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09-27-2011, 12:01 AM   #1
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ND and CPL filter for DA15mm?

Hi guys,

Just want to know how many stops I need for ND filter for my 15mm limited. Mainly using it to shoot waterfalls and landscapes. Is ND8 enough? I've looked at the following options:

Marumi 49mm 49 mm Neutral Density ND8X ND8 ND Filter | eBay
Hoya HMC 49mm ND-400 Neutral Density - MC **AUTHORIZED HOYA USA DEALER** | eBay

Leaning towards the Marumi atm due to cost....any experiences with them on the 15mm?

Also, will it be bad to use a CPL on a wide angle such as the 15mm?

Thanks

Aaron

09-27-2011, 03:57 AM   #2
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This was probably just my bad luck.

I bought the Hoya 400 ND filter. It got stuck on the DA 15mm. I tried every trick to get it off. No luck. Took it to a repair shop. They said they could not remove it without destroying the filter. Had no choice. They got it off by breaking the filter. I was told this rarely happens. The lens is fine though. Have not tried another ND filter yet. Because of the built in hood of the lens, if a filter gets stuck its a lot harder to get it off...
09-27-2011, 05:43 AM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by catastrophe Quote
Also, will it be bad to use a CPL on a wide angle such as the 15mm?
Funnily I just got a Hoya ND 0.9 filter and I have a Marumi CPL The Hoya did not come yet but I chose it because it's multicoated (HMC). Try to get a multicoated for any filter you buy otherwise be prepared to endure bad flares. The Marumi DHG super CPL is thought to be one of the best CPL filters (by Lenstip.com, see their polarizers tests).

Using a CPL on the 15mm is possible, I do it at times, just be careful with the skies as the color can be uneven.

EDIT: Oh yes I forgot, for the ND400 I chose the B+W ND 3.0 10 stops filter. There is a multicoated version (70$) and a single coated (56$) at B&H. Not much issue with it apart from the expected color cast (warm in this case).
09-27-2011, 07:35 AM   #4
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ND8 is 3stops so if you want say 1/4" sec exposure this would be the same EV as 1/30th without the filter on. In shadow condition this might just about do it.

A Hoya ND400 is supposed to be 9stops so it might be too much except in the brightest conditions.

Of course you still have some latitude to vary aperture , ISO to get the speed you want with either ND.

I have the Hoya ND400, its actually only about 8 &1/3 stops not 9. In my opinion the colour cast is a lot less noticeable with the Hoya. The B&W 10stop is brown/magenta, the Lee 10stop is blue. The Hoya if anything is slight green(cyan) but to my eyes is not as strong. Post processing is recommended with all the 10stop I suppose.

The 3 stop filters are more neutral unless you stack them.

by Tapatalk

09-27-2011, 07:48 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by catastrophe Quote
Hi guys,

Just want to know how many stops I need for ND filter for my 15mm limited. Mainly using it to shoot waterfalls and landscapes. Is ND8 enough? I've looked at the following options:

Marumi 49mm 49 mm Neutral Density ND8X ND8 ND Filter | eBay
Hoya HMC 49mm ND-400 Neutral Density - MC **AUTHORIZED HOYA USA DEALER** | eBay

Leaning towards the Marumi atm due to cost....any experiences with them on the 15mm?

Also, will it be bad to use a CPL on a wide angle such as the 15mm?

Thanks

Aaron
While it may be possible to use a CPL on the 15, I wouldn't bother. The 15, perhaps more than any other k-mount lens, gathers light as if it has a built-in CPL. You will have more of a chance of messing up a shot using one than helping.

On the ND, if you want to do those awesome "magical skies"-type shots that you can see in the dedicated DA15 thread, you will need a 10-stopper (3.0). For doing waterfalls, etc. a 3-stopper would usually suffice. You can get a B&W ND3.0 on amazon right now for $42
09-27-2011, 08:28 AM   #6
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DA15 ND and CPL questions were discussed here.

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-camera-field-accessories/155950-da...trictions.html

A 3 stop ND filter is probably ideal for waterfall shots. You should be able to vary the aperture enough to stay in the 1-2 second zone. Longer can produce some really dramatic photos but you have to be certain that there isn't any leaf movement in the photo.

I've read claims about the DA15 not needing a CPL because of pixie dust. But I don't believe it especially for waterfall shots with sun glaring off of rocks.

But vignetting will likely occur if you stack two filters. Examples are posted in the linked thread.

I'm hopefully receiving my DA15 and stack of filters in a week. And then the fun begins.
09-27-2011, 08:42 AM   #7
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I have a B&W 49mm Slim CPL that will not mount on the DA 15mm because the built-in hood interferes.
09-27-2011, 09:10 AM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by DogLover Quote
The 15, perhaps more than any other k-mount lens, gathers light as if it has a built-in CPL.
I read that often about the DA 15mm but it's simply not true. As contrasty it is, it cannot reproduce the same effects a real CPL will do: darkening skies, removing reflections. Just put a CPL on it and see for yourself (what I did).

09-27-2011, 09:14 AM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by ManuH Quote
I read that often about the DA 15mm but it's simply not true. As contrasty it is, it cannot reproduce the same effects a real CPL will do: darkening skies, removing reflections. Just put a CPL on it and see for yourself (what I did).
I agree. The 16-45mm with a CPL is a lot more contrasty, with less glare, compared to a bare DA 15.
09-27-2011, 09:27 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by ManuH Quote
I read that often about the DA 15mm but it's simply not true. As contrasty it is, it cannot reproduce the same effects a real CPL will do: darkening skies, removing reflections. Just put a CPL on it and see for yourself (what I did).
No, it is true. The DA15 does render more like it has a built-in CPL that the vast majority of lenses, and does make a CPL more optional than it would be with other lenses. If you want to use one, knock yourself out, but it is absolutely NOT mandatory with the DA15. I have tried one, and while there are benefits in some situations, careful use is a must and it is definitely possible to do more harm than good.
09-27-2011, 09:36 AM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by abacus07 Quote
I've read claims about the DA15 not needing a CPL because of pixie dust.
Nope, it's not pixie dust that makes a CPL optional on the DA15, just excellent rendering and light-handling.
09-27-2011, 10:15 AM   #12
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DA 16-45mm @ 16mm f/8



DA 16-45mm + CPL @ 16mm f/8



DA 15mm Ltd @ f/8



Full resolution photos and exif are here (also a couple from 18-135mm, with and without CPL):
https://picasaweb.google.com/100586096103361553535/Comparo?authkey=Gv1sRgCLOD9LjmoOKTlAE#

Last edited by audiobomber; 09-27-2011 at 10:37 AM.
09-27-2011, 10:43 AM   #13
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Mmmm....OK....thanks for those, but we weren't comparing the 16-45 to the 15. For the record, though, I think the 15 shot still looks best, other than the sky in the CPL shot.
09-27-2011, 10:53 AM   #14
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The optics of the DA 15mm are so good, it is a shame to put any filter on it, because even good ones will degrade the image some. I bought a 49mm Hoya for mine. Mistake! Doesn't need it. Doesn't improve it. As someone else said, they do more harm than good. Luckily, 49mm fits a couple of my other Limiteds, and an older 50mm, so it wasn't a complete waste of money.
Even here, I can see the degregation of detail between the CPL and no on the 16-45 posted above. Blow them up to a decent size, and you'll really notice it. Use f-11 on the DA 15, and you'll see the difference between that and the f-8 shot as well. 1/3 exposure difference is quite noticable too. I've found that learning to get the most from the DA 15 means not putting any filters on it.
Same thing, maybe even more so, concerning ND filters. Doesn't matter too much if all you're doing is posted dummed down images to the internet, but if they are for publication or large prints, the degredation is quite obvious. There are other ways to shoot waterfalls than slapping an inferior piece of glass or plastic in front of such great optics. Choose a time to shoot that doesn't suffer direct sunlight. Use the lowest ISO and between f11 and f-16.
I will admit, however, that I occasionally use a Lee GND, but only when there is no other way around it.
09-27-2011, 03:03 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by audiobomber Quote
DA 16-45mm @ 16mm f/8
DA 16-45mm + CPL @ 16mm f/8
DA 15mm Ltd @ f/8
Thanks for posting these and bringing some sanity to this thread. I planned to do the same comparing the 10-20mm and the DA 15mm. The DA 15mm is very good but there is no magic. It's pretty clear in your shot how much changes in contrast occur in the CPL version.

QuoteOriginally posted by Ron Kruger:
The optics of the DA 15mm are so good, it is a shame to put any filter on it, because even good ones will degrade the image some
Except for the UV ones, filters have a special purpose that are worth the trade off of losing maybe a bit of IQ.
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