Should I sell my 21mm limited

Alex00 · 05-20-2010, 04:18 PM

Originally posted by Voe

You are joking right?

5. You should learn more about the differences between fringing and CA, before you come up here, as it seems you are confused.

6. Show me a DA 12-24mm image on photozone which has more CA or fringing than this shot taken with DA 15mm (http://photozone.smugmug.com/photos/684543736_7Ar7z-O.jpg)

7. My point? I don't have a point I'm just answering illogical and childish claims that DA 12-24mm (due to CA) and the DA 21mm (barrel distorion, vignetting) are useless and the DA 15mm is the holy grail of lenses. I say it's not, and you seems to have a problem with that.

8. Proven by whom? A fact is you don't get CA in every image as proven by many images posted. Even on Photozone.de.

9. Thank you Alex00, that's very good thing to know. You may have forgotten but this is the second time you ask this question, already answered here (https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/101189-should-...ml#post1046919) and you said that you understand here (https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/101189-should-...ml#post1046919). Please note that by posting my opinion on this forum I'm not trying to sell my lens.

Am I really doing that? Sorry, I was merely replying to your posts, which is of not much help to you, as you seems very confused. But worry not, I will try and help you out:

Maybe you forgot again but you are the first who involved the distortion in this thread here (https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/101189-should-...ml#post1046407)

The word distortion mentioned by me here (https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/101189-should-...ml#post1046951) was in regards to what You said: "use f5.6 for things like portraiture to limit DOF and get maximum center sharpness. DA 15mm is capable of producing stunning portraits". And I told you using ultra wideangle lens like the DA 15mm at f/5.6 for portraits and trying to achieve limited DoF will not work unless you get really close, and you get face distortion.

Just a reminder, you seems to be avoiding points 1, 2 and 3. made in my previous comment. Please as I kindly respond to each of your points feel free to do the same for me.
Thank you Alex00.

Here's my first post to this thread. It's was all about the 21mm and i'm entitled to my opinion whether it's something that you like or not.
.
"The high barrel distortions on this lens is major turn off for me. Vignetting is also high until you stop down to f5.6. I would sell it and go for either DA 15mm, FA 31mm or DA 40mm."

It was all about the 21mm and nothing about the 12-24. I had no mention about CA anywhere. All this came later. I was merely given my opinion. Other users also agreed in favor of the 15mm over 21mm which is exactly what i recommended. If i were you i would stop stressing about the 21mm.

Last edited by Alex00; 05-20-2010 at 04:47 PM.

creampuff · 05-20-2010, 04:28 PM

Well Alex00... I'm not the one who has to prove anything. I think we all know that the person who needs to back up claims about the 12-24mm's supposed shortcomings is none other than you.
No need to refer to photozone or other review sites. Please show us the problematic 12-24mm photos that you claim to have firsthand with exif intact. Thus far you have posted nothing to prove what you claim.
Just so you know I've reported your posts to the Mods. I won't tolerate another member openly accusing another me of lying here or anywhere else.

Voe · 05-20-2010, 04:30 PM

Originally posted by Alex00

Here's my first post to this thread. It's was all about the 21mm and i'm entitled to my opinion whether it's something that you like or now.
.
"The high barrel distortions on this lens is major turn off for me. Vignetting is also high until you stop down to f5.6. I would sell it and go for either DA 15mm, FA 31mm or DA 40mm."

It was all about the 21mm and nothing about the 12-24. I had no mention about CA anywhere. All this came later. I was merely given my opinion. Other users also agreed in favor of the 15mm over 21mm which is exactly what i recommended. If i were you i would stop stressing about the 21mm.

I'm not talking about your first post, but you consequent posts.

It's not important who mentioined CA but since you say you didn't, I'm saying you did and not only mentioned CA but you were the first to bring it to this thread here (https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/101189-should-...ml#post1046954). Forgetting again?

You seems to be forgetting alot, I will remind you that I expect you to answer my points 1,2,3 and 6.

Alex00 · 05-20-2010, 04:32 PM

Originally posted by Voe

You are joking right?

5. You should learn more about the differences between fringing and CA, before you come up here, as it seems you are confused.

6. Show me a DA 12-24mm image on photozone which has more CA or fringing than this shot taken with DA 15mm (http://photozone.smugmug.com/photos/684543736_7Ar7z-O.jpg).

I can't believe your not seeing fringing on this photos. I'll show it to you below.. You need to go back to the "spotting fringing basics" more like fringing 101.

Alex00 · 05-20-2010, 04:38 PM

Originally posted by creampuff

Well Alex00... I'm not the one who has to prove anything. I think we all know that the person who needs to back up claims about the 12-24mm's supposed shortcomings is none other than you.
No need to refer to photozone or other review sites. Please show us the problematic 12-24mm photos that you claim to have firsthand with exif intact. Thus far you have posted nothing to prove what you claim.
Just so you know I've reported your posts to the Mods. I won't tolerate another member openly accusing another me of lying here or anywhere else.

I can understand your frustration not being able to provide an untouched image. You already lost your reputation by no standing up to the image you posted. I didn't post your image, you did and didn't stand behind it even though i asked you numerous times to post an untouched image of the photo you posted for fringing verification.

Below are 2 images taken with 12-24mm. Download the zip file, open and pixelpeep. Pentaxor also verified the fringing issue with 12-24mm. In addition All review sites also verified this and we can tell by there samples all of which contains fringing which veo miserable failed to spot.

http://eprogramers.com/IMGP2123.zip

Alex00 · 05-20-2010, 04:53 PM

Originally posted by Voe

You are joking right?

5. You should learn more about the differences between fringing and CA, before you come up here, as it seems you are confused..

Really??? WOW.
Maybe we should also contact Wikipedia and ask them to change there definition of CA. It's obvious you have no clue what's going on and you just want to prove yourself right for once.

"Chromatic aberration manifests itself as "fringes" of color along boundaries that separate dark and bright parts of the image, because each color in the optical spectrum cannot be focused at a single common point on the optical axis."

Chromatic aberration - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Voe · 05-20-2010, 05:04 PM

Originally posted by Alex00

I can't believe your not seeing fringing on this photos. I'll show it to you below.. You need to go back to the "spotting fringing basics" more like fringing 101.

What's wrong with you? You are showing me a crop of the shot made with the DA 15mm Limited I posted in point 6, and in point 6 I asked you to show me another shot with more fringing taken with DA 12-24mm from the Photozone site. Because you said there is CA on every 12-24mm photo on the photozone site. I seriosly can't believe your idiocity.

Last edited by Voe; 05-20-2010 at 05:14 PM.

Voe · 05-20-2010, 05:10 PM

Originally posted by Alex00

Really??? WOW.
Maybe we should also contact Wikipedia and ask them to change there definition of CA. It's obvious you have no clue what's going on and you just want to prove yourself right for once.

"Chromatic aberration manifests itself as "fringes" of color along boundaries that separate dark and bright parts of the image, because each color in the optical spectrum cannot be focused at a single common point on the optical axis."

Chromatic aberration - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Alex00,
Read about purple fringing here: Purple fringing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Don't you see anything common with the Photozone DA 15mm crop you posted?http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c1/Purple_fringing.jpg...e_fringing.jpg

PS. Again, I will remind you that I expect you to answer my points 1,2,3 and 6.

Alex00 · 05-20-2010, 05:13 PM

Originally posted by Voe

Alex00,
Read about fringing here: Purple fringing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Don't you see anything common with the Photozone DA 15mm crop you posted?http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c1/Purple_fringing.jpg...e_fringing.jpg

Fringing is common with every lens. No lens is free of CA. It's how well fringing is controlled. I told you, you need to go back to the basics. You are repeating what i told you. I can't believe your still arguing. I'm done with you.
Should you keep your 21mm? NO .
Do you currently have it for sale YES.
Case closed.

Parallax · 05-20-2010, 05:17 PM

And another one bites the dust. A little self control goes a long way toward keeping threads open and productive.

05-20-2010, 04:38 PM	#80
Alex00 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: California Photos: Gallery Posts: 294	Originally posted by creampuff Well Alex00... I'm not the one who has to prove anything. I think we all know that the person who needs to back up claims about the 12-24mm's supposed shortcomings is none other than you. No need to refer to photozone or other review sites. Please show us the problematic 12-24mm photos that you claim to have firsthand with exif intact. Thus far you have posted nothing to prove what you claim. Just so you know I've reported your posts to the Mods. I won't tolerate another member openly accusing another me of lying here or anywhere else. I can understand your frustration not being able to provide an untouched image. You already lost your reputation by no standing up to the image you posted. I didn't post your image, you did and didn't stand behind it even though i asked you numerous times to post an untouched image of the photo you posted for fringing verification. Below are 2 images taken with 12-24mm. Download the zip file, open and pixelpeep. Pentaxor also verified the fringing issue with 12-24mm. In addition All review sites also verified this and we can tell by there samples all of which contains fringing which veo miserable failed to spot. http://eprogramers.com/IMGP2123.zip Last edited by Alex00; 05-20-2010 at 04:45 PM.

05-20-2010, 05:10 PM	#83
Voe Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Sydney Photos: Gallery Posts: 719	Originally posted by Alex00 Really??? WOW. Maybe we should also contact Wikipedia and ask them to change there definition of CA. It's obvious you have no clue what's going on and you just want to prove yourself right for once. "Chromatic aberration manifests itself as "fringes" of color along boundaries that separate dark and bright parts of the image, because each color in the optical spectrum cannot be focused at a single common point on the optical axis." Chromatic aberration - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Alex00, Read about purple fringing here: Purple fringing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Don't you see anything common with the Photozone DA 15mm crop you posted?http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c1/Purple_fringing.jpg...e_fringing.jpg PS. Again, I will remind you that I expect you to answer my points 1,2,3 and 6. Last edited by Voe; 05-20-2010 at 05:15 PM.

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05-20-2010, 04:18 PM	#76
Alex00 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: California Photos: Gallery Posts: 294	Originally posted by Voe You are joking right? 5. You should learn more about the differences between fringing and CA, before you come up here, as it seems you are confused. 6. Show me a DA 12-24mm image on photozone which has more CA or fringing than this shot taken with DA 15mm (http://photozone.smugmug.com/photos/684543736_7Ar7z-O.jpg) 7. My point? I don't have a point I'm just answering illogical and childish claims that DA 12-24mm (due to CA) and the DA 21mm (barrel distorion, vignetting) are useless and the DA 15mm is the holy grail of lenses. I say it's not, and you seems to have a problem with that. 8. Proven by whom? A fact is you don't get CA in every image as proven by many images posted. Even on Photozone.de. 9. Thank you Alex00, that's very good thing to know. You may have forgotten but this is the second time you ask this question, already answered here (https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/101189-should-...ml#post1046919) and you said that you understand here (https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/101189-should-...ml#post1046919). Please note that by posting my opinion on this forum I'm not trying to sell my lens. Am I really doing that? Sorry, I was merely replying to your posts, which is of not much help to you, as you seems very confused. But worry not, I will try and help you out: Maybe you forgot again but you are the first who involved the distortion in this thread here (https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/101189-should-...ml#post1046407) The word distortion mentioned by me here (https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/101189-should-...ml#post1046951) was in regards to what You said: "use f5.6 for things like portraiture to limit DOF and get maximum center sharpness. DA 15mm is capable of producing stunning portraits". And I told you using ultra wideangle lens like the DA 15mm at f/5.6 for portraits and trying to achieve limited DoF will not work unless you get really close, and you get face distortion. Just a reminder, you seems to be avoiding points 1, 2 and 3. made in my previous comment. Please as I kindly respond to each of your points feel free to do the same for me. Thank you Alex00. Here's my first post to this thread. It's was all about the 21mm and i'm entitled to my opinion whether it's something that you like or not. . "The high barrel distortions on this lens is major turn off for me. Vignetting is also high until you stop down to f5.6. I would sell it and go for either DA 15mm, FA 31mm or DA 40mm." It was all about the 21mm and nothing about the 12-24. I had no mention about CA anywhere. All this came later. I was merely given my opinion. Other users also agreed in favor of the 15mm over 21mm which is exactly what i recommended. If i were you i would stop stressing about the 21mm. Last edited by Alex00; 05-20-2010 at 04:47 PM.

05-20-2010, 04:28 PM	#77
creampuff Veteran Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Singapore Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,953	Well Alex00... I'm not the one who has to prove anything. I think we all know that the person who needs to back up claims about the 12-24mm's supposed shortcomings is none other than you. No need to refer to photozone or other review sites. Please show us the problematic 12-24mm photos that you claim to have firsthand with exif intact. Thus far you have posted nothing to prove what you claim. Just so you know I've reported your posts to the Mods. I won't tolerate another member openly accusing another me of lying here or anywhere else.

05-20-2010, 04:30 PM	#78
Voe Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Sydney Photos: Gallery Posts: 719	Originally posted by Alex00 Here's my first post to this thread. It's was all about the 21mm and i'm entitled to my opinion whether it's something that you like or now. . "The high barrel distortions on this lens is major turn off for me. Vignetting is also high until you stop down to f5.6. I would sell it and go for either DA 15mm, FA 31mm or DA 40mm." It was all about the 21mm and nothing about the 12-24. I had no mention about CA anywhere. All this came later. I was merely given my opinion. Other users also agreed in favor of the 15mm over 21mm which is exactly what i recommended. If i were you i would stop stressing about the 21mm. I'm not talking about your first post, but you consequent posts. It's not important who mentioined CA but since you say you didn't, I'm saying you did and not only mentioned CA but you were the first to bring it to this thread here (https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/101189-should-...ml#post1046954). Forgetting again? You seems to be forgetting alot, I will remind you that I expect you to answer my points 1,2,3 and 6.

05-20-2010, 04:32 PM	#79
Alex00 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: California Photos: Gallery Posts: 294	Originally posted by Voe You are joking right? 5. You should learn more about the differences between fringing and CA, before you come up here, as it seems you are confused. 6. Show me a DA 12-24mm image on photozone which has more CA or fringing than this shot taken with DA 15mm (http://photozone.smugmug.com/photos/684543736_7Ar7z-O.jpg). I can't believe your not seeing fringing on this photos. I'll show it to you below.. You need to go back to the "spotting fringing basics" more like fringing 101.

05-20-2010, 04:53 PM	#81
Alex00 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: California Photos: Gallery Posts: 294	Originally posted by Voe You are joking right? 5. You should learn more about the differences between fringing and CA, before you come up here, as it seems you are confused.. Really??? WOW. Maybe we should also contact Wikipedia and ask them to change there definition of CA. It's obvious you have no clue what's going on and you just want to prove yourself right for once. "Chromatic aberration manifests itself as "fringes" of color along boundaries that separate dark and bright parts of the image, because each color in the optical spectrum cannot be focused at a single common point on the optical axis." Chromatic aberration - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

05-20-2010, 05:04 PM	#82
Voe Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Sydney Photos: Gallery Posts: 719	Originally posted by Alex00 I can't believe your not seeing fringing on this photos. I'll show it to you below.. You need to go back to the "spotting fringing basics" more like fringing 101. What's wrong with you? You are showing me a crop of the shot made with the DA 15mm Limited I posted in point 6, and in point 6 I asked you to show me another shot with more fringing taken with DA 12-24mm from the Photozone site. Because you said there is CA on every 12-24mm photo on the photozone site. I seriosly can't believe your idiocity. Last edited by Voe; 05-20-2010 at 05:14 PM.

05-20-2010, 05:13 PM	#84
Alex00 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: California Photos: Gallery Posts: 294	Originally posted by Voe Alex00, Read about fringing here: Purple fringing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Don't you see anything common with the Photozone DA 15mm crop you posted?http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c1/Purple_fringing.jpg...e_fringing.jpg Fringing is common with every lens. No lens is free of CA. It's how well fringing is controlled. I told you, you need to go back to the basics. You are repeating what i told you. I can't believe your still arguing. I'm done with you. Should you keep your 21mm? NO . Do you currently have it for sale YES. Case closed.

05-20-2010, 05:17 PM	#85
Parallax Senior Moderator Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: South Dakota Photos: Gallery Posts: 19,332	And another one bites the dust. A little self control goes a long way toward keeping threads open and productive.

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