Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
06-06-2012, 11:54 AM   #1
Pentaxian
philbaum's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Port Townsend, Washington State, USA
Posts: 3,659
Sony's "by wire" manual focus. Will this impact Pentax?

Sony E 55-210mm f/4.5-6.3 OSS (SEL-55210) - Review / Lens Test

QuoteQuote:
Manual focusing works "by wire" so the focus ring is not directly coupled
to the focus gears but to the AF motor. DMF ("Direct Manual Focusing" in Single
Shot AF mode) is supported.
All of Sony's e lenses, primes and zooms, have this manual focus by wire, and is reported to be very quiet.

Sony's had more of a video slant to their cameras than Pentax. I'm wondering if this is a new camera trend and will start showing up in other makes.

If you look at Pentax 17-70, which i have, it is very fast auto focusing (even with sdm) and it looks like this was achieved by a very short focus travel. But as a result, its reportedly difficult to manual focus because of the quick travel.

With manual focus by wire, it would prevent damage to the focus gears by less knowledgeable people trying it out in shops by manual twisting everything in sight, and it would also allow adjustment to whatever travel was thought appropriate by the factory.

Is this a new trend in camera lenses over the traditional approach to have manual and motor share the same gear train? And will it affect Pentax?

06-06-2012, 12:40 PM   #2
Pentaxian




Join Date: Nov 2011
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,674
QuoteOriginally posted by philbaum Quote
All of Sony's e lenses, primes and zooms, have this manual focus by wire, and is reported to be very quiet.

Is this a new trend in camera lenses over the traditional approach to have manual and motor share the same gear train? And will it affect Pentax?
Olympus and Fuji are doing the same thing.
It's probably cheaper than the kind of quality Quick-Shift solution that the better modern Pentax lenses offer.
06-06-2012, 01:54 PM   #3
Senior Member
johnha's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Lancashire, UK
Posts: 250
You could say the same about the Pentax PowerZoom functionality first built into the Z-1 (PZ-1), quite a good gimmick but quickly becomes a complicated way to solve a simple problem. The 'resolution' of the electronics/motor makes making small changes awkward.
06-06-2012, 02:03 PM   #4
Pentaxian




Join Date: Nov 2011
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,674
QuoteOriginally posted by johnha Quote
You could say the same about the Pentax PowerZoom functionality.
That functionality has become standard for compact digital cameras.

QuoteQuote:
The 'resolution' of the electronics/motor makes making small changes awkward.
In the compacts, the zooming (more strictly, focal length change) is done in discrete steps.

06-06-2012, 02:43 PM   #5
Pentaxian
Pål Jensen's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Norway
Photos: Albums
Posts: 3,080
QuoteOriginally posted by philbaum Quote
[Is this a new trend in camera lenses over the traditional approach to have manual and motor share the same gear train? And will it affect Pentax?
No trend but a cost cutting thing. A silly idea from Sony who is apparently an expert on such ideas (that is silly ones). Why waste battery power?
Makes less sense than power-zoom.
06-06-2012, 03:52 PM   #6
Pentaxian
philbaum's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Port Townsend, Washington State, USA
Posts: 3,659
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
No trend but a cost cutting thing. A silly idea from Sony who is apparently an expert on such ideas (that is silly ones). Why waste battery power?
Makes less sense than power-zoom.

I don't know the answer to my question, but i'm leery of dismissing the idea quickly. I think many jet aircraft today are fly by wire instead of mechanical linkages. Car engines have many "operate by wire" sub systems in them.

Initially the "by wire" systems are more complicated, but they probably allow tuning of a camera to be easier done by firmware. And what's wrong with cost cutting?

On the one hand we want faster AF; well the speed at which the lens can physically move its elements may be a big part of that timing issue.
06-06-2012, 04:56 PM   #7
Veteran Member
Anvh's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 4,616
This idea is nothing new, Olympus did it 5 years ago with the m4/3 i believe or was it 4/3th
06-06-2012, 04:57 PM   #8
Veteran Member
Anvh's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 4,616
QuoteOriginally posted by philbaum Quote
I don't know the answer to my question, but i'm leery of dismissing the idea quickly. I think many jet aircraft today are fly by wire instead of mechanical linkages.
Most recent are fly by light

06-06-2012, 06:48 PM   #9
Site Supporter
jatrax's Avatar

Join Date: May 2010
Location: Oregon
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 10,547
Had a "super-zoom" camera that had that function a few years ago. Absolutely hated it. No feed back in the zoom, turn fast or slow and it still zoomed the same speed. Just really weird to work with.

That doesn't mean someone could not do it right and make it work, but the implementation I worked with really soured me on it.
06-06-2012, 06:55 PM   #10
Site Supporter
jimr-pdx's Avatar

Join Date: May 2010
Location: 1hr north of PDX
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,515
Yes the micro-43 cameras do this. It's so weird since it has no stop, you reach min or max focus but it can still turn! Hard for an old-schooler to adapt.. well this old-schooler at least
06-07-2012, 06:20 AM   #11
Moderator
Site Supporter
Blue's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Florida Hill Country
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 17,197
QuoteOriginally posted by lytrytyr Quote
Olympus and Fuji are doing the same thing.
It's probably cheaper than the kind of quality Quick-Shift solution that the better modern Pentax lenses offer.
I am not too fond of that feature on the Olympus and Panny m4/3 bodies. It could be that I am used to manual focusing myself for so long.
06-07-2012, 06:25 AM   #12
Pentaxian
JinDesu's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: New York City
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 5,624
QuoteOriginally posted by jimr-pdx Quote
Yes the micro-43 cameras do this. It's so weird since it has no stop, you reach min or max focus but it can still turn! Hard for an old-schooler to adapt.. well this old-schooler at least
Quite a few people were complaining about the focus-by-wire of the X-Pro-1 lenses - many saying it was pretty useless for manual focusing because you never know when you hit minimum or maximum.

I don't know why you can't do focus-by-wire and still set the hard stop for min and max though...
06-07-2012, 06:29 AM   #13
Loyal Site Supporter
eddie1960's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Toronto
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 12,235
Like said this has been around for ages. I'm in the hate it camp. I hate the lack of tactile response and the lack of a beginning and end point on the rotation. on a low end camera beginners won't notice it, anyone with manual fcus experience is likely to hate it (the focus by wire is actually one of the complaints on the fuji x100 and xpro
for instance from Steve Huff on the X100 complaints

QuoteQuote:
USER Complaint #7 – The Fuji X100′s Manual Focus is unusable. All I can say about this is YES IT IS. I hate it, but luckily, this could be fixed via a firmware update. Will they fix it? Only time will tell but I am fine using a camera like this in AF mode. It is NOT a rangefinder camera and if I want to shoot manual, I will shoot with my M. But yes, the MF implementation is horrible with the X100 but there is a solution if you still want to shoot in this way.
the Xpro is better but not a lot

these systems just aren't designed for manual focus IMO

the Quick shift on Pentax lenses is a far better solution I think (they are noisier though)
06-07-2012, 06:38 AM   #14
Site Supporter




Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: North
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 3,868
QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
Like said this has been around for ages. I'm in the hate it camp. I hate the lack of tactile response and the lack of a beginning and end point on the rotation. on a low end camera beginners won't notice it, anyone with manual fcus experience is likely to hate it (the focus by wire is actually one of the complaints on the fuji x100 and xpro
for instance from Steve Huff on the X100 complaints



the Xpro is better but not a lot

these systems just aren't designed for manual focus IMO

the Quick shift on Pentax lenses is a far better solution I think (they are noisier though)
+1 to this.
The disconnect with tactile feel of MF drives me nuts on my m4/3 camera.
06-07-2012, 06:58 AM   #15
Pentaxian




Join Date: Nov 2011
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,674
QuoteOriginally posted by pinholecam Quote
The disconnect with tactile feel of MF drives me nuts on my m4/3 camera.
Is this a case where manual focus lenses on an adapter
are actually preferable to using the system's native lenses?
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
af, camera, focus, gears, k-mount, lenses, motor, pentax, pentax lens, slr lens, travel, trend, wire
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Don't say Pentax "Q" in French ... "Q" = "cul" = "A--" Jean Poitiers Pentax Q 52 11-10-2013 06:25 AM
What does "auto" mean on older manual focus lens? jonhock Pentax Film SLR Discussion 19 03-04-2013 05:04 AM
For Sale - Sold: Sears A 135/2.8 "macro" (manual focus, auto aperture) (Worldwide) deejjjaaaa Sold Items 2 05-08-2011 07:45 PM
What "AUTO" on a manual focus Vivitar lens? emr Pentax SLR Lens Discussion 5 08-06-2010 09:56 AM
"Focus by wire"? shuttervox Pentax DSLR Discussion 14 02-16-2009 03:01 PM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:06 AM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top