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10-29-2012, 01:10 PM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
I went through the same process several months back, result - I own a Tamron 70-200/2.8 and am pretty happy.
I reached the same conclusion... a couple things turned my head...
I read the auto-focus could be slow... so what do you think?

The new Sigma 70-200 2.8 is supposed to be the latest thing since sliced bread, a big improvement over the old one. One of the biggest disadvantages with Pentax, is I will never be in a place where they are both present at the same time, so I can put them on the camera and let my "physical instincts" make the decision.

I'm really a big fan of having a couple of alternatives and being able to say " I like this one."

10-29-2012, 01:16 PM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
I went through the same process several months back, result - I own a Tamron 70-200/2.8 and am pretty happy.
QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
I reached the same conclusion... a couple things turned my head...
I read the auto-focus could be slow... so what do you think?
That's my only gripe, on paper, with the Tamron. It's more expensive new than a used Tokina and we never seem to see them on the used market. All reviewers mention that AF is too slow for sports and kids running around, and that would be my use for the lens, so there's little sense getting it if I'm going to be disappointed, is there?

My gripe with Sigma is that they are too expensive.

No free lunch around here, apparently.
10-29-2012, 01:19 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
I reached the same conclusion... a couple things turned my head...
I read the auto-focus could be slow... so what do you think?

The new Sigma 70-200 2.8 is supposed to be the latest thing since sliced bread, a big improvement over the old one. One of the biggest disadvantages with Pentax, is I will never be in a place where they are both present at the same time, so I can put them on the camera and let my "physical instincts" make the decision.

I'm really a big fan of having a couple of alternatives and being able to say " I like this one."
It's just not slow IMHO. Pentax AF is not the snappiest ever but the 70-200/2.8 is no slower/faster than expected IMHO. It has a LONG throw because its got a "Macro" capability and that takes some time. I haven't seen many user comments on the new Sigma, and lots of things are praised to high-Heaven when they come out only to turn out to be less. I've been using it for U12 soccer and its been fine since I fine tuned the focus (-1 as I recall which is more maddening to me than -3 or higher because its so fiddling). I posted a shot in the post your photos section of my son running to make a header that I took on Saturday that was taken from about 1/2 the distance of the field at a slight angle.
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/post-your-photos/203594-sports-waiting-header.html
10-30-2012, 04:50 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
It's just not slow IMHO. Pentax AF is not the snappiest ever but the 70-200/2.8 is no slower/faster than expected IMHO.
the only lens we both own is the 18-55 WR, how would you compare AF with that lens?

10-31-2012, 06:36 AM   #20
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OK, I'm still pondering options. Someone mentionned previously the 60-250. It's more expensive, but say I found it at a fair price... Any opinoon on how it compares to the 70-200 lenses available out there? More reach is interesting, it's slightly more compact and light, only f4 but if it's really really goot at f4, that could be enough. Maybe. I don't know...
10-31-2012, 07:09 AM   #21
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Don't be buying a 60-250 because you think it might be light, it might be lighter, but it's not light... it's only F4 but weighs as much as the 70-200 2.8s. For me it's about low light focus. Even if you're shooting at f-4 on both, the 70-200's give you more light to focus with. My choice when I bought the 60-250 was between the 60-250 and the 300, both F4. At this point I wish I'd taken a look at the a 200 2.8 with the teleconverter. You can work around f4 without a teleconverter, but if you put on the Pentax FA 1.7 TC, you're starting from f 6.3. I think it probably would have been better with 200 2.8 and a 2X to get to 400mm. And for me, since I'm not really a birder, although I do like to take bird shots when available, I don't spend enough time at 250mm to think I needed more than 200. The difference between 200 and 250 is just not that much. 100 to 200mm is twice the magnification... 200 to 400 is twice. So what's 200 to 250?

Having owned the 60-250 for more than a year now... I'm interested in getting a 70-200. Part of that is we have two shooters in the family and there are times we want two long lenses. And the other part of that is I want to see if that extra 50 mm is worth the loss of an f-stop. After we have both it will become real apparent because right now who ever gets to the lens case first gets what they want, the other gets what's left. We'll probably see pretty quickly which one is getting left.

Sorry I couldn't be more helpful... but owning the 60-250, the issue is still unresolved.
10-31-2012, 01:07 PM   #22
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Hi bdery,

I'm not much a fan of the 70-200 f2.8 zooms as I find them too heavy for the reach. I long ago purchased a Tokina 80-200 f2.8 AT-X Pro AF 2 ( the lightest in class at that time) for @ $400 USD. It satisfies my needs for this FL range and speed, and I really have no need to upgrade, though I've thought about it, just because it's possible, and LBA is LBA . The APS-C equivalents for the classic 28-70mm, 80-200mm "event" zoom combination is 17-50 and 50-135, and I'm very satisfied with my Sigma 17-70 f2.8-4.5 DC and DA 50-135 f2.8 with my K-7 or K-5 to work this kind of job, especially if it's indoor work and I have to add an external flash. The best use I've realistically found for this class of lens for me is at the zoo. If I were to replace the Tokina at this time, it would be with a DA*200 f2.8, with absolutely no doubt, and since I already have a Sigma EX 180 f3.5 Macro, I doubt that I'd even replace it. (BTW, I also have an A*200/2.8, a Tamron Adaptall 2 SP 80-200/2.8, and an Adaptall 2 SP 180/2.5 in the general range of the long end)

That being said, here are my thoughts anyway, for what they're worth. . .

I think that if I were to be looking for one of these, I'd look for one of the early screw-drive Sigma pre-macro versions as described by Lowell above, or get the current Tamron.

I think that the "slow" reputation for the Tamron's AF performance is more due to constant comparisons with the newer Sigma HSM models than being actually slow compared to other screw drive lens' AF performance -- I could be wrong. An analogy would be comparing a car with 150 MPH potential with other cars -- against a 200MPH model it would be considered slow -- but if all the rest of the cars topped out at below or at 150, it would be average at worst, or just fast. I find it hard to believe that the Tamron's AF speed is below average for screw drive fast aperture tele lenses. Again, I haven't shot one, so I could be wrong. . .

Consider that the Tokina 80-200 AT-X Pro is considered a fast AF lens my most who have shot them -- personally I think that this might be due to perception -- the focusing elements in this lens seem to be relatively heavy, and there's a noticeable torque to the lens when it's focusing. It is reasonably fast and tends to not micro-adjust focus in AF with any body, but it seems like it's really cranking because of the "feel". This seems to be a trait of Tokina AF long tele zooms as the 80-400 AT-X does the same.

To offset this not-as-quick AF, the Tamron is the lightest of any lens in this class, the optical performance seems to be up with the leaders, screw drive allows easy compatibility with available TCs (a big plus IMO) -- and the price is right. This, to me at least, would be the winner unless absolute AF speed was the absolute top priority, and I was willing to pay the very significant price (50%) and weight (10 oz +) penalties to get it. I must also state that AF noise has never been a consideration for me.

Scott
10-31-2012, 01:24 PM   #23
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Scott, I thank you for your well-thought answer.

AF speed is an issue, but I understand how you view things and it makes sense. the Tamron also has hunting issues reported by several sources, and that does bother me, it's one limitation of the DFA macro WR lens I own, and it can be annoying.

I own no silent lens for the moment, but that would be a perk, not a deal-maker but a bonus.

I'm not interested in duplicating film era's 70-200 lenses (with the 50-135), I'm interested in getting good reach I briefly owned the A*300mm and I loved the reach it had (not its MF only focus, however).

I'm looking more and more at the Pentax 60-250, given that I found it at a great price in Canada. It's lighter than anything else and has more reach, WR (a real perk for me), quick-shift, and it would be new, with warranty. It's supposed to be a the top of the class optically, as light as the Tamron, has silent focus like the Sigma, and in this case not more expensive than a new Sigma lens. It IS more expensive than a new Tamron, or a used Tokina.

The Tokina remains a viable option, it would be the most inexpensive route for sure.With my intended use, Tamron's AF hunting worries me (I would have to test it, hard around here). The Sigma macro are supposed to be "soft". The newer Sigma and the Pentax are more expensive. argh! Going in circles

I'll sleep on it, and see how I feel by tomorrow morning. Or maybe I'll wait. Or maybe not

10-31-2012, 06:41 PM   #24
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We own the Tammy 70-200 f2.8 and we think the AF is very fast for all the glass it has to move. I honestly think that the only way to get more speed is to go to Canon. And we did try the Sigma 70-200 OS; it was a bit faster, a lot quieter, and nearly twice the price while being no sharper to our eyes. YMMV,

D&K
10-31-2012, 07:12 PM   #25
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Here is a typical(for us) pic from the Tammy at 200mm f4 on a very fast moving subject. There is no edge details here, but the field is pretty even center to edge in our experience. Use for personal uses only please. The crops are 100%.

D&K
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10-31-2012, 08:01 PM   #26
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Those look excellent... thanks for sharing.
11-02-2012, 05:17 AM   #27
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Small update : I finally decided to get the 60-250, seeing as I found it for 1200$. It was never on my list because of its too expensive price, but for that amount it was worth it, I believe. I can't wait to test it!
11-06-2012, 05:42 AM   #28
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I received the 60-250 yesterday evening, what a beautifully crafted lens! I'll have to run some daytime tests with it, but in low light inside my house AF is among the fastest I've seen, and silent focusing is marvelous! Makes me wish for a SDM 50mm lens with the size and performance of my F50 f1,7.
11-06-2012, 07:14 AM   #29
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Congrats on the 60-250 purchase! I have to agree on how nice the lens looks and feels - it's just a joy to handle. This lens is the one which is always on my K-5 as we are ready to grab a camera quickly when we see some wildlife outside. I constantly compare it to my FA* 300 4.5 and find it almost equal in the IQ department.

While there is no real replacement for your 50 1.7, I also adore my DA* 55 1.4 - yes also SDM.
11-06-2012, 07:19 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by bdery Quote
I received the 60-250 yesterday evening, what a beautifully crafted lens! I'll have to run some daytime tests with it, but in low light inside my house AF is among the fastest I've seen, and silent focusing is marvelous! Makes me wish for a SDM 50mm lens with the size and performance of my F50 f1,7.
We do have a SDM 50mm lens that performs as well (or better than the F50 1.7)

It's called the DA*55 F1.4

Bigger though - and some say the AF is a bit slower, but whatevaaa

Congrats on your purchase, I personally want a DA*60-250 also, but I bought my Tammy 70-200 a while ago and don't want two lenses over the same range.
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