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05-03-2012, 07:41 PM   #46
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Yesterday morning I put on the -A lens and used Av mode and posted a couple up here on extreme f/. It works fine.
But otherwise I always run M mode, almost always spot metering and lock exp where I select before composing. Of course, not always good.
That is how I did it on the Pentax/Ricoh slrs with "centre-weighted" and continue with the ist ds.
If I had a later Pentax according to Lowells chart, my method might not be so good.
I am messing around with M4/3 and tonight there were thunder clouds above Flint at sunset- a range of clouds from dark to super bright.
I used same method ( actually the Oly M4/3 in manual is more like an old slr except for the confounded LCD VF)
Good Luck to those with the M Mode !
And thanks, Lowell, for the patience.

05-03-2012, 08:17 PM   #47
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QuoteOriginally posted by creampuff Quote
I can see no advantage or reason to use an A lens off the A setting. Lenses with the PKA mount provide superior functionality over previous non-A series lenses (K & M series).
I can't tell if minahasa is talking about using the aperture ring to set the aperture or using M mode when he talks about his preferred method. I use M mode but I never use the aperture ring. I think the topic open for debate is whether or not A lenses are worth the 2x premium over comparable M lenses. Each person has different preferences and needs so there isn't one answer. Also the below numbers are not correct unless you make a rare below market find. M50/1.4 sell for about $75 (M50/1.7 - $50). the A is about 2x and the FA is about 4x (the M price).

QuoteQuote:
Here, today I can snap a SMC M 50/1.4 for about 1/4 the price of SMC A 50/1.4 and almost 1/10 the price of SMC F/FA 50/1.4. The 'automation', the convenience that we get is the real cost here, since I believe that the all-manual M could deliver similar results.
05-04-2012, 04:11 AM   #48
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QuoteOriginally posted by minahasa Quote
A lenses can meter more easier and probably better, yes, but many times it gives me not what I want. It's not like that the metering is incorrect, no. It's the capability to 'think' seems different than mine that bothers me, giving me not what I want. Yes I can fiddle around to find settings that suits me, but then I prefer overriding to full-manual for better controls. Probably you are correct, I have a problem. My solution is going full-manual and learning each lens' character for better results. That's why although I have tried many lenses, I kept only several -one for every usable FL- and mostly primes and have constant aperture.
What you might want to consider is learning the zone system, or learning just a little about exposure, ankd spot metering. To me it sounds as if you are principally shooting by trial and error, or more appropriately trial and look at the rear panel for confirmation. Spend some time with spot metering, metering off the thing you want in the histogram in the center, meter off that and then leave the settings alone. This does not involve going to auto, the only advantage of an A lens in manual is it will meter using the green button very accurately compared to a non a lens, so over time you will be able to trust it.
05-04-2012, 09:38 AM   #49
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QuoteOriginally posted by creampuff Quote

My only conclusion is OP is probably still grappling to handle a multi-function camera in the digital age. Those still determining exposure and using their DSLRs the way they used to with their 35mm film cameras, time to get a refresher and unlearn the old ways.
You are correct, I must confess.
It's like having a new high-tech car and driving around in your hometown that you know like the back of your head and then you have to choose whether you would rely on the in-dash GPS telling you to "slow down and turn right", or stick to what your memory and reflexes is telling you


QuoteOriginally posted by abacus07 Quote
I can't tell if minahasa is talking about using the aperture ring to set the aperture or using M mode when he talks about his preferred method. I use M mode but I never use the aperture ring. I think the topic open for debate is whether or not A lenses are worth the 2x premium over comparable M lenses. Each person has different preferences and needs so there isn't one answer. Also the below numbers are not correct unless you make a rare below market find. M50/1.4 sell for about $75 (M50/1.7 - $50). the A is about 2x and the FA is about 4x (the M price).
I use the aperture ring, off course.
I live in a country that seems full of used M 50/1.4, much more easier to find than M 50/1.7 -probably in the old days Pentax distributor here equipped the M 50/1.4 as the 'kit' lens and/or have a huge pile of this lens on stock. Also, there are many used Taks and other M lenses, sadly not the K series, and very small pool of A lenses. I suspect that Pentax began to lost it's market share here by the time things were going 'auto', and lost completely when the AF SLR began hitting the market. That's why the AF lenses are so highly priced here (compared to the used 'manuals') because almost all, if not entirely, Pentax AF SLR lineup -including AF lenses- are bought by individuals from sources overseas, and mostly are bought in the DSLR era, so no 'national price policy' here and the price should be much more like the international price (US or GB price).

Today a perfect-working M 50/1.4 is priced an equivalent of $40-50 - could be less if the cosmetics is worn. M 50/1.7 would be like $70-80 because of its rarity. An A 50/1.4 I have seen went as high as about $200, but for this entire watching the local internet lens marketplace I have seen only one (and snapped by Canonians and get 'amputated'..whatta??). There was a FA 50/1.4 and two F 50/1.7 a few months back, but again priced like ebay + shipping.

By sharing my story I hope friends here understand why I eventually choose to love and, hopefully, master the lean and curves of the M lenses. It's not like I refuses to 'tech out', I'm saving for an AF prime now, and it's a simply an act of learning the art of substitution


QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
What you might want to consider is learning the zone system, or learning just a little about exposure, ankd spot metering. To me it sounds as if you are principally shooting by trial and error, or more appropriately trial and look at the rear panel for confirmation. Spend some time with spot metering, metering off the thing you want in the histogram in the center, meter off that and then leave the settings alone. This does not involve going to auto, the only advantage of an A lens in manual is it will meter using the green button very accurately compared to a non a lens, so over time you will be able to trust it.
Basically it's learning the do's and don'ts. It's like a child learning to crawl, stand, walk and then run. I takes one movement at a time, but then, it becomes 'instinctive' to you. It takes a lot of time, but eventually it's all doable, and the most important thing is I love taking time into it. Lowell, you have been very kind, I'll look into your suggestions. Thank You.


Last edited by minahasa; 05-04-2012 at 09:43 AM.
05-04-2012, 11:20 AM   #50
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QuoteOriginally posted by joe.penn Quote
- Aperture Value ("AV")
- Aperture Value ("AV")
- Aperture Value ("AV") with "EV" comp if no sky is framed in scene
- Aperture Value ("AV") with "EV" comp if no sky is framed in scene

For Reference: If a sky in framed in the scene, I use a negative "EV" comp and use fill flash/hss to overcome backlighting or shadow issues...

I go between AV and TV as well as M modes.
Flash fill is not really an option or at least a practical option considering outdoor shots at
distance. But then again I have never tried any of compact high power zoom flashes.
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