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05-24-2013, 04:55 AM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
Is there a difference in your experience in the build quality (not IQ, coatings, aperture performance, etc.) between the FA and DA limited lenses?
i think, building quality of these lenses ar equal

05-24-2013, 04:57 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
Is there a difference in your experience in the build quality (not IQ, coatings, aperture performance, etc.) between the FA and DA limited lenses?
i think the build quality is the same
05-24-2013, 08:09 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by ElJamoquio Quote
I have a Zeiss lens from a few years back. I think it feels kinda crappy compared to the Pentax stuff.
Define "Zeiss".

Various Japanese companies
made some "Zeiss" branded lenses
back in the post-DDR period.
05-24-2013, 08:26 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by robbiec Quote
An FA Limited feels kinda cheap compared to a current Carl Zeiss optic...
Hmmm...that is pretty typical when comparing build for a quality manual focus vs. auto focus lens. My only complaint regarding build with my FA 77/1.8 is that the focus lacks the smoothness of my vintage manual focus glass. Other than that, the Limited's build is up to historic standards for high end optics.

As for heft...if that is the standard, I have a Jupiter-9 85/2 that should make your happy.


Steve


Last edited by stevebrot; 05-24-2013 at 08:40 AM.
05-24-2013, 08:37 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by lytrytyr Quote
Define "Zeiss".

Various Japanese companies
made some "Zeiss" branded lenses
back in the post-DDR period.
Yes, the infamous faux CZJ lenses. That being said, some (most?) of the "real" CZ Jena stuff was not very well made either. I am thinking particularly of the Pancolar 80/1.8. Incredible optic with a flimsy diaphragm mechanism. They are hard to come by primarily because they are all broken!!


Steve
05-24-2013, 02:11 PM - 2 Likes   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Hmmm...that is pretty typical when comparing build for a quality manual focus vs. auto focus lens. My only complaint regarding build with my FA 77/1.8 is that the focus lacks the smoothness of my vintage manual focus glass. Other than that, the Limited's build is up to historic standards for high end optics.

As for heft...if that is the standard, I have a Jupiter-9 85/2 that should make your happy.


Steve
Bollocks. A new Carl Zeiss T* lens is better built, with better tolerances, nicer tactile feel and comes shipped in a box that actually looks like the manufacturer cared about its products. It's not heft I'm talking about, it is tighter tolerances all round with superb design detail. The Limited's should arrive in a special package completely different from the run of the mill lenses. If Pentax wants to differentiate itself, it should show it by making sure their flagship lenses have a wow factor from the moment the box is handed over, when you open it and read a booklet citing the design philosophy behind each lens, a form with the QA signed off personally, the lens tightly and safety packed in moulded Styrofoam. It's little details like this that capture and create a special aura, a reputation. Buy a FA Limited now and it arrives in a grey cardboard box wrapped in cardboard. It's a lens... That's all. When it should be an event, it should excite, fingers trembling a bit, your goal reached, a world class optic obtained.
05-24-2013, 02:31 PM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by robbiec Quote
Bollocks. A new Carl Zeiss T* lens is better built, with better tolerances, nicer tactile feel and comes shipped in a box that actually looks like the manufacturer cared about its products. It's not heft I'm talking about, it is tighter tolerances all round with superb design detail. The Limited's should arrive in a special package completely different from the run of the mill lenses. If Pentax wants to differentiate itself, it should show it by making sure their flagship lenses have a wow factor from the moment the box is handed over, when you open it and read a booklet citing the design philosophy behind each lens, a form with the QA signed off personally, the lens tightly and safety packed in moulded Styrofoam. It's little details like this that capture and create a special aura, a reputation. Buy a FA Limited now and it arrives in a grey cardboard box wrapped in cardboard. It's a lens... That's all. When it should be an event, it should excite, fingers trembling a bit, your goal reached, a world class optic obtained.
Better ideas at PF than at PRIC, that's for certain. Nice job.
05-24-2013, 02:54 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by robbiec Quote
Bollocks. A new Carl Zeiss T* lens is better built, with better tolerances, nicer tactile feel and comes shipped in a box that actually looks like the manufacturer cared about its products. It's not heft I'm talking about, it is tighter tolerances all round with superb design detail. The Limited's should arrive in a special package completely different from the run of the mill lenses.
You mean sort of like my FA 77/1.8? I still have my packaging and the leather pouch and the special lens cap. Regarding the QA sign-off...ALL FSU lenses (Jupiter-9 included) came with a QA sign-off certificate. That is obviously indication of superb quality. As for the foam, I have original packing for quite a few of my cameras and lenses. One has a cut-out foam insert, a Focal (K-Mart house brand) 200mm in Minolta MD mount. Also, obviously a mark of quality.

As for the build quality...The current generation Zeiss and Voigtlander (both Cosina-made) are nice, but they are not head and shoulders above the Limiteds, or the historic standards for premium lenses in general. So, yes...

They are only lenses...


Steve

(...my Limited shares space in the bag with the Zenitar Fisheye and Helios 44M...no special treatment...even make it wear a generic lens cap and generic pouch...just a lens, that's all...)

05-24-2013, 03:08 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
You mean sort of like my FA 77/1.8? I still have my packaging and the leather pouch and the special lens cap. Regarding the QA sign-off...ALL FSU lenses (Jupiter-9 included) came with a QA sign-off certificate. That is obviously indication of superb quality. As for the foam, I have original packing for quite a few of my cameras and lenses. One has a cut-out foam insert, a Focal (K-Mart house brand) 200mm in Minolta MD mount. Also, obviously a mark of quality.

As for the build quality...The current generation Zeiss and Voigtlander (both Cosina-made) are nice, but they are not head and shoulders above the Limiteds, or the historic standards for premium lenses in general. So, yes...

They are only lenses...


Steve

(...my Limited shares space in the bag with the Zenitar Fisheye and Helios 44M...no special treatment...even make it wear a generic lens cap and generic pouch...just a lens, that's all...)
Steve,

Yes, it's a lens. But with PRIC's new pricing and approach they do need to step up their packaging and associated materials if they want to be perceived as a Deluxe brand that commands top dollar. I've purchased 3 LImiteds and the packaging, other than the bag that comes with them, is not any different than for the standard lenses. So, you get a cardboard box for a $150 kit lens and the same packaging for a $1250 "Limited" lens.
05-24-2013, 03:48 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
So, you get a cardboard box for a $150 kit lens and the same packaging for a $1250 "Limited" lens.
Oh! I get it! Sort of like when multi-packs of Rollei Retro film (Agfa APX confectured by Maco) came packaged in nice hinge-topped hardwood boxes or the cheap filters that come in lacquered wood cases?

Maybe they should package them in a special humidor or some-such?

I don't shoot Canon, but does anybody know if they package their "L" glass differently than the consumer stuff?


Steve

(...am pinging a friend of mine who is a Canon shooter...)
05-24-2013, 04:25 PM   #26
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Feel like i'm on a fools errand here but here goes. The FA Limited line of lenses have a certain mystique, a certain aura around them both in the Pentax community and in the broader photographic community in general. Now correct me if I am wrong Steve, but you are saying that the FA Limited's are among the best engineered and crafted lenses you can buy? Lets agree on this and I'll add to that by saying it is mine and perhaps others opinions on here and elsewhere that Pentax should capitalize on this reputation and add to it by making sure that ownership details like the packaging, QA docs, manuals, etc, etc should be of higher quality than they are currently. Details like this are appreciated and add to the reputation of the Limited line especially for not too much extra, while adding massively to the reputation of the brand overall due to the halo effect of the flagship offerings.
05-24-2013, 04:45 PM   #27
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No difference in build quality, there's just more metal and glass in FA's though. Resale is better too.
05-24-2013, 04:56 PM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by robbiec Quote
Now correct me if I am wrong Steve, but you are saying that the FA Limited's are among the best engineered and crafted lenses you can buy?
Agreed...

QuoteOriginally posted by robbiec Quote
Lets agree on this and I'll add to that by saying it is mine and perhaps others opinions on here and elsewhere that Pentax should capitalize on this reputation and add to it by making sure that ownership details like the packaging, QA docs, manuals, etc, etc should be of higher quality than they are currently.
Maybe not a bad idea...doing so would at least improve on meeting post-purchase expectations.


Steve
05-24-2013, 05:08 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Oh! I get it! Sort of like when multi-packs of Rollei Retro film (Agfa APX confectured by Maco) came packaged in nice hinge-topped hardwood boxes or the cheap filters that come in lacquered wood cases?

Maybe they should package them in a special humidor or some-such?

I don't shoot Canon, but does anybody know if they package their "L" glass differently than the consumer stuff?


Steve

(...am pinging a friend of mine who is a Canon shooter...)
Here are some Ls and their boxes.





Here is a standard 50mm and its kit


I don't think its a matter of matching Canon, but exceeding them. What's wrong with upping the ante a bit and exceeding expectations by creating an event when you get an expensive Pentax Limited lens?

Last edited by Docrwm; 05-24-2013 at 05:14 PM.
05-24-2013, 05:24 PM   #30
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I'd settle for more protective packaging, at least here in the US where UPS and FedEx package handlers reign. I hate having to worry every time I open a beat-up box from B&H or Adorama that has all the air pillows stuff in one corner of the box and the expensive stuff crammed into one corner, as if a couple mm of cardboard (and a leatherette pouch) is going to help a lot.
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