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11-24-2010, 05:04 PM   #136
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QuoteOriginally posted by GeneV Quote
It seems to me like 30 years ago, when you bought an off-brand lens, which tested as a less than stellar performer, there was more of a chance that the performance was truly abysmal so as to get in the way of your photos. Now, it seems like I can take a lens that legitimately tests "poorly" compared to others, and have to work hard to find the situation in which the difference in the lens resolution or vignetting or CA makes a difference in my photo.
So it seems that you are saying that the user ratings of 8-9 across the board are actually accurate. If there is such little difference between lenses, it must come down to personal preference. So why should anyone ever go for a more expensive lens over a cheaper one? (except maybe for WR?)

QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
- sample/test shots some people want sample shots, but others insist they must be either of subjects they (the reader) like, or museum/art gallery quality to make the review worthwhile and credible - everything is rated 8 or higher. True, but if all people want is gallery/museum quality shots this would be the case also.
I still feel i'm being misrepresented here. In my initial posts I was saying I used sample shots not to judge for myself the quality and issues, but to judge the experience of the photographer/reviewer.

Experience is important to me. A newbie to photography will tend to rate a cheap lens well because that's all they know. An experienced photographer will rate a more expensive/exotic lens well because they know the difference it makes.

QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
Your list above is a good starting point, and when the dust settles from this thread maybe what will come out of it is a guide on writing lens reviews, to be posted as a sticky, in the review database,
I think a Review Guide would be great. Some sort of pro former that can be followed, to make the reviews more uniform. Maybe even a form that is filled out which automatically formats the resulting review.

My favourite suggestion for improving the review section is the ability for users to rate reviews or reviewers, Amazon style.

11-24-2010, 05:20 PM   #137
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I certainly do not know how to fix this issue, but, after spending a week reading review after review of different len's to try and get up to speed on what i may like on my new K5, i can tell you i do not know what to get. When a reviewer tells you that the lens hunts so bad he cannot get the shot, when indoors, then gives the lens a 9 rating. Whats that all about?
Joe
11-24-2010, 06:30 PM   #138
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There's nothing that necessarily needs to be 'fixed' IMO.

If there were individual ratings for value for money, IQ, build quality and utility (incorporating size/weight and handling), then an overall rating could be averaged out from these sub-ratings and get perhaps a more representative overall score for the lens. This may have been mentioned before....

But as with every subjective measure, the worth of a lens is an individual score, and it is up to each user and potential-buyer to consider these things before a reasonable judgement can be made about the value and utility of a lens.
11-24-2010, 06:49 PM   #139
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QuoteOriginally posted by vario Quote
I certainly do not know how to fix this issue, but, after spending a week reading review after review of different len's to try and get up to speed on what i may like on my new K5, i can tell you i do not know what to get. When a reviewer tells you that the lens hunts so bad he cannot get the shot, when indoors, then gives the lens a 9 rating. Whats that all about?
Joe
That would be generally down to the camera used. You'll find the K-5 very decisive in that regard. The 9 might be because when he /she does manage to get it into focus it delivers a pleasing image

11-24-2010, 07:12 PM   #140
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Sacateurs

Regarding rating the reviews the only way I see is helpful on a scale 1-5 as you indicate, or to show the reviewers rating points

Regarding the photos if you only want super experienced reviewers I am afraid you will limit the reviewers so badly that it will also limit the lenses reviewed
11-25-2010, 12:04 AM   #141
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
Regarding the photos if you only want super experienced reviewers I am afraid you will limit the reviewers so badly that it will also limit the lenses reviewed
Good point. I don't necessarily want only "proven" reviewers. I will just weigh their opinions more heavily.

Inexperienced photographers / reviewers have to start somewhere!
11-25-2010, 12:12 AM   #142
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FYI, we will be bringing in a lot more professional reviews, so you'll have both a in-depth review available alongside consumer reviews for many lenses

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11-25-2010, 08:57 AM   #143
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
+/- compared to a "gold standard". Perhaps setting the K series pentax lenses at 5.
I guess that would result in no lens being rated higher than a 5.5 with most being rated a 3


Steve

11-25-2010, 09:12 AM   #144
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
I guess that would result in no lens being rated higher than a 5.5 with most being rated a 3


Steve
Yeah, I hear you

given the present rating practices where the K's are all 9's and no one rates greater than 9.5, or lower than about 7.,


But the idea is to leave the scale open ended so that people could expand just a little between 9.0 and 9.5

That is, of course they don;t have tunnel vision
11-25-2010, 09:56 AM   #145
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Or perhaps we should shift the ratings, so you can range a lens from 9.0 to 10 by 0.1s. A lens of 9.3 sounds so much better than a 3! ;-)
11-25-2010, 11:03 AM   #146
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It's human nature to never said I made a bad choice because... peoples want to sell it and they dont want the new buyer to know
11-25-2010, 11:35 AM   #147
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Lens ratings do not and should not need to fit any normal distribution of scores. The bell curve is useful for standardisation, but these are all absolute not relative ratings of user satisfaction.
11-25-2010, 11:52 AM   #148
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QuoteOriginally posted by secateurs Quote
So it seems that you are saying that the user ratings of 8-9 across the board are actually accurate. If there is such little difference between lenses, it must come down to personal preference. So why should anyone ever go for a more expensive lens over a cheaper one? (except maybe for WR?)
Lots of reasons to go for a 'more expensive' lens, which should be obvious to the user.
Anyone who thinks two lenses that equally score 9 averages but differ greatly in market price are the same probably has little appreciation of what the more expensive lens can do, so the cheaper one would suffice for him/her quite fine.

DA 55-300 currently at 8.95 vs. Sigma 70-200 f/2.8 II HSM currently at 8.58 - two totally different lenses at different price points despite overlapping focal ranges.

Then you have two optically similar lenses like the 18-55 II and 18-55 WR that score quite differently - the WR apparently less appealing according to the average rating!

That's why I suggest individual ratings for value, IQ, build and utility - then average these for each user's review and then average each of these averages and there may be a more representative score for each lens.
11-25-2010, 11:57 AM   #149
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Not so sure the intent of the reviews has ever been to provide a statistical comparison that can be graphed and analyzed.

To me, as a forum-based review section it's really just a compilation of opinions and impressions that may provide some personal insight for readers.

Most of the reviews I've added were of somewhat uncommon lenses that folks would like to know more about. My impressions have been offered as impressions not as tests or objective measures. The more rare the lens, the more important it is that somebody out there reports on it.
11-25-2010, 12:00 PM   #150
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ron Boggs Quote
Not so sure the intent of the reviews has ever been to provide a statistical comparison that can be graphed and analyzed.

To me, as a forum-based review section it's really just a compilation of opinions and impressions that may provide some personal insight for readers.

Most of the reviews I've added were of somewhat uncommon lenses that folks would like to know more about. My impressions have been offered as impressions not as tests or objective measures. The more rare the lens, the more important it is that somebody out there reports on it.
+1....

Ron, hope you are doing well!
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