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04-18-2012, 10:42 AM   #61
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
Sorry, but go read the posts about how its great that the US is not paying what "we've" been paying all along - there are dozens of them in these various threads (including the one immediately after your post). As for asking for this, never asked for absurd rises in prices nor for no tangible gain from Pentax for higher prices. I'll say it once more - increase quality, increase variety, increase support, increase ANY ONE of them and THEN ask for more in return.
I did preface that with no sour grapes from me but try and see it from a perspective other than your own individual one
I'll ask again how do you know that more tangible gains aren't part of the plan. As someone who spent 25 years at retail this move would say to me that Pentax is going to support what they have been telling me since CES earlier this year. This could close some dealer agreements. I think there is a need to add some value through better warranty support. Given the 18-135 is SDM and I haven't seen complaints of failure from it I think the SDM issue may be resolved but not communicated. The number of complaints about recent purchase lenses failing seems to be far lower now would support that. I think they should have done a better job with support on the early ones though.
Until we can see the whole plan in effect though there really is no point to the endless complaining. Either the changes will give you value or they won't. If they don't vote with your wallet and change to a brand that gives you what it is you are looking for.
I'm not averse to changing brands (I've owned Pentax, Nikon and Canon in the past in 35mm SLR), but for me Pentax still hits the sweet spot

04-18-2012, 10:46 AM   #62
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
The only problem is, there aren't any retailers to walk into much less a better retailer except for a 1000 mile one way drive. Europe should be broken down by country, especially the U.K.
What? I can find 5 Pentax retailers here in Holland, in a 40km radius around my town. I know about 3 in Belgium, but I'm unfamiliar there. And 7 in Paris alone. Pfff....
04-18-2012, 11:03 AM   #63
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
Given the 18-135 is SDM and I haven't seen complaints of failure from it
The 18-135 uses the DC motor.

As for the pledge. I am already done with my Pentax branded lens collection for those that they raised prices on. I think the FA limiteds are still a fair price. I may consider their new ultra-wide if they price it competitively and offer good rebates. The other things I want Pentax doesn't even make. It's really funny to me that Sigma and Tamron can have a pricing policy that Amazon, B&H and Adorama don't undermine; still offer rebates, are reasonable enough you'd still consider a purchase off rebate, are in all major stores and Pentax can't.
04-18-2012, 11:05 AM   #64
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I'm with Eddie1960 and Wheatfield

Docwrm et al, your complaining, whether justified or not, is totally ineffectual on a forum. If you want change, then write concise factual letters to Pentax Japan and US.

The big issue in North American retail IMO is that bland rules. Home Depot, Lowes, Costco, Best Buy etc all put the common, most likely to sell stuff on the shelves. If you want a range hood, it is Broan only here in Home Depot. Since that is all most people see, guess what they buy? It's all about margins, nothing else. It has little to do with item A being better than item B. Being technically better only works for the educated buyer, everyone else goes with what is 'trending' and 'most popular', like good consumer lemmings.

Gerrit

04-18-2012, 11:06 AM   #65
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
What? I can find 5 Pentax retailers here in Holland, in a 40km radius around my town. I know about 3 in Belgium, but I'm unfamiliar there. And 7 in Paris alone. Pfff....
On this I will support the US guys Clavius. the nature of the North American market is a very large are with pockets of heavy population and then a long way to the next one with many small towns between
You mention Paris having 7 (I think with multi outlets it's actually more storefronts) but take the smaller centers like Montpelier perhaps and it is a different story (france actually has pretty good coverage and in general there is no long distance between major centers. the European market is wildly different in general you still have very vibrant independent retail in all areas. the big box revolution was not half as damaging as it was over here from what i have seen
04-18-2012, 11:16 AM   #66
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You two behind the desk can stand up now!

Please don't talk about "sour grapes", since the people that told you to take it easy actually had to suck up and buy it, and most of them did if they needed it!

It's not about 'Serves you right US', more about actually experiencing what it's like to having it "our way". We're not complaining, we're used to these prices. You are complaining because you don't have it as easy as before.

Just to add, I can buy gear from a grand total of 2 retailers (one is also the national importer) and one shop that sells some lenses. All in a country that takes 3 hours to drive across.

EDIT: Just checked the prices:
@B&H body only USD1099
at one of our stores body only 860 EUR = USD1130

We're still higher even at the cheapest seller.

Last edited by Giklab; 04-18-2012 at 11:23 AM.
04-18-2012, 11:23 AM   #67
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QuoteOriginally posted by Giklab Quote
You two behind the desk can stand up now!

Please don't talk about "sour grapes", since the people that told you to take it easy actually had to suck up and buy it, and most of them did if they needed it!

It's not about 'Serves you right US', more about actually experiencing what it's like to having it "our way". We're not complaining, we're used to these prices. You are complaining because you don't have it as easy as before.

Just to add, I can buy gear from a grand total of 2 retailers (one is also the national importer) and one shop that sells some lenses. All in a country that takes 3 hours to drive across.
I think what's bothered some USA Pentax users is that instead of commiseration from non-USA folks who have had to deal with less-favorable prices for years, there's been some vindictiveness.
04-18-2012, 11:29 AM   #68
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QuoteOriginally posted by luftfluss Quote
I think what's bothered some USA Pentax users is that instead of commiseration from non-USA folks who have had to deal with less-favorable prices for years, there's been some vindictiveness.
And a bit short sighted at that. US products should always be cheaper because of how we handle our tax policies. We don't charge VAT, we have fewer trade restrictions, etc. We still get taxed, don't worry. Our government takes our money in many other ways by taxing income or by simply not providing social services that they take for granted, forcing us to buy them on the open market or suffer. I'd rather live in Australia or Europe where even minimum wage is a living wage. Australian minimum wage is $16(US converted) per hour. In the USA it's $7.50. Don't get me started on your vacation policies either .

04-18-2012, 11:37 AM   #69
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
On this I will support the US guys Clavius. the nature of the North American market is a very large are with pockets of heavy population and then a long way to the next one with many small towns between
You mention Paris having 7 (I think with multi outlets it's actually more storefronts) but take the smaller centers like Montpelier perhaps and it is a different story (france actually has pretty good coverage and in general there is no long distance between major centers. the European market is wildly different in general you still have very vibrant independent retail in all areas. the big box revolution was not half as damaging as it was over here from what i have seen
Yes, that's my point: What's the reason why there's such good coverage in - not alone France - but all of Europe? Because retailers make can actually make money on Pentax products. And that's why a price increase in the US will help grow US Pentax coverage. US retailers will now too be able to make money on Pentax products.
04-18-2012, 11:37 AM   #70
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QuoteOriginally posted by kenafein Quote
And a bit short sighted at that. US products should always be cheaper because of how we handle our tax policies. We don't charge VAT, we have fewer trade restrictions, etc. We still get taxed, don't worry. Our government takes our money in many other ways by taxing income or by simply not providing social services that they take for granted, forcing us to buy them on the open market or suffer. I'd rather live in Australia or Europe where minimum wage is a living wage. Australian minimum wage is $16(US converted) per hour. In the USA it's $7.50. Don't get me started on your vacation policies either .
I think when the EU people do the comparison on price they remove the VAT actually

The rest is a discussion for P&R. and there is a solution that get's that stuff for the American public but not with the way people vote now. but that is a discussion for elsewhere
04-18-2012, 11:47 AM   #71
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
I think when the EU people do the comparison on price they remove the VAT actually

The rest is a discussion for P&R. and there is a solution that get's that stuff for the American public but not with the way people vote now. but that is a discussion for elsewhere
It was my understanding that the Amazon.co.uk price includes VAT. I don't agree with American politics, but that's the state we're in, for now. I'm well aware that there are problems everywhere, but the US economy is geared for cheap consumer goods. Don't be jealous of our prices, because we pay in other ways, that's all.

Last edited by kenafein; 04-18-2012 at 11:53 AM.
04-18-2012, 11:55 AM   #72
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
Maybe it's just me, but this sounds like a thread for spoiled brats who are willing to stamp their little feet and hold their breath until they turn blue because they aren't getting their way.
Pledge, smedge.
Nope, not just you, and I'm glad to see many people agreeing with you (and me). Pentax lenses are still a ridiculous value for the money compared with Nikon and Canon. If they ever do decide to release a FF camera, the whines about the price will no doubt be deafening.
04-18-2012, 12:03 PM   #73
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QuoteOriginally posted by Todd Adamson Quote
Nope, not just you, and I'm glad to see many people agreeing with you (and me). Pentax lenses are still a ridiculous value for the money compared with Nikon and Canon. If they ever do decide to release a FF camera, the whines about the price will no doubt be deafening.
no...

Compare the Canon 18-135 to the Pentax 18-135. The Pentax is $200 more and has WR. They are of similar optical quality.
04-18-2012, 12:10 PM   #74
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Ok, I'll just take your word for it...




Here's where you prove yourself very wrong. You claim that Europe has the same high prices. And at the same time you claim that nobody in their right mind will pay for those prices. But we all know that Pentax is doing very well in Europe. (In comparison to the US.) You can walk in any better camera-retailer here, and you'll find Pentax. That means that this strategy, to which the US is new, works very well!
Far from it - the B&M outlets already exist and there are governmental supports and laws in place that allow price controls in many of those countries. There are no such B&M placements here to actually support. Try again.
04-18-2012, 12:14 PM   #75
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
Far from it - they exist and there are governmental supports and laws in place that allow price controls in many of those countries. There are no such B&M placements here to actually support. Try again.
...And I thought I was slow...
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