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03-15-2011, 11:57 AM   #1
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K-mount to Microscope adapters? 1" tube & Olympus

Hello,
DOES ANYONE KNOW ABOUT MICROSCOPE PHOTO TUBES?

I an doing a lot of insect taxonomy these days and i have to send many photos to people far smarter than me. I hope to hook my k200d up so some microscopes at school. K-mount is preferred but I have found m42 to k-mount adapters for <$5. (links: 1 2 3 4 )

Problem 1
Our lab has a compound Olympus and a dissecting Meiji (that I hate) both with a standard 1 photo tube. What do you suggest to attach my K-mount Pentax to these scopes.
I see several el cheapo made in china options on ebay for <$20. Are those OK? (links: 1 2 3 4 5 obviously best but >$). Opinions appreciated.

Problem 2
My favorite scope is an Olympus SZ series. I have a SZ-60 with a photo tube that runs to a SZ-PT adapter ending in a 23mmID 36mmOD reversed dovetail. Currently there is a Olympus OM tube running from that dovetail to a Olympus SLR mount for an old film camera. Is there anyway to make this fit my Pentax SLR?

Will this (link) by chance fit that 23mmID 36mmOD reversed dovetail? plus a t to k adapter 1 2

I have been told that unscrewing the olympus 4/3 SLR mount and replacing it with a pentax k mount is not not going to work because Olympus put there film a little closer to the mount than cannon, nikon, and pentax. Is this true?

This is an ok link to describe the convoluted Olympus system:
Photomicro Adapter L Olympus OM photomicro group
I have either an pm-adf, pm-adg, or pm-adp adapter that attaches a 23mmID 36mmOD reversed dovetail to a 1" universal photo tube. This could be used to make the solution for Problem 2 work on Problem 1.


I am not switching scopes so often that I need to have all 3 setup and adjusted. I am ok with a long setup time moving from one to the other if that saves money.

We take photos only for head measurement and taxonomy. My lab is ok with mediocre quality photos. Our lab has hit some major funding cuts with the endemic state/fed deficits. So if you have makeshift DIY alternatives to any of these requests that would be greatly appreciated.

I have sent similar inquiries to microscope dealers across the US and if i hear of any solutions i will post them here. But they are unlikely to give a positive an honest opinion on those ebay auctions that i linked to.

Thanks in advance for the help


Last edited by cadmus; 03-15-2011 at 12:27 PM.
03-15-2011, 12:35 PM   #2
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For problem 2:
Will this leitax adapter work if i replace the olympus om 4/3 bayonet on the Olympus SZ scope.
Olympus OM lens for Pentax cameras
Or will i have focal distance issues?

I was told Olympus lenses will never be usable on a Pentax body because of focal distances. Is that true?

If i found a damaged pentax k mount lens and attached the male mount exactly where the Olympus male mount was would it work? If not would i be able to make it wok by shimming it up a little? (the leitax converter looks kinda thick)

The screw holes that hold the bayonet on the Olympus does not match any of my pentax lenses. Is it safe to say that that Zuiko converter will line up? or are screw hole patterns not constant across manufacturers of the same mount?

Last edited by cadmus; 03-15-2011 at 08:10 PM.
03-15-2011, 12:41 PM - 1 Like   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by cadmus Quote
Hello,
DOES ANYONE KNOW ABOUT MICROSCOPE PHOTO TUBES?

I an doing a lot of insect taxonomy these days and i have to send many photos to people far smarter than me. I hope to hook my k200d up so some microscopes at school. K-mount is preferred but I have found m42 to k-mount adapters for <$5. (links: 1 2 3 4 )

Problem 1
Our lab has a compound Olympus and a dissecting Meiji (that I hate) both with a standard 1 photo tube. What do you suggest to attach my K-mount Pentax to these scopes.
I see several el cheapo made in china options on ebay for <$20. Are those OK? (links: 1 2 3 4 5 obviously best but >$). Opinions appreciated.

Problem 2
My favorite scope is an Olympus SZ series. I have a SZ-60 with a photo tube that runs to a SZ-PT adapter ending in a 23mmID 36mmOD reversed dovetail. Currently there is a Olympus OM tube running from that dovetail to a Olympus SLR mount for an old film camera. Is there anyway to make this fit my Pentax SLR?

Will this (link) by chance fit that 23mmID 36mmOD reversed dovetail?

I have been told that unscrewing the olympus 4/3 SLR mount and replacing it with a pentax k mount is not not going to work because Olympus put there film a little closer to the mount than cannon, nikon, and pentax. Is this true?

This is an ok link to describe the convoluted Olympus system:
Photomicro Adapter L Olympus OM photomicro group
I have either an pm-adf, pm-adg, or pm-adp adapter that attaches a 23mmID 36mmOD reversed dovetail to a 1" universal photo tube. This could be used to make the solution for Problem 2 work on Problem 1.


I am not switching scopes so often that I need to have all 3 setup and adjusted. I am ok with a long setup time moving from one to the other if that saves money.

We take photos only for head measurement and taxonomy. My lab is ok with mediocre quality photos. Our lab has hit some major funding cuts with the endemic state/fed deficits. So if you have makeshift DIY alternatives to any of these requests that would be greatly appreciated.

I have sent similar inquiries to microscope dealers across the US and if i hear of any solutions i will post them here. But they are unlikely to give a positive an honest opinion on those ebay auctions that i linked to.

Thanks in advance for the help
Hello, I'm glad you asked this question--I'll be interested in any other photomicrographer setups.

I don't have a specific solution for your phototube problem, other than to say that I have seen M42 mount to C mount couplers--at that point--if you can convert your K to C mount--then you have lots of options on tubes.

There are several microscope places--and I can refer you to one that we have used in our lab before--they may be able to machine a tube with your coupling (K mount) for you.

I bought into Pentax exactly to avoid the whole mess, and now I shoot my marine worms (polychaetes) through the ocular lens--and I do it hand-held.

I know that may sound a bit primitive--and may not be applicable for everyone, but I use any prime lens from 28mm to 100mm to take my images on several scopes, including the Wild M5, and Leica MZ 12--the trick is to use a hood like model number MH-RC49mm attached to the prime lens (this is the hood that comes with the DA SMCP-70mm f/2.4).


Here's a link to some photos I took at a lab I was visiting (Crustaceans--roughly like insects to me :=)--I can't even remember what scope they had--I just brought my Pentax K-x and started shooting away.

SCAMIT Barcode meeting - wormlab's Photos

I found that because pentax primes are usually 49mm diameter outside filter thread--they are just the right size to to shoot through a 30mm eyepiece (for stereo photomicrography). Works well for compound scope work also--but a bit more fidgety.

-W
03-15-2011, 07:58 PM   #4
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Wormtographer,
Ohhh, you're a barcoder huh? Very cool. You're my new best friend. Can I ask some favors? As part of an unusual project I have 4 day old Baetis (Ephemeroptera) nymphs that i need a a positive ID on but can not do it morphologically until they are 3 months old and I can not rear them past 5 days. Can i just mush um up in some PCR solution and have a barcode wizard like yourself ID it for me?

(I am trying to be funny you are not instantly required to help me just because we both shoot pentax, but i will be shooting you a pm asking some questions about who barcodes baetis )



Last edited by cadmus; 03-16-2011 at 12:47 PM. Reason: Because my humor was hard to pick up and it looked like i was drafting Wormtographer into a huge unwanted commitment
03-15-2011, 08:01 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wormtographer Quote
....I bought into Pentax exactly to avoid the whole mess, and now I shoot my marine worms (polychaetes) through the ocular lens--and I do it hand-held....
-W
I have been shooting through the ocular lens with my point and shoot for some time. It works ok. But i have 3 scopes with photo tubes and it would be nice to have a permanently fixed mount. Especially when measuring (consistent magnification).

Also it would be convenient, I use the scope for hours and hours iding (2000 org/day) and when i hit a organism too small to ID (20 times a day) I then have to snap the pic and send it to an expert in that taxonomic group. But i have to do this while using both hands to hold the organism in a position to display key characteristics, focusing with my feet. if i do not have a lab assistant to press the shutter button i will have to have the remote in my teeth hoping i hold steady long enough to the long shutter time.

Keeping the camera on the photo tube away from my head is required for what i am doing.
But i like the hood idea.

Last edited by cadmus; 03-16-2011 at 07:28 AM.
03-16-2011, 06:01 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by cadmus Quote
Hello,
DOES ANYONE KNOW ABOUT MICROSCOPE PHOTO TUBES?


Problem 1
Our lab has a compound Olympus and a dissecting Meiji (that I hate) both with a standard 1” photo tube. What do you suggest to attach my K-mount Pentax to these scopes.
So far as I know. any of them should work. I have one that looks like the first on your list - they are simple mechanical devices and hard to screw up badly.

QuoteQuote:
Problem 2
My favorite scope is an Olympus SZ series. I have a SZ-60 with a photo tube that runs to a SZ-PT adapter ending in a 23mmID 36mmOD reversed dovetail. Currently there is a Olympus OM tube running from that dovetail to a Olympus SLR mount for an old film camera. Is there anyway to make this fit my Pentax SLR?
Olympus says that scope has a c mount - why nor use it? http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=pentax+c-mount+adapter&_sacat=0&_odkw=%22ol....c0.m270.l1313 If the 'scope is the male c-mount (1"-32 tpi) an adapter would be easy to make

If you kludge up an adapter (like olympus lens - PK mount) the distance will likely be wrong and you'll have to focus through the camera .... but you may have to do that anyhow.

Last edited by newarts; 03-16-2011 at 07:26 AM.
03-16-2011, 08:33 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wormtographer Quote
I don't have a specific solution for your phototube problem, other than to say that I have seen M42 mount to C mount couplers--at that point--if you can convert your K to C mount--then you have lots of options on tubes.
QuoteOriginally posted by newarts Quote
Olympus says that scope has a c mount - why nor use it? pentax c-mount adapter items - Get great deals on Cameras Photo, Electronics items on eBay.com! If the 'scope is the male c-mount (1"-32 tpi) an adapter would be easy to make
OK clearly i am missing something. Where on the SZ60 is a c mount? Where did you read that?

I saw "Olympus SZ4045 TRPT, SZ6045 TRPT or SZ1145 TRPT (most trinocular models have the SZ-CTV C-mount adapter, which is interchangeable with the SZ-PT)" and those models are not unlike the sz60. And the sz60 has a sz-pt.
Is THIS the dimensions of the C mount (from here)
I will try to find that on the scope when i am back in the lab.
will it be male or female on the scope?

QuoteOriginally posted by newarts Quote
If you kludge up an adapter (like olympus lens - PK mount) the distance will likely be wrong and you'll have to focus through the camera .... but you may have to do that anyhow.
Are you saying i will need to have a prime lens in this system or that i will have to refocus the microscope and look through the camera? originally the system had no prime, they just clicked the olympus slr onto the mount. The slr was always in focus when the oculars were in focus, "parfocal". Parfocal is ideal, but I can't be a beggar and a chooser. I should likely just go with the "problem 1" set up and accept the fact that it will not be parfocal and i will have to use the meiji. I was hopeing to hammer out "problem 2" because when my wife pays off her student loans and i am allowed to buy a scope it will be a SZ series olympus. I got a few years.

Thanks for the C-mount info and ideas you two. C, T, K, M42, OM, When will it end?

I have responses from scope companies and gurus and will post those later today.

Thanks, Pete
03-16-2011, 09:19 AM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by cadmus Quote
OK clearly i am missing something. Where on the SZ60 is a c mount? Where did you read that?
I followed the link you gave to OLYMPUS SZ60, OLYMPUS SZ6045 STEREOZOOM MICROSCOPE

It says "MICROSCOPE IS CAMERA READY WITH ATTACHED C-MOUNT" last sentence 1st paragraph.

QuoteQuote:
Are you saying i will need to have a prime lens in this system or that i will have to refocus the microscope and look through the camera?
No lens -Look thru camera - because DIY tube will probably be the wrong length unless you do precise adjustment of tube length - not rocket science just a precise one time adjustment.

Good luck!

03-16-2011, 02:10 PM   #9
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OK i understand. The C-mount is the "23mmID 36mmOD reversed dovetail" atop the scope but below the L tube. Thanks for pointing that out.

I removed the olympus OM male bayonet with a little swearing and a smurf sized easyout. (note that this OM mount is not as thick as i thought) After focusing the ocular lenses I laid my Pentax k200d on the top of L tube. The image was very close to perfect. The male k-mount that I was hoping to take off a damaged MF lens is too thick and irregular to mount to the L tube, also the screws will not line up and no hardware store sells taps that small. It is possible that the Leitax will work, but will the irregular surface between the (now removed) OM mount and the L tube match the bottom of the Leitax? can't tell? I will send a photo to Leitax.

Coincidentally i found a 1" universal photo tube to male c-mount adapter in a box of microscope parts. (like shown here) That let me attach the L tube to the 2 scopes in "problem 1". When I placed the 2.5x NFK photo eyepeice from the olympus in the 1" universal photo tube I had good focus matched with the oculars. When the 2.5x NFK photo eyepeice was not there it was not useable.

I then tried holding the camera close to the C-mount and any of the 3 scopes trying to simulate the C-mount to K adapter i was unable to get it to focus when changing distance from the C-mount and/or focusing the microscope with or without the 2.5x NFK photo eyepiece. That doesn't mean much because i am just holding it, and cupping my hands to simulate the mount, but it isn't obvious that it will work.

I am getting discouraged enough to give up on the goal of parfocal and i don't NEED to be using the olympus scope. I am guessing the "1" to K-mount" or the "C to K" will work on the meiji even if i can not get it in focus using my hands. Do you think the these 1"to K adapters (links: 1 2 3 4 5 obviously best but >$) or the C-mount to K-mounts use the 2.5x NFK photo eyepiece or not?

But first i want to find out if the leitax will work on the L tube. That will be in budget.

If anyone has a broken Pentax k-mount lens and wants to donate the bayonet I might try to macgyver something.

Thanks for the feedback wormtographer and newarts. It helped.

I will post the emails i just got from microscope companies in case someone else in the years to come is trying to do the same thing.

Last edited by cadmus; 03-16-2011 at 04:14 PM.
03-16-2011, 02:46 PM   #10
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I am placing these emails here for reference if anyone in the future is trying to solve these puzzles. No need to read it unless you are trying to mount a Pentax DSLR to a Olympus SZ microscope. Sorry for the length but SZs are the one of the most common scopes out there and Pentax should be the most common camera out there, someone might need this... -Pete
_____________________________________________________________
Correspondence with Alan Wood of http://www.alanwood.neta great website about olympus scopes and phototubes.
My Questions are in normal font with >'s and responses are BOLD

>Question 1:
>My lab has a SZ-60 with what I think is a OM Photomicro Adapter L tube. I am
>basing that only on what I learned from your AWSOME website as there is no
>markings other than the ‘Olympus’ and ‘OM’ logo.
>I was not around when the lab had an Olympus film camera nor were any of my
>peers. Lets say I focus in on some bug in the ocular lens and I flip the little
>lever in the back to open the photo tube. Is the camera in focus or must I
>refocus the microscope to get the camera in focus?
1) With an all-Olympus system, the camera and the viewfinder image are
parfocal (in focus at the same time).

If you remove the Photomicro Adapter L, is there a 2.5x NFK photo eyepiece
sitting in the SZ-PT photo tube? If it is missing, then you will need to search
eBay for one. A 3.3x NFK will also work, but it will have a smaller field of
view.
Does anyone in your lab use a Canon EOS digital SLR? They are very easy to use
as a replacement for an OM body, using a cheap Chinese adapter from eBay. Not
only parfocal, but the EOS Utility software that comes with the camera lets you
check focus, compose, and control the camera from a computer screen.

> Question 2:
> My lab is too broke to buy an Olympus camera for the microscope. So I have to
>figure a way to mount my Pentax K-mount DSL to it.
> You recommend a PA1-10A, I assume I then put a T-mount to K-mount adapter to
>it. If I do this will the camera be in focus when the ocular is in focus?
2) I think it will be parfocal, but you need to ask Diagnostic Instruments to
be sure. I have never seen or used a PA1-10A.


> Question 3:
> If the PA1-10A is out of my price range? Is there an other alternative?
3) I do not know of any alternative.

> Question 4:
> What is the difference in length from the mounting surface of the L tube and
>the PA1-10A? If I needed to fabricate a tube or modify the L tube how long
>should it be? Will I have to move the fixed aperture that I see in the L tube?
>If i make it telescoping will that ensure that the camera is always in focus
>when the ocular is? Will the Aperture also have to be movable?

4) PA1-10A fitted with an Olympus OM T-mount should be exactly the same length
as the Adapter L. The fixed aperture in the Adapter L should not be moved; it
is located at the point where the beam of light from the NFK is at its
narrowest. If you want to make a telescoping adapter, then move only the camera
mount. It should be possible to make your camera parfocal with the aid of a
telescoping adapter.


He then included this link and observation:
The Olympus OM has a registration distance of 46 mm,
so it is easy to make a 2 mm deep adapter for a Canon
EOS with a 44 mm The Pentax K is 45.46 mm, so you only
have 0.54 mm for an adapter, almost impossible to
make.


http://www.graphics.cornell.edu/~westin/misc/mounts-by-register.html



_____________________________________________________________________
Bobby at Martin Microscopes
gave the following but all are out of my price range, but good info.

....We have a couple of options for you. With regard to your Olympus SZ series, we have a tube, MBH2T, that fits the Olympus reversed dovetail and accepts a standard T-mount on the top end. So, in this case, you'd use your existing Olympus photoeyepiece. The MBH2T costs $275.00, plus $25.00 for the Pentax K T-mount (T2-3). That's probably your best option for that particular microscope.

The other option is our MM-SLR universal adapter ($425.00) that has a built-in 2.5x photoeyepiece and also takes a standard T-mount ring. That adapter can fit your Olympus SZ with the addition of our MMBH2 Clamp ($50.00). It will also fit the Meiji type 25mm phototube with the addition of our MM25TC Clamp ($50.00). So, that would be the adapter to choose to fit all the microscopes you have, but I suspect you may get better results on the SZ using Olympus' own photoeyepiece.

I'm curious why you dislike the Meiji microscope so much? We rather like those.

So, here's a recap of the parts and prices:

TO FIT OLYMPUS SZ ONLY: (totals $300.00)
MBH2T T-mount Tube for Olympus reversed dovetail mount $275.00
T2-3 Pentax K T-mount ring $25.00

TO FIT ALL THREE MICROSCOPES: (totals $550.00)
MM-SLR Universal SLR Adapter with 2.5x photoeyepiece $425.00
MMBH2 Clamp for Olympus reversed dovetail $50.00
MM25TC 25mm Tube Clamp $50.00
T2-3 Pentax K T-mount ring $25.00


______________________________________________________________________
LEEDS FORENSICS gave me this responce, again great products but out of my price range.

You might be able to use the current SLR coupler by replacing a T2 to OM adapter with a T2 to Pentax K adapter. Can you unthread the OM bayonet mount? Are there any markings on the tube between the camera body and the SZ-PT? I take it there is a NFK 2.5X eyepiece installed in the SZ-PT?

The downside to using the existing film SLR interface with a digital camera is the field of view will be reduced. You didn’t mention the model of camera you will be using, but I believe most Pentax dSLR camera sensors are approximately 23.6mm x 15.8mm while 35mm film was 36mm x 24mm. To get a field of view that is more similar to that of a film camera, you can use a coupler with a 1.6X magnification. Qioptic offers a coupler that could be used with a couple of different clamps allowing it to be used with the SZ and the microscopes with 25mm OD phototubes.

1ea 25-71-53-000 Camera Coupler Body 1.6X $546.00
1ea 25-70-22-000 H-Clamp for ADF (SPT) $102.00
1ea 25-70-12-000 J-Clamp for 25mm Tube $ 64.00
1ea PXBC-T2 T-Mount for Pentax SLR $ 35.00
_______________________________________________________________________________
Readers finding this useful should also look at this thread
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/135398-how-do-...s-k-mount.html



Last edited by cadmus; 03-16-2011 at 02:55 PM.
03-16-2011, 03:44 PM   #11
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What are the odds you would post this today?

I was about to post the forum for PK to T adapter for photgraphing through Lieca Stereo scope. I was wondering if I needed to equip a lens or use an adapter straight to the Microscope photo tube. If I read this right, straight to the tube would do it.

Thanks for sharing. I think I'll pick up the reversing ring adapter for macro pics and the the T adapter mount at the same time.
03-17-2011, 01:30 PM   #12
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Hey all, especially cadmus.

Sorry, been so busy--haven't had a chance to look here.

First, I am not a barcoder--so sorry on that account. I'm a straight arrow traditional morphology-based taxonomist.

I have thousands of photos I shoot through one or another microscope per week, so I do it all the time--and I think about it all the time.

I thought about your K mount phototube--and it occurred to me that a simple solution would be using macro extension tubes. I tried it today, and Voila it worked.

For a more elegant DIY project a handy toilet paper roll tube and some black electrical tape would nicely finish off the coupling to the microscope phototube. This and a little experimenting would give you the exact focal length for your setup.

I took photos, and I'll post them when I get home today.

-W
03-17-2011, 06:04 PM   #13
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Here is the 50mm extension macro tube that I "adapted" as a microscope coupling phototube. I can't believe I hadn't considered this very simple idea before. Really couldn't possibly be simpler--a $10 dollar solution.

DIYKMountPhototube - wormlab's Photos

I tried this setup, Camera (K-X) + Macro extension tube (No lens on camera): Camera Sensor directly over eyepiece, or over trinocular tube with photo relay lens inside trinoc tube.

I'm still convinced that a Pentax camera + lens hand-held to an eyepiece is the simplest way to take photomicrographs--and the trick is to use prime small, relatively fast prime lenses.

F/2.8 or lower is what I use to avoid vignetting.

-W
03-23-2011, 10:50 AM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wormtographer Quote
Hey all, especially cadmus.
First, I am not a barcoder--so sorry on that account. I'm a straight arrow traditional morphology-based taxonomist.
-W
Ohh. Good for you. I didn't know barecoders ever talked to us traditional taxonomists. I heard they just made up names and used dice for identifications.
(that was a good spirited razzing not a serious comment)

I purchased one of these:
Microscope adapter for PENTAX K MOUNT SLR & DSLR CAMERA | eBay
based on my adhac measurements it should be in focus on my meiji when the oculars are. But i am going to build something for the olympus and it will likely start with your macroextention tube idea or a teli converter and ABS plastic tube. But i want to make a micro adjuster and need to find something appropriate.

Well done on the DIY macrotube movable phototube adapter!!!

Last edited by cadmus; 03-24-2011 at 07:08 AM.
03-23-2011, 01:40 PM   #15
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This would be a good topic to smooth up and send to the Articles section, guys. H2
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