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08-17-2011, 09:29 AM   #1
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Quality difference between Adaptall and Adaptall 2

Does anyone know if there is a difference in the quality of the optics between equivalent Adaptall and Adaptall 2 lenses? Is it just the mount that is different and the communication? (I think they might even share the same numbers.)

Thanks

08-17-2011, 10:49 AM   #2
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Depends on the len. adaptall-2.org has a lot of info. A number of the lenses are redesigns though, and have significant improvements.
08-17-2011, 10:57 AM   #3
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Some of the adaptall-2 also have the SP designation which generally is an improvement, but there are some very good lenses in the ad2 only category.

adaptall-2.org

This site is currently kept active by mflenses but hasn't been updated in a few years and was abandoned (adaptall-2.com was the original site). There is a lot of historical brochures etc there for adaptall, F and adaptamatic lenses.
08-17-2011, 01:08 PM   #4
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I was interested in the 46-A (70-210). It seemed like I heard that the 46A exists in both mounts, but when I went to adaptall-2.org, I could only find it in the Adaptall-2 list. I'm going to assume that the person who said that there is an Adaptall version of it was incorrect.

Thanks for the feedback.

08-17-2011, 06:07 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Spodeworld Quote
I was interested in the 46-A (70-210). It seemed like I heard that the 46A exists in both mounts, but when I went to adaptall-2.org, I could only find it in the Adaptall-2 list. I'm going to assume that the person who said that there is an Adaptall version of it was incorrect.

Thanks for the feedback.
The mounts are interchangeable. The lenses are named by series and not the mount. Its either a 46A or its not. Some of the lenses may have a newer version. For example the 90mm 52B or 52BB.
08-17-2011, 08:00 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
The mounts are interchangeable.
????? As far as I know, the 46A is an Adaptall-2 lens with two tabs for aperture coupling. There is no direct equivalent in the earlier Adaptall line. The Adaptall lens only support one tab with no support for Pentax-K AFAIK. So the short answer is that there is limited support (adapted M42) for the earlier Adaptall lens on a K-mount camera. The M42 Adaptall will fit an Adaptall-2 lens, however, since it has no coupling tabs.


Steve
08-17-2011, 08:04 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
????? As far as I know, the 46A is an Adaptall-2 lens with two tabs for aperture coupling. The Adaptall adapters only have one tab with no support for Pentax-K in that line.


Steve
Steve, we are talking about the lens here, not the mounts. If its a model 46A lens, it is a model 46A lens. The mounts are a whole other can of worms. That said, there would be the original adaptall k-mount, adaptall-2 K-mount and the adptall-2 PKA mount plus the original m42 mount, later mount and the mount m42 ES mount and the Ricoh K-mount. Yes, the mounts are interchangeable which is the whole point of the adaptall system, F system and adaptamatic system. Only the PKA adapter allows the use of these lenses like an A series lens.

http://www.adaptall-2.org/lenses/46A.html

QuoteQuote:
So the question remains as to which lens is better, the earlier 80-210 model 103A or the later 70-210 model 46A? If you want the slightly extra zoom range of the true 3:1 zoom ratio 70-210 and will mainly use your lens on a programmed or shutter priority mode camera, then buy the 70-210 if the plastic zoom/focus grip isn't an issue. If you mainly shoot using aperture priority mode with your camera and are knowledgeable about setting aperture and depth-of-field using the lens's depth-of-field scales, or if you must have an all metal lens with rubber grips, then choose the earlier 80-210 model 103A. Optical performance with either lens is sure to please since the optical performance of both lenses is very similar.
Edit: Some AD2 lenses can take advantage of the PKA mount and some can't such as the 03A and 103A.

Last edited by Blue; 08-17-2011 at 08:25 PM.
08-18-2011, 02:56 AM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by Spodeworld Quote
Does anyone know if there is a difference in the quality of the optics between equivalent Adaptall and Adaptall 2 lenses? Is it just the mount that is different and the communication? (I think they might even share the same numbers.)

Thanks
QuoteOriginally posted by Spodeworld Quote
I was interested in the 46-A (70-210). It seemed like I heard that the 46A exists in both mounts, but when I went to adaptall-2.org, I could only find it in the Adaptall-2 list. I'm going to assume that the person who said that there is an Adaptall version of it was incorrect.

Thanks for the feedback.
In the beginning (ignoring even earlier lens lines such as Adaptamatic) there were Adaptall "without-2" lenses and corresponding Adaptall Custom Mounts.

Then (in 1979 or thereabout) came the Adaptall-2 lens line with corresponding Adaptall-2 Custom Mounts. Those lenses that Tamron considered "something special" were given the additional "SP" ("Super Performance") designation. All Adaptall-2 lenses, whether SP or not share the same line of Custom Mounts. And Adaptall-2 Custom Mounts may also be used with the earlier Adaptall-"without 2" lenses.

Adaptall LENSES are of a different mechanical and mostly also a different optical design than their Adaptall-2 successors. The former are usually considered as "good" or ""very good", yet inferior to the lenses in the Adaptall-2 line (whether SP or not).

Adaptall CUSTOM MOUNTS are universally reported as mechanically less reliable than the Adaptall-2 mounts. Thus, if you find an attractive Adaptall lens, you should still go for an Adaptall-2 mount to use with that lens.

Now to your 46A and its "closest relatives". I can think of:
  • Adaptall: Model Z-220 (80-220)
  • Adaptall-2: Model 03A (80-210); Model 103A (80-210); Model 46A (70-210); Model 47A (70-210 - with AF!); Model 158A (70-210)
  • SP Adaptall-2: Model 19AH (70-210); Perhaps also Model 30A (80-200 - pricy f/2.8 lens).
I hope the above clarifies more than it confuses???

08-18-2011, 05:37 AM   #9
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Oh...I was confused. I purchased a Vivitar 70-210 46A Adaptall lens yesterday (being shipped). The lens cap that was photographed with it said Adaptall-2, however the owner said that he believes it is an Adaptall and not an Adaptall-2. So, after looking at the adaptall-2.org site and not finding the 46A on the Adaptall list but on the Adaptall-2 list, I assumed perhaps it really was an Adaptall-2. However, I am not really sure now. There must be something I can look for that will clear it up once I get it. It does come with a M42 screw mount though.
08-18-2011, 06:08 AM   #10
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Well, older Vivitars did at a certain point in time have interchangeable mounts (VERY rare, as I understand) --- but Vivitars certainly aren't Tamrons, so no use in consulting adaptall-2.org if the lens is a Vivitar!

- and to the best of my knowledge Vivitar never coined the word Adaptall. That belongs to Tamron.

So, was it a Vivitar or a Tamron that you bought???
08-18-2011, 06:25 AM   #11
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Mis-labeled item?

QuoteOriginally posted by Spodeworld Quote
. . . a Vivitar 70-210 46A Adaptall lens
I suspect you have an improperly identified lens. If it's a Vivitar lens it is not a Tamron Adaptall lens of any type -- although it may be a universal type T-mount lens.

If, in fact it is a Tamron 46A lens the Vivitar tag is incorrect. There was one such miss-labeled lens on an auction site recently. The confusion is not uncommon when sellers confuse interchangeable lens caps for brands or mistakenly use a brand name assuming it's a generic description. (i.e., 'Xerox' for a copy machine)

If it's the Tamron 46A lens, which is probable as there's no reason to associate that ID with a Vivitar lens, the above discussion of adapters is generally valid.

Post a reference to the ad and someone may be able to clarify the situation for you before it arrives. I suspect you may eventually want to "discuss" this with the seller -- although you may have a bargain (for the price) in any case even it it's a T-mount type lens.

H2
08-18-2011, 07:06 AM   #12
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Sorry...I meant that it was a Tamron lens...not a Vivitar....should have proofed the post better.

Here is the auction:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220835371272&ssPageName=S...ht_3317wt_1175

Note that the lens cap says Adaptall 2. I asked the owner, he said he believes it is an Adaptall and not an Adaptall 2, although I don't know why.

I just noticed that the front cap says Tamron 2.

Thanks.
08-18-2011, 07:50 AM   #13
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Fine then - that is an Adaptall-2 lens with an adaptall-2 mount for P/U (Pentax universal M42 Mount). I have that mount myself.

You will note the little spring loaded pin sticking out from the rear of the mount. That's the aperture coupler which needs to be pressed down in order for you to stop down any Adaptall lens with a P/U custom mount when mounted on a modern DSLR. The camera has no lever to do so, so you will have to "jam" that pin in a pressed-down position.

I have done that by placing an elestic rubber string that can be easily removed on the side of the mount facing the lens. There are many other ways to do this in a "reversible manner". But you should consider getting a P/K mount if ever you get hooked on these old Tamron gems.


Enjoy you "new" lens!
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08-18-2011, 08:01 AM   #14
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QuoteQuote:
Pentax Equipment: -K20D -some M42 lenses
Based on your list of equipment, I'd say you're in good shape if you're comfortable using your M42 lenses. With an M42-PK adapter you should be happy with the 46A as it's presently configured. An Adaptall PK adapter might be more convenient and of course the PK/A adapter would add the AE function but neither will affect the image quality.

Optically, this was one of Tamrons better Adaptall-2 series zoom lenses lacking only the faster aperture and metal build of the 19AH to be considered for the SP category. You may expect IQ typical of what you're capable of getting with your M42 lenses. I found it very similar to the SMC-M Try it with extension rings for close-up/macro in good light.

H2
08-18-2011, 09:26 AM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
That said, there would be the original adaptall k-mount, adaptall-2 K-mount and the adptall-2 PKA mount plus the original m42 mount, later mount and the mount m42 ES mount and the Ricoh K-mount.
Hi,
Nice list of mounts. A few notes:
  • I don't believe there was ever an original Adaptall for Pentax K mount (K-mount requires both "tabs" to translate aperture setting offset to the camera and the original Adaptall only supports one "tab")
  • Adaptall-2 mounts will not work on original Adaptall lenses
  • The M42 original Adaptall will work on Adaptall-2 lenses
  • Neither the original Adaptall nor Adaptall-2 M42 has an A/M switch. As a result, these require modification before they can be used with a K/M42 adapter on a K-mount body.
Translation? The original Adaptall lenses have poor compatibility with K-mount cameras. Ditto for Adaptall-2 lenses with the M42 adapter.


Steve
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