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04-18-2012, 12:52 PM   #76
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
...And I thought I was slow...
Thanks. I appreciate the ad hominem attacks from those outside the US that just want to see us pay higher prices.

It's amazing to me that its that hard for you folks to grasp - there aren't the mythical B&M stores in the US to get into and support somehow. That is not merely my opinion, read the posts from anyone other than a couple here who apparently do have a B&M left near them. Such stores DO NOT EXIST outside NYC and a few other small enclaves in this VERY large country.

Perhaps you folks are the ones that are slow. You pay more for the exact item that I have been paying less for, and you get what precisely? If you get extra value then maybe you aren't slow. But then the reverse might be true too. Hmmmm. If I get less value then you do, shouldn't I pay less for less value received? Hmmm. No, that would actually make sense.

So, when you tell me that its more expensive in Europe because you do have B&M stores my question to you is - Why? Why frequent a B&M store when they charge you a lot more? Here they have all gone the way of the dinosaur because they can not compete. Pentax is trying to swim upstream. Best Buy, which is the largest of the B&M mainly electronic stores left in the US is closing another 50 stores.

04-18-2012, 12:59 PM - 1 Like   #77
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
...And I thought I was slow...
Apparently it would appear so since you seem to think there are B&M stores galore that are there to start hocking Pentax at top shelf prices with a paltry warranty to price ratio.

QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
Thanks. I appreciate the ad hominem attacks from those outside the US that just want to see us pay higher prices. . . .
That is shocking to be honest. I kind of expect it from Wheaties. But the magnitude of the "dog pile" is a surprise.
04-18-2012, 01:00 PM   #78
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No boycott from me. I'll continue to do what I've been doing for years....buying the best value for price.....whether that is pentax or not is meaningless.
04-18-2012, 01:03 PM   #79
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
Perhaps you folks are the ones that are slow. You pay more for the exact item that I have been paying less for, and you get what precisely? If you get extra value then maybe you aren't slow. But then the reverse might be true too. Hmmmm. If I get less value then you do, shouldn't I pay less for less value received? Hmmm. No, that would actually make sense.

So, when you tell me that its more expensive in Europe because you do have B&M stores my question to you is - Why? Why frequent a B&M store when they charge you a lot more? Here they have all gone the way of the dinosaur because they can not compete. Pentax is trying to swim upstream. Best Buy, which is the largest of the B&M mainly electronic stores left in the US is closing another 50 stores.
Because we understand that such stores want to make money too. The retailers won't buy Pentax lenses and sell them to their customers for the same price. Is that so hard to understand? Isn't that the whole reason why there's so little B&M stores over there? People being to stingy to buy from them?

04-18-2012, 01:04 PM   #80
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What's really funny is Best Buy made itself a success by lowering its prices so that others couldn't compete. When they started up they offered CDs at low rates that smaller chains couldn't compete with and drove them out of business. Now webstores are doing it to them and now we rush to defend them and their like? B&M stores are dinosaurs for many consumer goods. Sure I'd love to have a B&H or Adorama like store nearby, and I'd pay extra for that kind of establishment, but we have useless chains like Ritz and Samy camera staffed by people no more knowledgeable than the punk kids they hire at Best Buy.
04-18-2012, 01:07 PM   #81
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It's a fact that in this world a lot of people value what they have to pay more for. Being seen as a cheaper brand also means being seen as a second rate brand. As much as I'd like to see those of you who do buy new lenses get good deals I think this will actually create a better brand reputation for Pentax and maybe make it a bit more desirable to people who can afford to spend a bit more. Some people look at a decent cheaper pair of non-designer sneakers and all they see junk even when it not. The label and the higher pricing that goes along with it is so important to them that they'll usually take pricey designer shoes even if the cheap pair is actually made equally as well as said designer shoes. It's lame but it is how retail often works. Up pricing a bit can actually help to upscale brand reputation. It helps sales, not hurts it. If we ever want Pentax to give Nikon and Canon a serious run for their money the Pentax brand has to be seen in the same stores that sell them. They have to be priced comparably but competitively and the brand profile will have to be raised significantly to do it.

I'm definitely talking out of my hat here because this really won't affect me a whole lot as I don't have the ability to buy Pentax equipment new. But from having worked retail half my life I can see how this might just make Pentax a more competitive brand in the future and I want them to succeed. I don't particularly like the idea of higher lens and camera prices much either. Buying used won't be as inexpensive for me if that happens. But I might have more options in the end. More profit means they can offer more and if Pentax starts being sold well in places just like Canon and Nikon are? Well, that can't help but be a good thing now can it?

No, I won't turn on Pentax-Ricoh. I won't strike. Even if I could afford new I still would not. I can see what they are trying do, I think, and I do think it's somewhat justified, even if it does make new Pentax gear even that more unaffordable for me. They have to be competitive with the brands they want to steal business from but in order to do that they have to raise the brand name to a more posh level and they have to get into the same markets that Nikon and Canon are dominating. In order to do that they have to let the people that sell those cameras make a bit more, like Nikon and Canon already do, so they have a good reason to order and push the gear. They have to make the product one people will remember and really come looking for, asking for if the retailers don't actually have it.

I saw pics once of a large camera store that had all 3 brands in the pic. I don't remember if it was here, but I do sort of remember that pic because in the pic? There was a presence at the Nikon counter, a presence at the Canon counter, and the Pentax counter it was stark empty. No sales people. No customers at all. I remember thinking "OH shiz. That can't be good. They actually HAVE Pentax but they're not even staffing the counter? They're not even trying to push the brand?"

The next pic I see of that place? I want to see some faces at the Pentax counter. Even if it takes raising prices to do it. In fact, I want that counter, staffed, cloned and put in every place that sells Nikon and Canon cameras all over the world. I want them to eventually kick a little Canikon arse, even it it does hurt my wallet just to see the price tags. I don't want an empty counter and a lack of enthusiasm up on the part of retailers to lead to Pentax going the way of so many other good camera brands over the years. It is that important that Ricoh manages to succeed in this even if it means a bit higher prices.
04-18-2012, 01:11 PM   #82
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Add me to the "no pledge, thank you" column.

Don't get me wrong, I ABSOLUTELY AM disappointed with the new pricing. I had pinched my pennies and lined up a sufficient tax refund to justify a 60-250, and was planning to buy it this month or next. That's off the table now.

But I also understand that Pentax has a business to run. They can run it however they please, and if the new pricing helps them get their house in order so much the better. Bad timing on my part!

I'm not entitled to the old pricing; I'm just some dude on the Internet, and I'm the one who needs to get used to the new state of affairs. If prices adjust downward or a decent rebate comes along? Boom, I'm buying.
04-18-2012, 01:18 PM   #83
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QuoteOriginally posted by Quicksand Quote
Add me to the "no pledge, thank you" column.

Don't get me wrong, I ABSOLUTELY AM disappointed with the new pricing. I had pinched my pennies and lined up a sufficient tax refund to justify a 60-250, and was planning to buy it this month or next. That's off the table now.

But I also understand that Pentax has a business to run. They can run it however they please, and if the new pricing helps them get their house in order so much the better. Bad timing on my part!

I'm not entitled to the old pricing; I'm just some dude on the Internet, and I'm the one who needs to get used to the new state of affairs. If prices adjust downward or a decent rebate comes along? Boom, I'm buying.

I wonder what the rebate would be for. 50% off on getting screwed over?

Hysterical

04-18-2012, 01:18 PM   #84
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QuoteOriginally posted by Quicksand Quote
Add me to the "no pledge, thank you" column.

Don't get me wrong, I ABSOLUTELY AM disappointed with the new pricing. I had pinched my pennies and lined up a sufficient tax refund to justify a 60-250, and was planning to buy it this month or next. That's off the table now.

But I also understand that Pentax has a business to run. They can run it however they please, and if the new pricing helps them get their house in order so much the better. Bad timing on my part!

I'm not entitled to the old pricing; I'm just some dude on the Internet, and I'm the one who needs to get used to the new state of affairs. If prices adjust downward or a decent rebate comes along? Boom, I'm buying.
NEW PENTAX DA DA* 60-250mm F4 F/4 SDM LENS 4 K5 K-5 Kr K-01 K01 | eBay
04-18-2012, 01:20 PM   #85
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
The retailers won't buy Pentax lenses and sell them to their customers for the same price. Is that so hard to understand?
Not at all, but what retailers are you talking about? Not the Walmart kind, I assume. BestBuy, perhaps, which is currently headed down the same path as Circuit City before? Ritz/Wolf, who already filed for chapter 11 once in 2009? Do you really believe Pentax has any chance or relevance for propping up the half-dead/dying B&M retail model?
04-18-2012, 01:21 PM   #86
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Because we understand that such stores want to make money too. The retailers won't buy Pentax lenses and sell them to their customers for the same price.
This wasn't a decision made by B&M's like BH and Adorama. It was a Ricoh decision.

QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Is that so hard to understand? Isn't that the whole reason why there's so little B&M stores over there? People being to stingy to buy from them?
I assure you that the lack of B&M stores has nothing to do with Pentax. Part of the problem is the geographical size of the territory being covered by a small Pentax USA network. Many of our States are the size of some European countries and a few are even bigger. Talking about Pentax in Germany would be like talking about Pentax in New York State.
04-18-2012, 01:24 PM   #87
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
I wonder what the rebate would be for. 50% off on getting screwed over?

:Hysterical:



Perhaps the Secret Service thought they were entitled to that rebate?
04-18-2012, 01:26 PM   #88
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QuoteOriginally posted by luftfluss Quote


Perhaps the Secret Service thought they were entitled to that rebate?
Apparently that is what got the argument going out in the street. Hysterical Some of the girls thought their "lenses" were worth more than the S.S. guys did.
04-18-2012, 01:32 PM   #89
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
I pledge not to buy a new Pentax branded lens until the new pricing policy is eliminated.

I will only buy new from other makers such as Sigma or Tamron.

If I do buy a Pentax branded lens it will only be used.
A totally useless pledge since the only lens I am considering at this point is the 560F5.6
04-18-2012, 01:36 PM   #90
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
A totally useless pledge since the only lens I am considering at this point is the 560F5.6
Lets hope that doesn't turn out to be vaporware.
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