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01-16-2011, 06:47 AM   #16
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Not to be condescending but there is the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 which is actually sharp at f/1.4 while for the FA50 f/1.4 is usually used at F/2.2 or higher to get the image sharp.

For film users, does the FA50 f/1.4 require stepping down?

Its one thing for a portrait lens to soften the image but nowadays, i rather have the picture sharp and the soften in post process.

Another hope for fast but reasonably affordable primes is Samyang. Heard this year they are going to work on AF versions.

01-16-2011, 07:08 AM   #17
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A very good and sharp alternative for a 50 mm made for digital is the DFA 50 mm MACRO, sharp, versatile, well made and relatively affordable. Only F1:2.8 but who needs 1.2 with a K5...
01-16-2011, 08:36 AM   #18
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What about the Samyang 85/1.4? Good price...

Samyang 85 mm f/1.4 Aspherical IF review - Summary - Lenstip.com
01-17-2011, 03:17 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Reportage Quote
Not to be condescending but there is the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 ...
QuoteOriginally posted by paperbag846 Quote
What about the Samyang 85/1.4? Good price...

...
Guys, this thread is about 50mm lenses, not 30mm or 85mm.

01-17-2011, 03:40 PM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by paperbag846 Quote
The F 50 1.7 deserves to be released in a plastic DA L shell. sold for slightly less than the DA 35 2.4.
Imagine you are John Carlson, Senior Manager of Sales and Marketing for Pentax Imaging USA. (A nice guy, BTW.) You decide to pitch this idea to the head office in Japan. They say, "But John, we're already selling a ton of FA 50/1.4s even after nearly doubling the price. We haven't changed anything on this lens in 20 years, so production has been paid for many times over. Profits per lens are huge! How can we make any money on a new lens, with a retail price of say $180? All we can reuse is the optical formula. It would steal sales from the FA, still cost more than the Nikon or Canon cheapies and still not be a normal."

Instead, John needs to be using all his power and charm to push a 24mm f2.
01-17-2011, 04:08 PM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by Reportage Quote
Not to be condescending but there is the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 which is actually sharp at f/1.4 while for the FA50 f/1.4 is usually used at F/2.2 or higher to get the image sharp.

For film users, does the FA50 f/1.4 require stepping down?

Its one thing for a portrait lens to soften the image but nowadays, i rather have the picture sharp and the soften in post process.

Another hope for fast but reasonably affordable primes is Samyang. Heard this year they are going to work on AF versions
.
Do you have a source for this? I have been looking at that lens, but it's MF only, an auto version that is reasonably priced would be a must have for me.
01-17-2011, 04:13 PM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by Reportage Quote
Not to be condescending but there is the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 which is actually sharp at f/1.4 while for the FA50 f/1.4 is usually used at F/2.2 or higher to get the image sharp.

For film users, does the FA50 f/1.4 require stepping down?
At 1.4 the DOF is so extreme that most of the time at portrait length I fear missing focus more than loss of resolution / sharpness. I usually shoot my FA 50 on film at f/2 at least. F1.4 more often than not will result in missed focus... this depends on the distance to subject of course.

At f/4 and full frame, the FA 50 is golden.

As for myself, I do find the f/1.4 a bit soft but not unusable, although I much prefer FA 50 at f/2 to f/4
01-17-2011, 04:40 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by Andi Lo Quote
...
At f/4 and full frame, the FA 50 is golden.
...
Okay, but so is the A 50 f/2 (at f/4).

What Pentax should do is release an AF 50mm based on the f/2 formula, and sell it around $125. It would be really easy and cheap for them to produce, and it would be enough different from the f/1.4 to justify having both in the lineup. Then Pentax would finally have a cheap, fast 50 to go up against the competition.

01-17-2011, 05:08 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by Steve Beswick Quote
Okay, but so is the A 50 f/2 (at f/4).

What Pentax should do is release an AF 50mm based on the f/2 formula, and sell it around $125. It would be really easy and cheap for them to produce, and it would be enough different from the f/1.4 to justify having both in the lineup. Then Pentax would finally have a cheap, fast 50 to go up against the competition.
But as others have points out, there is almost certainly more profit for them selling FA50/1.4 lenses than there could be on an DA50/2 lens selling for $125. Not to mention that if the DA50/2 would potentially hurt the sales of FA50/1.4 lenses, it would further hurt their bottom line.

Not saying it's impossible that they would release such a lens, I just think it's very unlikely.
01-17-2011, 06:07 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by dgaies Quote
But as others have points out, there is almost certainly more profit for them selling FA50/1.4 lenses than there could be on an DA50/2 lens selling for $125. Not to mention that if the DA50/2 would potentially hurt the sales of FA50/1.4 lenses, it would further hurt their bottom line.

Not saying it's impossible that they would release such a lens, I just think it's very unlikely.
But there is a flip side - for the consumer that is looking at the cost of a system, they can buy:

Pentax K-x & 18-55, black - $500
Pentax FA 50mm f/1.4 - $370
Total = $870

*OR*

Canon Rebel XSi & 18-55 IS lens - $630
Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II AF lens - $120
Total = $750

Now, I know and you know that the Canon 50mm f/1.8 is a POS that has a decent chance of falling apart in the owners hands. We also know that the Pentax has sensor shift IS, and a whole bunch of other benefits, but the average consumer does not know this, and will not learn it from scrolling the price list at adorama.com, bhphotovideo.com, etc. All they will learn is that Canon is $120 cheaper than Pentax for what they perceive to be comparable gear. Then they will talk to the soccer mom next door that just loves the Canon she bought last year a Target, and the decision is done. Why would average Joe pay more for a product from a less well known company?

Now try the above example with my idea for a lens:

Pentax K-x & 18-55, black - $500
Pentax DA 50mm f/2 - $140
Total = $640

Now Joe is looking at a comparable product from the lesser known of the two companies for $110 less. That $110 might just be enough to pique his curiosity into looking at Pentax.

Don't get me wrong, I'm pretty confident that Pentax is not going to release such a lens, except if the DA L 35 becomes a runaway success.
01-17-2011, 09:41 PM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by Steve Beswick Quote
But there is a flip side - for the consumer that is looking at the cost of a system, they can buy:
..........
Don't get me wrong, I'm pretty confident that Pentax is not going to release such a lens, except if the DA L 35 becomes a runaway success.
I agree with you regarding the logic of giving consumers as inexpensive of a starting system as possible. And, to a large extent, I think that's where the DA35/2.4 comes into play - as a somewhat inexpensive "normal" perspective lens for a crop sensor. I also think it made sense to release that over something like a DA50/2 because the FA35/2 was discontinued while the FA50/1.4 is still in production. Again, I'm certainly not against something like a DA50/2 coming out, I was just saying I didn't think it was very likely from Pentax's perspective.

FWIW, the Canon 50/1.8 II was the first prime I ever bought. True, it didn't have the greatest build, but it was a pretty outstanding lens for the $80 I paid.
01-17-2011, 09:53 PM   #27
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Slightly off topic, but when does the DA L 35mm come out? I plan on picking one up assuming it's up to the usual pentax quality we all love.
01-17-2011, 10:48 PM - 1 Like   #28
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DA-L 35/2.4 is already out
01-18-2011, 12:33 AM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by dgaies Quote
I agree with you regarding the logic of giving consumers as inexpensive of a starting system as possible. And, to a large extent, I think that's where the DA35/2.4 comes into play - as a somewhat inexpensive "normal" perspective lens for a crop sensor. I also think it made sense to release that over something like a DA50/2 because the FA35/2 was discontinued while the FA50/1.4 is still in production. Again, I'm certainly not against something like a DA50/2 coming out, I was just saying I didn't think it was very likely from Pentax's perspective.

FWIW, the Canon 50/1.8 II was the first prime I ever bought. True, it didn't have the greatest build, but it was a pretty outstanding lens for the $80 I paid.
If the price on the DA (L?) 35mm f/2.4 ever gets appreciably under $200 I will start to agree with you. I already do regarding the slim chance of ever seeing a DA 50/2.

"Pentax: If it makes marketing sense, we don't do it."
01-18-2011, 09:06 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by Steve Beswick Quote
Pentax K-x & 18-55, black - $500
Pentax DA 50mm f/2 - $140
Total = $640
QuoteOriginally posted by Steve Beswick Quote
Canon Rebel XSi & 18-55 IS lens - $630
Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II AF lens - $120
Total = $750
I've yet to see one good reason why a DA L 50 1.7 would have to be so much more expensive. It could sit comfortably at the 180-200 range.

The argument "it's too good" is sort of a moot point. The Canon 50mm 1.8 cannibalizes tonnes of sales of the faster glass, despite it's shortcomings. I know enough people who think the plastic fantastic is good enough, and the 50mm 1.7 is NOT simply superior to the 1.4, the 1.4 is the better lens for those who want the good bokeh and smoother rendering. In fact, I think the 50mm 1.7 is not really that amazing for low-to-mid aperture work compared to the 1.4 because the backgrounds become to distracting.

There should ideally be about 3 DAL primes for cheapos who want some short DOF stuff. It would be a good way to get people into the limiteds in the long term, who are not happy with the manual focus options.

Hell make the DA L 50 1.7 prone to fall apart like the Canon 1.8. It does not seem to tarnish that lens' overall reputation as a killer value.

The 50mm f2 is IMHO a weak offering and should just die.
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