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View Poll Results: Wich DA-L lens to develop next?
DA-L 18mm/f4 713.73%
DA-L 60mm/f2.8 917.65%
DA-L 90mm/f2.8 917.65%
DA-L 70mm/f4 1:2 macro 1019.61%
My new idea for a DA-L lens is.... 917.65%
Stop developing new DA-L lenses. 2039.22%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 51. You may not vote on this poll

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06-22-2011, 10:45 AM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
As far as you "degrading and judgmental" comment, that's your personal problem. You were pretty damn snide with your "shame on them" comment when you were being a bit self centered with your own opinions about your "wants" from Pentax.
Pentax has a pretty robust limited line of primes that are top-notch in the build quality department, the DA L series is smart because it gets young people to buy into the system, who will eventually spend their money on limited lenses and DA * lenses.

You can't expect new photographers to buy into a lens system that is primarily expensive glass. With no budget offerings, people will buy nikon or canon, who both offer entry level 28mm, 50mm, 85mm lenses in the f1.8 range. Pentax refuses to match them in speed (thankfully they do match in quality), but for gods sakes, they need more than just a 35. One option would be for a cheap 85, but I could understand if they did 55 instead. In fact, I hope they do.

If you think like a pentax exec, it's foolish to not introduce more cheap primes IMHO. Young people love portrait photography and an affordable fast 50 on a crop body does them just fine (even if it's not a perfect solution).

06-22-2011, 11:02 AM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by paperbag846 Quote
Pentax has a pretty robust limited line of primes that are top-notch in the build quality department, the DA L series is smart because it gets young people to buy into the system, who will eventually spend their money on limited lenses and DA * lenses.

You can't expect new photographers to buy into a lens system that is primarily expensive glass. With no budget offerings, people will buy nikon or canon, who both offer entry level 28mm, 50mm, 85mm lenses in the f1.8 range. Pentax refuses to match them in speed (thankfully they do match in quality), but for gods sakes, they need more than just a 35. One option would be for a cheap 85, but I could understand if they did 55 instead. In fact, I hope they do.

If you think like a pentax exec, it's foolish to not introduce more cheap primes IMHO. Young people love portrait photography and an affordable fast 50 on a crop body does them just fine (even if it's not a perfect solution).
You completely missed my point and obviously missed the part where I said it was a good idea to have the DA 35/2.4 AL. I think another prime or 2 would be good as well. However, when the Execs you are so fond of mentioning get involved, there is a big risk of them deciding to turn out that sort of stuff predominantly. Besides, there was a fast 50 that was affordable 3 years ago. It was the FA 50/1.4 at $199. They announced it was discontinued and then brought it back at $359. What you are proposing is they bring something out like a 50/2 which would be along the lines of the A 50/2 which was an average glass. I personally would rather buy into something that is going to hold up over the haul, but then again it is a throw away society. And how is a good rectilinear 18/4 going to price out against a DA 15mm LTD? Pentax had a Legendary K 18/4 they could draw that would probably out do the DA 15, but it probably wouldn't be a cheap production per se.

Edit: What this poll was essentially asking in part was if people wanted Pentax to put the DA 15 and 70 into a plastic housing and sell them without hoods for about $300.
06-22-2011, 11:16 AM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by KxBlaze Quote
The 55-300 DAL is optically just as good as the DA version but is 1/2 the price. The 35mm while not technically an L version, basically is and is miles cheaper than the DA ltd. I don't think it's too much to ask for a 70mm DAL 1:2 macro for around $250-$300.
hmmmmm...... a 70mm f2 macro looks to be an interesting and promising concept. although I'm highly doubtful that Pentax would make such a lens a DAL just to make it more affordable for most consumers. for me, a move like that wouldn't make sense, especially for a lens with such potential and could offer a high premium by making it another LTD quality macro in the short telephoto end rather than cripple it. besides, it would cannibalize the sales of both existing DA70 LTD and FA77 LTD if they were to price the hypothetical 70/2 macro around $300 which isn't really a good move. doing such will only seal the fate of the two other lenses. such a lens would be price around the Tamron 60 macro and it's fortunate for Pentax that the Tamron 60/2 is not available for the K-mount, otherwise it could be trouble for Pentax lenses. the Tammy lens for example is not exactly the best in terms of cosmetic build, yet it already commands a significant premium just by the optics alone. so I can't envision a Pentax 70 macro to be any cheaper at all. pricing this lens is rather tricky since it's aperture is nearly identical to the FA77 and the focal length is the same with the cheaper 70mm LTD. it can't go cheaper than the DA70 and can't be priced along FA77 unless they purposely discontinue the FA77 and the priced the 70/2 around $900 if it performs better than the FA77. the DA70 will remain as the budget lens while the 100 WR would be more for rugged all-weather telephoto macro use. the 70/2 would then serve as a classic short-tele portrait/macro lens.
06-22-2011, 11:21 AM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pentaxor Quote
hmmmmm...... a 70mm f2 macro looks to be an interesting and promising concept. although I'm highly doubtful that Pentax would make such a lens a DAL just to make it more affordable for most consumers.
Try this story over again with a different lens:
DA-L 70mm/f4 1:2 macro
So it is a moderate fast lens (f4) with a moderate macro function, not 1:1 but 1:2 enlargement. Wich is still an enormous step forward since kitlenses get to 1:3 for 18-55 and 1:4 for the 50-200.

06-22-2011, 11:40 AM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
Try this story over again with a different lens:
DA-L 70mm/f4 1:2 macro
So it is a moderate fast lens (f4) with a moderate macro function, not 1:1 but 1:2 enlargement. Wich is still an enormous step forward since kitlenses get to 1:3 for 18-55 and 1:4 for the 50-200.
this would be ok for the $250-$300 price point. the question however is the market demand for it. I mean, how many would want such a lens? maybe you could start a poll regarding 70mm options and price for each?
06-22-2011, 11:48 AM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
there is a big risk of them deciding to turn out that sort of stuff predominantly.
I think this is a false assumption. they make more money per fa, da limited unit sold than the margins on a da l 35mm
06-22-2011, 11:57 AM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by paperbag846 Quote
I think this is a false assumption. they make more money per fa, da limited unit sold than the margins on a da l 35mm
On the just 1 "budget" prime such as the current DA 35/2.4 AL, you are probably correct. I was cautioning against a whole bloody catalog of them. Adding 1 more, maybe 2 to the catalog would help, but I think 4 or 5 would be too many. You guys need to quit calling it a DA L 35 because that is not its official name. They could have and probably should have named it that but probably decided to down play the plasti-mount. The original misnomer resulted from a typo during the pre-release promotion.


Digital Cameras and Accessories - Official PENTAX Imaging Web Site


Edit: Another problem I see with a 18mm lens of comparable build is that it would have to be faster and have better IQ to out compete the 18-55 WR at 18mm to entice new comers and others to "upgrade." That alone would be a risk to the 15 ltd.

Edit: Edit: While Pentax has 8 lenses in the DA and FA Ltd lines in their catalog, Nikon has 8 manual focus Nikkor and micro-Nikkor in their catalog which includes an 35/1.4 with an msrp of $1164.95.

http://www.nikonusa.com/Nikon-Products/Camera-Lenses/Manual/index.page

Last edited by Blue; 06-22-2011 at 12:47 PM.
06-22-2011, 12:06 PM   #38
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I think Pentax needs a cheap, fast (f/<2) 50mm, in the under $200 price range. Canon and Nikon both have this for less than $150 new.

I would vote for the 18mm, but I think it has to be faster than the kit lens to sell. So <f/3.5. Either that, or it has to be wider than the kit lens. This would provide two benefits: The first, prime-level IQ. The second: a wider field of view. So a 16mm f/4 would probably work.


Last edited by Designosophy; 06-22-2011 at 12:07 PM. Reason: Voting is closed.
06-22-2011, 12:36 PM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by Designosophy Quote
I think Pentax needs a cheap, fast (f/<2) 50mm, in the under $200 price range. Canon and Nikon both have this for less than $150 new.

I would vote for the 18mm, but I think it has to be faster than the kit lens to sell. So <f/3.5. Either that, or it has to be wider than the kit lens. This would provide two benefits: The first, prime-level IQ. The second: a wider field of view. So a 16mm f/4 would probably work.

Pentax had this covered until they raised the price on the FA 50/1.4 which split the difference on Nikon's 1.8 and 1.4. There was a similar situation with the FA 35/2. The Pentax lenses were better than any of the other lineup.
06-22-2011, 01:27 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
Pentax had this covered until they raised the price on the FA 50/1.4 which split the difference on Nikon's 1.8 and 1.4. There was a similar situation with the FA 35/2. The Pentax lenses were better than any of the other lineup.
I don't think the FA 50 1.4 is better than ALL of the Nikon 50's. Just most of them.

Now it's priced to match their second most expensive 50, so it does not strike me as a great bargain.

I love the 50 1.4 (would love it a LOT more if it was 55mm), but I think there is room for a 50mm f1.8. It does not really step on any of the other lenses toes (anyone who wants an FA ltd will know that the sharpness is not going to compare), too different from DA 40, different enough from the few FA 50's still floating around, even more different from the DA * 55mm.

I think what they should actually do is make a reissue of the K 55 1.8, perhaps make it 2.0. That would be a wonderful entry portrait lens.
06-22-2011, 04:28 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote

As far as you "degrading and judgmental" comment, that's your personal problem. You were pretty damn snide with your "shame on them" comment when you were being a bit self centered with your own opinions about your "wants" from Pentax. For example, I don't particularly plan to by the DA 35/2.4 AL unless I get it bundled with something. However, I think it is a good lens for Pentax to keep in the line-up. My opinions in these threads of this type have to do with the overall lineup and not just what interests me because good well thought out lineup will help Pentax be sustainable into the future.
That's not a problem, I'm letting you know how your comments came across to me because you mentioned my age as the factor in me not understanding. I am not angry in any way but felt like you were judging me (I apologize for using the word degrading, it was to harsh of a word) because you thought I was immature because of my age and my "shame" comment was said with a smile (ala Three's company, Felipe said it a lot).

What I want from Pentax would not hurt anybody (more L version lenses) where as others saying Pentax should not make anymore L lenses would hurt those on a budget so how am I being self centered? I am not angry, I was trying to point out some of my observations. I have no problem with you thinking Pentax should or should not keep certain lenses in their lineup, it was just the "you will unnderstand in 15-20 years" comment that rubbed me the wrong way. Again I apologize if they came across as snide or if you think I was attacking you personally.
06-22-2011, 04:36 PM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
Pentax had this covered until they raised the price on the FA 50/1.4 which split the difference on Nikon's 1.8 and 1.4. There was a similar situation with the FA 35/2. The Pentax lenses were better than any of the other lineup.
What was the FA 50/1.4 before the price hike? The MSRP now is $450.
06-22-2011, 06:28 PM   #43
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I would like an 28-300MM AF lens that I could actually afford to buy new. Something I can just put on my camera for the days when I don't feel like lugging around 2 or 3 older, heavier lenses, when I just want to GO and not have to worry about changing a lens. Every decent lens I've ever seen in this range has been nearly 2-3X what I can afford.

My Tamron 28-200 just doesn't have the reach I'd like, but lugging around my old Vivitar gets old and it can't AF besides. That's not a problem for a lot of things, but when I am in a hurry, AF is something I'd like to have. I just can't afford a pricey "all in one" lens though and every time I go looking it looks like the only way I can get one at all is to go used, and that I am told is too risky...

A decent sub $150 18/28-300 super zoom that I can buy new would really make my day. Truly wishful thinking I know, but still it would, even if it was made of plastic. I am saving up to buy a used 55-300 or something similar this Fall. I just really don't think that buying new is going to happen but I really wish that they could make an entry level PENTAX super zoom that the masses can afford that doesn't cost $200, $300 plus for once.

Pentax can make sub $500 cameras so why can't they make less expensive long lenses that people who bought those entry level cameras can actually afford? Why do I have to go elsewhere to Tamron, Sigma etc to buy cheaper?
06-22-2011, 06:59 PM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by paperbag846 Quote
In fact, they could introduce a 2 prime kit (35, 55), as an alternative to the 2 zoom kit (18-55, 50-200).
Great idea!

I 'd go for a 35-60 prime combo
06-22-2011, 08:09 PM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by Designosophy Quote
What was the FA 50/1.4 before the price hike? The MSRP now is $450.
It was $199 exactly 3 years ago.
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