, that, by dint of being a car, had wheels on it, Macheads'd say "Apple led the way in putting wheels on vehicles!" They'd probably also say it if those wheels were square, (then, when it failed to actually get anywhere, praise Apple for thinking outside the box.)
And yes, the USB ports on the keyboards suck balls. Why? Everytime I've plugged in a USB stick into them, OSX informs me that I need to plug it into a "powered" port, even though there's more than enough voltage going through them to run the iSuppository (or in the case of the local at which I'm studying, a more sanely designed Razer mouse.) Score one for Mac's USB keyboard hub, eh?
Originally Posted by Steve Beswick
I guess I just don't see the benefit of having a CD or DVD without electricity. Maybe Lithos needs it for a signal mirror?
Tell me again, what's the purpose of removable, portable media? Here's a hint: I've given you two words in that question that are the answer. (And CDs do indeed make excellent signal mirrors - got the built in sight hole and everything.)
I've always hated Apple's proprietary connectors, half of their profit must come from selling $29 dongles that cost $3 to make.
That said, Apple has brought a lot of design innovation to the PC world, introducing ideas that would eventually become the de-facto standard...
- all laptops had keyboards on the front edge of the case until Apple's Macbooks moved it back towards the screen
- all laptops had trackballs (or no mice at all!) until Apple introduced Trackpads
- the iPod set the standard for MP3 players' form factor and the benchmark in usability
- the iPhone has set the benchmark for smartphones - large, multiple-touch screen, rotatable display, icon, page, and table-based UI, etc...Has anyone after introduced any significant design innovation?
Are they perfect? No, they've done some pretty boneheaded things too - the first portable was awful, the 20th anniversay mac was a ripoff, they have no headless mac between the underpowered mini and the hulking Pro, the chrome backs of the iPods scratch too easily, the white Macbooks mar too easily, etc...
But they've had an influence on the industry that's far greater than their measly market share.
I agree, Apple has influenced the industry to a far greater degree than their marketshare would indicate.
When I was a system builder, people would ask for something "Mac like", but still wanted a PC. I once outfitted an Architect/Interior Design office with little Shuttle XPC-based systems, because this was as close as I could get to "Mac like". Because clients visited the office, typical beige- or black-box PC's were not an option.
I have to point out an error in your statement, "all laptops had trackballs (or no mice at all!) until Apple introduced Trackpads". Prior to trackpads, some laptops - most famously IBM Thinkpads - has "pointing sticks" set in the center of the keyboard.
Linear Mode
