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08-22-2012, 10:41 AM   #76
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
Back in the old film days I had 4 lenses - 28/50/135 and a zoom that was 70-210 plus one 2x teleconverter. So that covered 28-420 or so. Interesting exercise and even more interesting answers. I still think that 31 on cropped sensor is too tight for the short lens but many seem to be selecting it.
i had much the same for quite a while in film days
I agree i think 31 isn't wide enough on a crop. just barely on film really . on ff a 31/77 combo would be very easy to live with i think. a 21/55 on apsc does the same effectively

08-22-2012, 11:36 AM   #77
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
i had much the same for quite a while in film days
I agree i think 31 isn't wide enough on a crop. just barely on film really . on ff a 31/77 combo would be very easy to live with i think. a 21/55 on apsc does the same effectively
I don't mind 70-77 on APS-C as much as a do too narrow on the wide end. I do a lot of indoor shots and in a typical house 30ish on APS-C is too tight IMHO. You can crop a wide shot but you cannot artificially back up or widen a shot that is too narrow to start with. I like the 15 Limited, it's really the only lens on my radar at present and genuinely appreciated being able to handle it at the Pentax K-30 Road Tour a couple weeks ago. There is a reason that 28 was the basic wide lens back in the film days - its effectively 42 now, where the 50 is 75, the 70 is 105, and the 85 is 127mm equivalent. With the 15 Limited you are working at around 22-3, actually 18 on the kit zooms is very close to the old 28mm basic wides in film days. Anyway, 15 & 50 or 70-77 on APS-C seems the best combination if you have to do only 2 to me.
08-22-2012, 12:01 PM   #78
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the 15 is effectively a 24 replacement (far fewer of those about) my 14 i bought specifically because it replaced the 21 fov for me. it's been one of my most used lenses
Like the idea of the 21 (a good 28 replacement i guess since there is no 18) but it's too slow IMO it should be 2.0-2.4 but then it would be bigger
you are right you can't crop wider a good decent side is very useful (spend some time in small European streets and it's apparent pretty fast, I've often wished for even wider than the 14 when on vacation. it's the one lens guaranteed to be in my vacation kit. The second is actually the DA35 2.4. ideally i would have a 70-77 to compliment those 2 - in fact the 4 da 15-21-40-70 would be pretty ideal)
08-22-2012, 12:05 PM   #79
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
the 15 is effectively a 24 replacement (far fewer of those about) my 14 i bought specifically because it replaced the 21 fov for me. it's been one of my most used lenses
Like the idea of the 21 (a good 28 replacement i guess since there is no 18) but it's too slow IMO it should be 2.0-2.4 but then it would be bigger
you are right you can't crop wider a good decent side is very useful (spend some time in small European streets and it's apparent pretty fast, I've often wished for even wider than the 14 when on vacation. it's the one lens guaranteed to be in my vacation kit. The second is actually the DA35 2.4. ideally i would have a 70-77 to compliment those 2 - in fact the 4 da 15-21-40-70 would be pretty ideal)
I've not had the chance to handle the Pentax 14 but wider would be better and it is f2.8 instead of f4 like the 15. I am often confused by the apertures for the DA Limiteds - why are the lenses so slow? The FAs are not as each of the main players is f<2.0.

I find myself using the DA35/2.4 far more than my FA50/1.4 (even though I like it) because it is wider and therefore more versatile IMHO. I'm really back-and-forth on the acquiring the 15. Then I would have 15-35-50-70 in some pretty good glass. My main concern with the 15 is that it's f4......why?

08-22-2012, 12:12 PM   #80
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Why + size. the 14 also needs to be stopped down for sharpness to f 4 anyway and the 15 is apparently pretty good wide open. I think developers sometimes think these lenses are primarily outdoor daylight use or tripod bound, they are dead wrong I've shot literally thousands of concert shots with the 14 wide open. it's bigger , it's heavier, it really is due for an update (make it WR, improve the coatings and update focus to an improved faster ring motor and call it a DA* (I think on many levels it already is a DA* lens, but sadly under appreciated see the DA14 thread for some nice samples from very few participants

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/lens-clubs/117422-pentax-da14mm-club.html

One thing the lack of popularity does is suppress the value of used ones. they go pretty cheap. I bought mine new when the ds was released and i picked up my ds. Need a new hood since the old one got damaged (but saved the lens from damage)
08-22-2012, 12:18 PM   #81
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
My main concern with the 15 is that it's f4......why?
Because if it was 2.8 it would be the size of the DA 14. If you want that width and f2.8, there's your lens. I wanted the 15mm's small size, that's pretty much my only justification for buying it, because I already had a 16-45mm f4.
08-22-2012, 12:19 PM   #82
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
Why + size. the 14 also needs to be stopped down for sharpness to f 4 anyway and the 15 is apparently pretty good wide open. I think developers sometimes think these lenses are primarily outdoor daylight use or tripod bound, they are dead wrong I've shot literally thousands of concert shots with the 14 wide open. it's bigger , it's heavier, it really is due for an update (make it WR, improve the coatings and update focus to an improved faster ring motor and call it a DA* (I think on many levels it already is a DA* lens, but sadly under appreciated see the DA14 thread for some nice samples from very few participants

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/lens-clubs/117422-pentax-da14mm-club.html

One thing the lack of popularity does is suppress the value of used ones. they go pretty cheap. I bought mine new when the ds was released and i picked up my ds. Need a new hood since the old one got damaged (but saved the lens from damage)
I agree that some of the design decisions are head scratchers and the only real explaination is that the designer intends for the lens to be used in some specific way, as you said. Most lenses are better stopped down but at least when you have to have the shot you can go 2.8 on the 14, you just plain can't on the 15. The FA50/1.4 is better at 2 and excellent around 4 but when I have a very low light situation the 1.4-2.0 range can really make a difference, even with the high ISO abilities of the K-5.
08-22-2012, 12:34 PM   #83
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
- in fact the 4 da 15-21-40-70 would be pretty ideal)
The 15-21-40-70 is my line up...perfect for me and a very small system with my k-r to haul around on vacation. I gave my neice the 18-55 and have never used my 50-200. I want the 200/2.8.

08-22-2012, 12:36 PM   #84
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Like others........DA15 and FA43.
08-22-2012, 03:56 PM   #85
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
Why + size. the 14 also needs to be stopped down for sharpness to f 4 anyway and the 15 is apparently pretty good wide open. I think developers sometimes think these lenses are primarily outdoor daylight use or tripod bound, they are dead wrong I've shot literally thousands of concert shots with the 14 wide open. it's bigger , it's heavier, it really is due for an update (make it WR, improve the coatings and update focus to an improved faster ring motor and call it a DA* (I think on many levels it already is a DA* lens, but sadly under appreciated see the DA14 thread for some nice samples from very few participants

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/lens-clubs/117422-pentax-da14mm-club.html

One thing the lack of popularity does is suppress the value of used ones. they go pretty cheap. I bought mine new when the ds was released and i picked up my ds. Need a new hood since the old one got damaged (but saved the lens from damage)
Agreed that the DA14 is under appreciated and PF's comparison review between the DA14 and the rokinon make this even more so...not to mention ricehigh did another damaging blow in his blog...it makes people feel like this lens should never have been released.

But we love this lens from day one. Most of our best shots are from this lens. We buy and sell many lenses in the past but the DA14 is a keeper for life.
08-22-2012, 04:04 PM   #86
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QuoteOriginally posted by raider Quote
Agreed that the DA14 is under appreciated and PF's comparison review between the DA14 and the rokinon make this even more so...not to mention ricehigh did another damaging blow in his blog...it makes people feel like this lens should never have been released.

But we love this lens from day one. Most of our best shots are from this lens. We buy and sell many lenses in the past but the DA14 is a keeper for life.
Odd, that. The DA14 is my least used lens, and the one I am most tempted to part with. I find it soft and not very sharp at any aperture - the 10-17mm is a much better lens, also at the 14mm setting.

I really, really want to like the DA14.....maybe I should take it for yet another spin...
08-22-2012, 04:09 PM   #87
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Easy, DA21 and FA43. FA43 is the best lens I've ever used and with the 21 will be a nice pocketable combo. I prefer the 21 focal length to the 15. In fact in a few months once I switch systems these will be the only two lenses for me in Pentax.
08-23-2012, 05:35 AM   #88
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uhm, probably DA 15 - DA 55 1.4
08-23-2012, 05:52 AM   #89
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The best lens I have, and the one that is always in the bag, the K35/3.5, and for a little bit more reach the Tak 105/2.8
08-23-2012, 05:22 PM   #90
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+1 for Altopiet. If the world blew up and that's all I had, I'd be ok :P
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