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12-03-2012, 07:54 PM - 2 Likes   #136
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Unilateral Pricing Policy

Does anyone have a link to this? I am an attorney who has developed MAP policies for clients but never a UPP. Such a policy has potential risks from an antitrust standpoint. The attempts at justification on Ned's photo blog here fail to make the case.

Plus, Pentax seems to be shooting themselves in the foot.

12-03-2012, 07:55 PM   #137
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I'm always opposed to corporate price gouging.
12-03-2012, 07:56 PM   #138
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I own (2) Pentax lens (Kit), (6) Sigma lens and (1) Tamron. And we all know why.
12-03-2012, 07:56 PM   #139
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I agree! Most of the lenses I have were bought used. Thanks for bringing this up.

12-03-2012, 07:56 PM   #140
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I would love to see Pentax DSLR/mirrorless cameras and lenses in stores around here. Some already do carry Pentax, but it is online only, and that is a pity; Pentax cameras are tough and feel great in your hands; that alone would help in the sales.
In order for customers to buy Pentax and to catch the attention of potential buyers, Pentax must push its products onto store shelves. In doing so, they also need to rethink their prices and make them in the same ballpark as what the other competition has to offer. I don't want to pay a premium for my lenses just because I chose Pentax and neither do other people.
12-03-2012, 07:57 PM   #141
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it seems to me that Pentax had a slow start but now things are going @ a faster pace putting new glass out there for competion but these prices are going to kill
there business .All I see is Canon,Nikon the big main staysn,Ihave aske some of the makers of remote flash radio systems as Quantum how come they only make systems for Canon & Nikon they tell me the other camera makers might not be reliable in the future.Pentax is putting cameras out at a alarming rate,people can't afford these prices,something has got to give.People leaving Pentax is not a good sign,Ihave a Pentaxk20D,would like to get a back up body but I can't afford it myself.
DUBCITYMAN USA
12-03-2012, 07:59 PM   #142
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I have more gear to buy and will spend my money if there is a reasonable incentive to do so.
I did just get in on the DA55 during cyber Monday at B&H.
12-03-2012, 07:59 PM   #143
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I'm a fan of pentax, but it's getting really hard to come up with reasons for sticking with this brand. Most little camera stores suck, and even if they don't all they carry is nikon and canon anyways. Finding nearly anything in stock for pentax at a camera shop is impossible. These absurd lens prices put the last nail in the coffin as far as im concerned. If I didn't get my k-5 as gift I would have surely went with another brand.

12-03-2012, 08:01 PM   #144
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
It's time to put the online MSRP thing to an end. Back in April, through a "Unilateral Pricing Policy" (UPP), Pentax USA forced online retailers to start selling Pentax lenses at full MSRP rather than the then-lower MAP prices. Refer to the article below for an overview of the price jumps. Some lenses nearly doubled in price!

Brutal Pentax Lens Price Increase: 15-90% - Pentax Camera News & Rumors - PentaxForums.com

Since this change, online sales of Pentax lenses have virtually come to a standstill because of the high, artificially-inflated prices. I'm sure you guys can testify to that, especially if you opted to use the Marketplace or get Sigma lenses rather than new Pentax ones. Just because the DA* 16-50mm has an MSRP of $1500 doesn't mean that anyone in the right mind will buy a used copy at the new high price: in fact, used Pentax lens prices are generally lower than the old MAP prices.

All of a sudden, this Black Friday weekend, the UPP restriction was temporarily lifted, and Pentax lens prices fell sharply for a few days (but some were still higher than the old prices). Here's a little insight into what gear really started moving:



In just one day, well over 100 new Pentax lenses were sold to PF members alone. That's more that the total number sold to PF members after the introduction of the UPP but before Black Friday.

So what good is this UPP thing doing? None at all. When it originally came about, Ned Bunnell, former President of Pentax USA, blogged about the UPP, saying that the main goal of the policy was to protect smaller brick-and-mortar stores so that they don't have to compete with really low online prices. Well, that's great and all, but you can count on your fingers how many such stores there are. And the funny thing is that if you walk into any one of these stores, you'll see the old prices. The same applies if you call B&H or Adorama: you'll generally get the old prices as long as you mention it (and if you walk in to the store, there's no question about it) On top of all this, rumors have it the Pentax USA distributor requires retailers to place large orders, which causes smaller stores to lose interest in carrying the brand, given the tiny demand that there is for Pentax to begin with.

The UPP isn't going to change the fact that the largest audience for Pentax lenses is found online, because of the fact that Pentax users are few and far between. This means that the new policy has done nothing but prevented users otherwise interested in Pentax lenses from buying them.


Above: the Pentax DA* 50-135mm is the star of the UPP, jumping from $749 to $1599

I was on the phone with B&H again today, and after I mentioned the recent Adorama deals, their buyer agreed to drop the price of the 15mm limited to $539 when in cart. B&H said that if this deal ends up getting more copies of the lens sold, they will do their best to post similar deals in the future, even if Pentax doesn't get rid of the UPP. Lowering prices after adding to cart, without advertising them, is a gray area: Pentax can't really say that it's a violation of the UPP, but they certainly won't be happy about it. B&H admitted that it was nice to see some stock get cleared out during Black Friday, so hopefully they'll be giving Pentax stuff a little bit more attention from now on.

While I'm sure B&H will be the first to offer the best online Pentax lens prices, they alone won't be able to change the way things work, because Pentax lenses and cameras are dwarfed by all other DSLR brands.

Almost all other camera brands have unilateral pricing policies. The difference, however, is that in-store prices are the same as online prices, and that no lenses doubled in price from one day to the next. This keeps prices constant across the board and successfully protects the market, unlike the Pentax policy, which one might say was late to the game. So, Pentax, consider this a petition on behalf of our entire community asking you to rethink your online marketing strategy.

If the UPP has prevented or discouraged you from buying a Pentax lens, or even forced you to switch brands, and if you want prices to go back to normal, sign the petition by replying to this thread. Let's make this the biggest thread in the whole lens forum: hopefully it'll send a strong message!


And if you want, I can go on with more reasons for why the UPP is bad:
  • Competitors have similarly-priced full-frame glass
  • Sigma has cheaper lenses and also offers premium lenses
  • People will avoid new lenses in favor of cheap manual lenses
As much as I hate to do it, I'd like to ask that the replies be limited to members based in the US, or who regularly import Pentax lenses from US online retailers.
As a struggling pro, I would love to be able to upgrade my equipment and continue to use genuine Pentax glass. Please lower the prices for all us loyal (30+ years) Pentaxians!
12-03-2012, 08:02 PM   #145
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I'm in too.
12-03-2012, 08:02 PM   #146
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As a wedding photographer it's hard not to want to switch to another brand with prices like this. Buy new lenses for my K7 or get a camera with better high ISO quality... Your making my decision for me really! I won't be buying anymore Pentax lenses. Glad I got the three I really wanted before all this BS.
12-03-2012, 08:02 PM   #147
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We want glass!

The high lens prices have definitely prevented me from expanding my kit. I bought my first Pentax DSLR, a K-5, last year. I currently only have a DA 18-55mm. The Pentax lens prices had previously given me pause at buying more, even before the UPP. Now, they are simply unaffordable. I don't know when I'll be able to flex the muscles of my K-5 if things don't change. I may even be forced to sell and go the route of (ugh) Canon.
12-03-2012, 08:05 PM   #148
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I have not bought a new Pentax lens because I can get used ones, primarily manual, for far less with great image quality. Still, I would love to be able to afford a couple of the new Pentax lenses but these ridiculous prices are simply too high! So I am in!
12-03-2012, 08:06 PM   #149
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count me in aswell.

I have a Canon 60D with a couple of lenses, and now a used K7 and a Sigma 50/1.4 - I will see how it goes and maybe switch to Pentax completely but new lenses I cannot afford at MSP... It should be at least competitive to some of the Nikon glass and currently it is not.
12-03-2012, 08:11 PM   #150
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Count me in
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