Macro dilemma

yeatzee · 06-09-2010, 12:27 PM

Im sorry, I do not know the correct term for the cable that connects the flash to the body using a wire. With my new DIY diffuser which has the 360 flash on camera, I can pop off 5 shots in rapid succession with the flash at around 1/8 or less power. I want to be able to do this but with the flash OFF camera. With these cables will I still get this performance? I've never understood PTTL and therefore have NEVER used it so thats not entirely relevant.

So yes, the whole goal is to get the flash off camera with on camera performance with the onboard out of the equation.

Blue · 06-09-2010, 01:36 PM

Originally posted by yeatzee

Im sorry, I do not know the correct term for the cable that connects the flash to the body using a wire. With my new DIY diffuser which has the 360 flash on camera, I can pop off 5 shots in rapid succession with the flash at around 1/8 or less power. I want to be able to do this but with the flash OFF camera. With these cables will I still get this performance? I've never understood PTTL and therefore have NEVER used it so thats not entirely relevant.

So yes, the whole goal is to get the flash off camera with on camera performance with the onboard out of the equation.

Those cables will work for that as well. They are kind of pricey for what they are.

**Canada_Rockies** · 06-09-2010, 03:35 PM

Originally posted by yeatzee

Im sorry, I do not know the correct term for the cable that connects the flash to the body using a wire. With my new DIY diffuser which has the 360 flash on camera, I can pop off 5 shots in rapid succession with the flash at around 1/8 or less power. I want to be able to do this but with the flash OFF camera. With these cables will I still get this performance? I've never understood PTTL and therefore have NEVER used it so thats not entirely relevant.

So yes, the whole goal is to get the flash off camera with on camera performance with the onboard out of the equation.

Here are the parts you need. The hot shoe adapter is required to connect the cord to the camera. Check out which of the two versions you prefer. The cable comes in three lengths, I think - 0.5 m, 1.5m and 3.0 m. I am not sure if you need the off-camera shoe adapter with the 360 FGZ. I don't need it with my 540 FGZ as it has a direct cable connection. If you don't use it, you will need to hold the flash up somehow.

Hot Shoe Adapter Fg or F.

- Fg allows the built-in flash to rise, but you cannot put a flash in the top. That's where the cable connects on the Fg
- Hot Shoe F will fit, but only with the built-in flash closed. it allows a flash to be mounted to it in a hot shoe on top. The cable connects on the side, blocking the built-in flash from rising.
Extension Cord F5P (50 cm) or F5P L (1.5 m or 3m).
Off-camera shoe adapter F. Tripod screw on the bottom, hot shoe on top, connector for the cord on the side.

yeatzee · 06-09-2010, 09:39 PM

Originally posted by Blue

Those cables will work for that as well. They are kind of pricey for what they are.

Originally posted by Canada_Rockies

Here are the parts you need. The hot shoe adapter is required to connect the cord to the camera. Check out which of the two versions you prefer. The cable comes in three lengths, I think - 0.5 m, 1.5m and 3.0 m. I am not sure if you need the off-camera shoe adapter with the 360 FGZ. I don't need it with my 540 FGZ as it has a direct cable connection. If you don't use it, you will need to hold the flash up somehow.

Hot Shoe Adapter Fg or F.

- Fg allows the built-in flash to rise, but you cannot put a flash in the top. That's where the cable connects on the Fg
- Hot Shoe F will fit, but only with the built-in flash closed. it allows a flash to be mounted to it in a hot shoe on top. The cable connects on the side, blocking the built-in flash from rising.
Extension Cord F5P (50 cm) or F5P L (1.5 m or 3m).
Off-camera shoe adapter F. Tripod screw on the bottom, hot shoe on top, connector for the cord on the side.

What about those cheap ebay ones?

**Canada_Rockies** · 06-10-2010, 08:02 AM

Originally posted by yeatzee

What about those cheap ebay ones?

I use only Pentax branded equipment whenever it exists. That is my personal quirk - well, one of them anyway - and may not fit your life style.

Blue · 06-10-2010, 08:07 AM

Originally posted by Canada_Rockies

I use only Pentax branded equipment whenever it exists. That is my personal quirk - well, one of them anyway - and may not fit your life style.

Yeatzee is a high school kid so I can understand him wanting to be frugal in places where he can i.e. 3rd party cables compared to Pentax optics.

That said, its a mixed bag on the ebay stuff. Some are good and some not so good. Its a "pay your money and takes your chances" kind of thing. Maybe it wouldn't hurt to look at some of the more known peddlers like Jinfinance.

yeatzee · 06-10-2010, 12:20 PM

Yeah I was looking at ones from ebay sellers I've purchased from before...... I couldn't believe the price these were going for from 1st party manufacturers! I can do $20 but not ~$80 for a simple cable

Deni · 06-11-2010, 12:28 AM

If you get a bad cable from ebay Chinese sellers they all are very eager to work with you on sending a replacement.

I ordered 2 rcrv-3 batteries and 2 chargers from ebay.

The chargers gave out about 4.6 volts (instead of 4.2 volts) and the batteries were about 3.9 volts instead of 3 volts.

I sent a message to each of the sellers.

They promptly and without any charge sent out replacements without requesting me to send back the ones I got.

So I ended up with 4 batteries and 3 chargers. The k100d works fine with them, so far, so ...

With the cable, if u receive a bad one, you can ask, nicely for a replacement (as you don't believe in negative feedback) and they will always send one.

Once you have 2 bad cables

, you can hack one a make a good one. After all it is a very simple cable to make (about 5 wires inside and you just need to match the connections).

yeatzee · 06-11-2010, 12:46 AM

Well for now this is the solution I have come up with:

bjorsa · 06-11-2010, 02:52 AM

You can use a couplingring instead of tape but you probably need some stepuprings or stepdownrings to match the lensthread i often use a 135 mm with a reversed attached 50 mm and with couplingring and with that combo I get scale 2,7:1 (135/50=2,7:1) sorry for the English
Kindly bjorsa

TOUGEFC · 06-11-2010, 03:04 AM

Can some please tell me the formula used to work out the mag ratio, for a reversed lens directly onto the camera body and also the same again but with extension tubes added.

Cheers.

yeatzee · 06-11-2010, 03:09 AM

Originally posted by TOUGEFC

Can some please tell me the formula used to work out the mag ratio, for a reversed lens directly onto the camera body and also the same again but with extension tubes added.

Cheers.

+1

Originally posted by bjorsa

You can use a couplingring instead of tape but you probably need some stepuprings or stepdownrings to match the lensthread i often use a 135 mm with a reversed attached 50 mm and with couplingring and with that combo I get scale 2,7:1 (135/50=2,7:1) sorry for the English
Kindly bjorsa

i would, but the filter rings are dented on the lenses I use

Marc Sabatella · 06-11-2010, 10:36 AM

I can't tell you a formula, but I can tell you that if you already have the lens, you don't need a formula. Just take out a ruler and focus on it as closely as you can. Since the sensor is basically 1" wide, if you can fill the frame with one inch, that's 1:1 magnification. If you can only focus close enough to fill the frame with two inches, that's 1:2. If you can focus close enough to fill the frame with 1/4 an inch, that's 4:1. Etc.

yeatzee · 06-12-2010, 06:31 PM

Well guys I just took 8 gigs worth of macro shots with the new setup and one key thing i've discovered that I thought I'd share.

With the flash set to 1/16 power and my new macro flash setup, I can set the camera to continues drive mode and the flash will keep up until the buffer fills (atleast with RAW+ which is what I shoot). Hopefully I was able to get some good stacks using this new method

Pictures will follow in the post your pictures section of the forum later... that is if I got any good ones

yeatzee · 06-12-2010, 07:22 PM

To show it off I did this test:

3 images stacked. I used F/5.6 to get the maximum sharpness I could... great test for stacking considering the microscopic DOF.

Taken with the macro flash setup I posted earlier.

06-09-2010, 03:35 PM	#93
Canada_Rockies Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Sparwood, BC, Canada Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,385	Originally posted by yeatzee Im sorry, I do not know the correct term for the cable that connects the flash to the body using a wire. With my new DIY diffuser which has the 360 flash on camera, I can pop off 5 shots in rapid succession with the flash at around 1/8 or less power. I want to be able to do this but with the flash OFF camera. With these cables will I still get this performance? I've never understood PTTL and therefore have NEVER used it so thats not entirely relevant. So yes, the whole goal is to get the flash off camera with on camera performance with the onboard out of the equation. Here are the parts you need. The hot shoe adapter is required to connect the cord to the camera. Check out which of the two versions you prefer. The cable comes in three lengths, I think - 0.5 m, 1.5m and 3.0 m. I am not sure if you need the off-camera shoe adapter with the 360 FGZ. I don't need it with my 540 FGZ as it has a direct cable connection. If you don't use it, you will need to hold the flash up somehow. Hot Shoe Adapter Fg or F. Fg allows the built-in flash to rise, but you cannot put a flash in the top. That's where the cable connects on the Fg Hot Shoe F will fit, but only with the built-in flash closed. it allows a flash to be mounted to it in a hot shoe on top. The cable connects on the side, blocking the built-in flash from rising. Extension Cord F5P (50 cm) or F5P L (1.5 m or 3m). Off-camera shoe adapter F. Tripod screw on the bottom, hot shoe on top, connector for the cord on the side.

06-09-2010, 09:39 PM	#94
yeatzee Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Temecula Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,675 Original Poster	Originally posted by Blue Those cables will work for that as well. They are kind of pricey for what they are. Originally posted by Canada_Rockies Here are the parts you need. The hot shoe adapter is required to connect the cord to the camera. Check out which of the two versions you prefer. The cable comes in three lengths, I think - 0.5 m, 1.5m and 3.0 m. I am not sure if you need the off-camera shoe adapter with the 360 FGZ. I don't need it with my 540 FGZ as it has a direct cable connection. If you don't use it, you will need to hold the flash up somehow. Hot Shoe Adapter Fg or F. Fg allows the built-in flash to rise, but you cannot put a flash in the top. That's where the cable connects on the Fg Hot Shoe F will fit, but only with the built-in flash closed. it allows a flash to be mounted to it in a hot shoe on top. The cable connects on the side, blocking the built-in flash from rising. Extension Cord F5P (50 cm) or F5P L (1.5 m or 3m). Off-camera shoe adapter F. Tripod screw on the bottom, hot shoe on top, connector for the cord on the side. What about those cheap ebay ones?

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06-09-2010, 12:27 PM	#91
yeatzee Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Temecula Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,675 Original Poster	Im sorry, I do not know the correct term for the cable that connects the flash to the body using a wire. With my new DIY diffuser which has the 360 flash on camera, I can pop off 5 shots in rapid succession with the flash at around 1/8 or less power. I want to be able to do this but with the flash OFF camera. With these cables will I still get this performance? I've never understood PTTL and therefore have NEVER used it so thats not entirely relevant. So yes, the whole goal is to get the flash off camera with on camera performance with the onboard out of the equation.

06-09-2010, 01:36 PM	#92
Blue Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Florida Hill Country Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,377	Originally posted by yeatzee Im sorry, I do not know the correct term for the cable that connects the flash to the body using a wire. With my new DIY diffuser which has the 360 flash on camera, I can pop off 5 shots in rapid succession with the flash at around 1/8 or less power. I want to be able to do this but with the flash OFF camera. With these cables will I still get this performance? I've never understood PTTL and therefore have NEVER used it so thats not entirely relevant. So yes, the whole goal is to get the flash off camera with on camera performance with the onboard out of the equation. Those cables will work for that as well. They are kind of pricey for what they are.

06-10-2010, 08:02 AM	#95
Canada_Rockies Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Sparwood, BC, Canada Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,385	Originally posted by yeatzee What about those cheap ebay ones? I use only Pentax branded equipment whenever it exists. That is my personal quirk - well, one of them anyway - and may not fit your life style.

06-10-2010, 08:07 AM	#96
Blue Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Florida Hill Country Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,377	Originally posted by Canada_Rockies I use only Pentax branded equipment whenever it exists. That is my personal quirk - well, one of them anyway - and may not fit your life style. Yeatzee is a high school kid so I can understand him wanting to be frugal in places where he can i.e. 3rd party cables compared to Pentax optics. That said, its a mixed bag on the ebay stuff. Some are good and some not so good. Its a "pay your money and takes your chances" kind of thing. Maybe it wouldn't hurt to look at some of the more known peddlers like Jinfinance.

06-10-2010, 12:20 PM	#97
yeatzee Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Temecula Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,675 Original Poster	Yeah I was looking at ones from ebay sellers I've purchased from before...... I couldn't believe the price these were going for from 1st party manufacturers! I can do $20 but not ~$80 for a simple cable

06-11-2010, 12:28 AM	#98
Deni Veteran Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Tirana, Albania, South Europe, Planet Earth Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 621	If you get a bad cable from ebay Chinese sellers they all are very eager to work with you on sending a replacement. I ordered 2 rcrv-3 batteries and 2 chargers from ebay. The chargers gave out about 4.6 volts (instead of 4.2 volts) and the batteries were about 3.9 volts instead of 3 volts. I sent a message to each of the sellers. They promptly and without any charge sent out replacements without requesting me to send back the ones I got. So I ended up with 4 batteries and 3 chargers. The k100d works fine with them, so far, so ... With the cable, if u receive a bad one, you can ask, nicely for a replacement (as you don't believe in negative feedback) and they will always send one. Once you have 2 bad cables , you can hack one a make a good one. After all it is a very simple cable to make (about 5 wires inside and you just need to match the connections).

06-11-2010, 12:46 AM	#99
yeatzee Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Temecula Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,675 Original Poster	Well for now this is the solution I have come up with:

06-11-2010, 02:52 AM	#100
bjorsa Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Sweden Photos: Gallery Posts: 59	You can use a couplingring instead of tape but you probably need some stepuprings or stepdownrings to match the lensthread i often use a 135 mm with a reversed attached 50 mm and with couplingring and with that combo I get scale 2,7:1 (135/50=2,7:1) sorry for the English Kindly bjorsa

06-11-2010, 03:04 AM	#101
TOUGEFC Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Brisbane Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,561	Can some please tell me the formula used to work out the mag ratio, for a reversed lens directly onto the camera body and also the same again but with extension tubes added. Cheers.

06-11-2010, 03:09 AM	#102
yeatzee Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Temecula Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,675 Original Poster	Originally posted by TOUGEFC Can some please tell me the formula used to work out the mag ratio, for a reversed lens directly onto the camera body and also the same again but with extension tubes added. Cheers. +1 Originally posted by bjorsa You can use a couplingring instead of tape but you probably need some stepuprings or stepdownrings to match the lensthread i often use a 135 mm with a reversed attached 50 mm and with couplingring and with that combo I get scale 2,7:1 (135/50=2,7:1) sorry for the English Kindly bjorsa i would, but the filter rings are dented on the lenses I use

06-11-2010, 10:36 AM	#103
Marc Sabatella Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Denver, CO Photos: Gallery Posts: 10,685	I can't tell you a formula, but I can tell you that if you already have the lens, you don't need a formula. Just take out a ruler and focus on it as closely as you can. Since the sensor is basically 1" wide, if you can fill the frame with one inch, that's 1:1 magnification. If you can only focus close enough to fill the frame with two inches, that's 1:2. If you can focus close enough to fill the frame with 1/4 an inch, that's 4:1. Etc.

06-12-2010, 06:31 PM	#104
yeatzee Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Temecula Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,675 Original Poster	Well guys I just took 8 gigs worth of macro shots with the new setup and one key thing i've discovered that I thought I'd share. With the flash set to 1/16 power and my new macro flash setup, I can set the camera to continues drive mode and the flash will keep up until the buffer fills (atleast with RAW+ which is what I shoot). Hopefully I was able to get some good stacks using this new method Pictures will follow in the post your pictures section of the forum later... that is if I got any good ones

06-12-2010, 07:22 PM	#105
yeatzee Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Temecula Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,675 Original Poster	To show it off I did this test: 3 images stacked. I used F/5.6 to get the maximum sharpness I could... great test for stacking considering the microscopic DOF. Taken with the macro flash setup I posted earlier.