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12-01-2012, 08:39 AM   #16
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Just open my DA*16-50 from BHphoto today. The box, everything seem new. I bought lenses and cameras and unlike buying cameras and lenses in Asia, all boxes here in US are unsealed.
My DA*16-50 is very sharp, and quick to focus. Happy.
My K5IIs has no problem too.

But, I read a Taiwan forum where he bought a DA*50-135 lens from BHPhoto during this sale and when he open the box, the lens hood is broken (it chip on the part where hood screw to lens). Now that guy is having a tough time getting it exchange (shipping cost). You live in US, so no worry, just get it exchange if you are not satisfy and thought you got an open box item. Hope you get yours exchange and happy again!

Lee

12-01-2012, 09:47 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by MPrince Quote
Alleging that a federal crime has occurred is a little over the top, don't you think? Have you considered the possibility that someone at B&H made a mistake? They are human, you know, just like you.

I have been dealing with B&H for years, and have never had any reason to question their integrity. Check out HenryP's posting history here and at dpreview, and you will see he does not hesitate to apologize for mistakes, and works to make things right as quickly as possible.
I don't know about crime, but it most likely isn't a mistake; as Adam suggested, it's a practice. It happened to me--I got equipment that was obviously not brand new from various stores, including B&H. There have been a couple of threads in which people explicitly asked B&H regarding this practice. No clear answer was given in those threads, which moderators abruptly closed.

The positive side is that one can return items fast to BH, Adorama, and other reputable stores. The downside is that we have to live with the suspicion that the equipment we get from these stores may not be brand new stuff. (In the prematurely closed threads on the issue, some people made the argument that the extremely flexible policy of reputable retailers is what actuates the practice of re-selling returned items.)

Last edited by causey; 12-01-2012 at 02:05 PM.
12-01-2012, 10:04 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by causey Quote
I don't know about crime, but it's not a mistake
And just how do you know, in this specific case, that it was not a mistake? Do you have evidence supporting your assertion?
12-01-2012, 10:12 AM   #19
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It's true, I can't have any evidence concerning this (or any other) specific case, but too many such cases have occurred... Just google "(re)sell(ing) returned lense(s)," and you'll find quite a few discussions on this subject.


Last edited by causey; 12-01-2012 at 02:07 PM.
12-01-2012, 11:18 AM   #20
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It is odd that Pentax does not have a section on their website for Refurbished lenses like Sigma does. If defective lenses are returned, where do they go?
12-01-2012, 11:29 AM   #21
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My last order at B&H was for an MP3 player, where a clearly used/demo unit was sold to me. They were not so gracious with the return, telling me I used the item (I was only able to get there the next weekend after the purchase.

This, coupled with local political tensions created by the community many B&H employees belong to, soured me to them. Not to mention the discrimination and labor issues against employees and fines: COURT APPROVES PAYMENT OF $4.3 MILLION TO HISPANIC WORKERS IN EEOC LAWSUIT AGAINST B & H FOTO
12-01-2012, 05:45 PM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
It is odd that Pentax does not have a section on their website for Refurbished lenses like Sigma does. If defective lenses are returned, where do they go?
This is a great question, one I've been trying to understand myself. I never see an refurbed Pentax gear anywhere, but it has to exist. I think it would be a terrible waste of money if they just destroyed all the "seconds".
12-01-2012, 07:16 PM   #23
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Earlier this year i purchased a set of headphones, advertised as new, from b & h, they clearly weren't new, the box had clearly been opened before and one of the drivers was installed upside down. In their defense, the return process was excellent.


Steve

12-01-2012, 07:22 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tanzer Quote
This is a great question, one I've been trying to understand myself. I never see an refurbed Pentax gear anywhere, but it has to exist. I think it would be a terrible waste of money if they just destroyed all the "seconds".
I would imagine that they use refurbed stuff in the repair loop, where a refurb is returned instead of what was sent in. Lots of companies do that, actually.
12-01-2012, 07:57 PM   #25
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prodigital2000 has a refurbished Pentax 31 f/1.8 for sale on ebay right now and I may have even seen some on Adorama's website in the past

Last edited by drugal; 12-01-2012 at 08:02 PM. Reason: simplifying my post
12-01-2012, 08:19 PM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by drugal Quote
prodigital2000 has a refurbished Pentax 31 f/1.8 for sale on ebay right now and I may have even seen some on Adorama's website in the past
That's news to me. Have you every seen any bodies up as refurbished?
12-01-2012, 08:31 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by dcshooter Quote
I know that this site has a business relationship with B+H, but you shouldn't be so quick to downplay a practice that is an honest-to-goodness federal crime. Just because "a lot of stores" do it doesn't make it legal or right.

Under the fair packaging and labeling act, the minute the item comes out of the shrinkwrap, the merchant is legally obliged to indicate it during future sales, or they are violating the law, plain and simple. Why do you think stores like Best Buy, et al. regularly sell open box items at a discount when they are often in perfect condition?

Likewise, "minimal wear" won't cut it. The item is either new or is not, and by selling a non-new item as new, a merchant is committing a fraud on the consumer.

Now I'm not saying B+H has a policy of foing this - for all I know, it could be a legitimate oversight. But I've already received confirmation in this thread that my experience has been abnormal, and I'll be sure to let B+H know that when I make my return request.
Wholeheartedly agreed. To see the staff here downplaying this is shameful.

Though they are right on one thing.. it is not exclusive to B&H.. I've seen a guitar ordered 'brand new' on Amazon show up with the box having tears and the pick guard having scratches.. clearly not brand new yet were charged as if it was brand new!

And this week I received the Elements 11 bundle from Amazon to notice, right out of the amazon box, the clear, plastic seal on the top of the actual Adobe box was already cut... arousing more suspicions, I opened the Adobe box to see one of the serial number stickers inside was half peeled and then reapplied (poorly)! It looks like someone had already been in there.. Amazon credited me for it though and also offered to exchange it.. but it's stupid to have to go through extra hoops when they don't do the right (and legal) thing in the first place!!

I've heard of a large department super store with prices doing this too... but at least there you can get a look see on most items if it is used already before buying.. online? not so much.
12-01-2012, 08:31 PM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
Have you every seen any bodies up as refurbished?
I don't remember any, sorry.
12-01-2012, 08:39 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by desmoface Quote
Earlier this year i purchased a set of headphones, advertised as new, from b & h, they clearly weren't new, the box had clearly been opened before and one of the drivers was installed upside down. In their defense, the return process was excellent.
How did they even think that was going to fly??


What really baffles me is they have a USED item department. I bought a keyboard workstation from there that was almost half off what it was going for brand new. When I took possession of it, it looked BRAND NEW!!!!! No dents, no scratches, no fingerprint smudges.. nothing. It even still had the plastic cover over the LCD.

So it boggles my mind that they can try to sell used stuff as new, but their truly used items can come looking new!
12-01-2012, 08:53 PM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by mee Quote
Wholeheartedly agreed. To see the staff here downplaying this is shameful.

Though they are right on one thing.. it is not exclusive to B&H.. I've seen a guitar ordered 'brand new' on Amazon show up with the box having tears and the pick guard having scratches.. clearly not brand new yet were charged as if it was brand new!

And this week I received the Elements 11 bundle from Amazon to notice, right out of the amazon box, the clear, plastic seal on the top of the actual Adobe box was already cut... arousing more suspicions, I opened the Adobe box to see one of the serial number stickers inside was half peeled and then reapplied (poorly)! It looks like someone had already been in there.. Amazon credited me for it though and also offered to exchange it.. but it's stupid to have to go through extra hoops when they don't do the right (and legal) thing in the first place!!

I've heard of a large department super store with prices doing this too... but at least there you can get a look see on most items if it is used already before buying.. online? not so much.
I don't see anywhere in the thread where "the staff" is down playing anything. I know that if I received an item as dcshooter described it, I would have contacted them about it immediately. It has been my experience with BH and Ador that they make things right. And to be clear, I don't have a working relationship with either. I am a paying customer like everyone else and have bought several items from both over the years and got a couple of good deals on Black Friday. I always try to vet new items immediately to make sure there were no QC issues etc. with them.
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