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06-07-2013, 11:56 AM   #61
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QuoteOriginally posted by Parallax Quote
I see it this way; if he had asked you what it was worth, or what you would give him for it and you offered $20.00 you could, arguably, have a reason to feel guilty. I say arguably because in the internet age he could easily have researched the value of the lens. With that premise in mind, combined with the fact that he made you the offer, you have no reason to feel guilty.
I'd agree with this ^^ take.

I would feel guilty if the seller was (for example) very old, maybe living on Social security, and was desperately trying to sell household items to get by.... something like that.

But if someone's just clueless, didn't do research, and you didn't willfully mislead - you scored cleanly!

06-08-2013, 12:47 PM   #62
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QuoteOriginally posted by Heie Quote
There's a reason you posted this here and in the manner and tone that you did.

There are some things worth more than money...
What he said ^

An honest character is worth more than all the money and all the lenses in the world. From my point of view, there are two parts to honesty: not lying, and telling the truth. It's not a question of how well off the other person is, or the direct consequences of the action- those are justifications. For me, honesty comes down to doing the right thing as often as I can, and making the utmost amends when I fail to do so. I feel this is the least I can do for a fellow human being.
06-08-2013, 01:36 PM - 2 Likes   #63
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Two things to consider:

Price: What the seller is willing to accept in a sale

Value: What a buyer is willing to pay
These two truths are present in any transaction. Value is driven by perceived need and almost always somewhat higher than price, otherwise there is no sale. Original cost or the amount of a recent sale may influence price, but ultimately this is determined by eagerness (need) to sell.

Fraud is what happens when the purported points of value to justify price are not true. It is not fraud to value something at greater than the asked price.

Oh...one last thing:

Cost: The amount of the transaction
Cost is only considered if the sale completes (duh) and is obviously somewhere in between the two factors noted above.


Steve
06-08-2013, 03:28 PM   #64
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Two things to consider:

Price: What the seller is willing to accept in a sale

Value: What a buyer is willing to pay
These two truths are present in any transaction. Value is driven by perceived need and almost always somewhat higher than price, otherwise there is no sale. Original cost or the amount of a recent sale may influence price, but ultimately this is determined by eagerness (need) to sell.

Fraud is what happens when the purported points of value to justify price are not true. It is not fraud to value something at greater than the asked price.

Oh...one last thing:

Cost: The amount of the transaction
Cost is only considered if the sale completes (duh) and is obviously somewhere in between the two factors noted above.


Steve
I agree with that completely.

How much money you get has everything to do with how much effort you put into selling your item. Educating yourself on what your selling has a lot to do with it, yes, but also effort. People sell to pawn shops for a quick buck. They give stuff away to Goodwill for a tax write-off. They have a garage sale because they need space and don't want to toss it, and they toss it when they just don't want to be bothered. These people aren't getting rich. They're not selling items at online auctions, specialized auctions or to special interest groups (like here). Much of the time they realize that if they market their item, or become an expert on their item, or seek out the perfect audience looking for their item, they will make more money. But they choose an easier, less time consuming manor of sale. And there's nothing wrong with that.

I live on an Air Force Base and people are moving all of the time. Every week I walk around my neighborhood looking to see what people put out for the curb for bulk trash pick up. You'd be surprised. Computers, furniture, bikes, grills, TVs, AV equipment, toys, etc. Really nice stuff!! These people know what they're tossing away has value, it is just not of value to them at that moment. And if they realize it has value, much of the time they wouldn't care if they did. I don't need to knock on their door and say, "hey, why are you throwing away this awesome stuff instead of selling this awesome stuff, are you crazy?"

I know that example is different than a sale, but they all play into the same thing. People that put more effort into selling or getting rid of their stuff will get more out if it. People that look for a quick and easy way, won't. Bottom line.

06-21-2013, 10:47 PM   #65
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
That sentence doesn't make any sense to me.
It is an English language saying that means that the statement may often be made, but that it is not based in fact. At least this is the case for the Pentax line of lenses. The various 50/1.2 and 50/1.4 lenses are good, but the large aperture comes at a price of money, bulk, and weight with marginal, if any increase in performance. Based on most user accounts, the slower 55/1.8 and 50/1.7 lenses are equivalent or sharper until about f/8 and after that it is a toss-up.

That being said, I do know of one objective comparison test. Here is a link to a series of lens test shots done by forum member LesDMess comparing full resolution crops from the K20D for various Pentax fast 50s:

(Caution...huge download!) http://www.fototime.com/AFA3C6EDB6A663D/orig.jpg

Note the red arrows indicating the resolution limits. It is easy enough to choose a column for the aperture of interest and simply scroll down to see which lenses are better. As you can see, the K 50/1.2 is very slightly sharper at f/2 than the M50/1.7 at f/1.7, but at other apertures the M50/1.7 is the same or better. Overall, I would consider the comparison to be a draw in terms of resolution.

It is this is the kind of result that causes me to consistently recommend purchase of the 55/1.8 and 50/1.7 lenses over the f/1.4 and f/1.2 versions. The big exception being if the user truly needs the limited DOF or low-light performance of the faster lenses. The same is true for bokeh or some other rendering characteristic. Considering the considerable price difference between the K50/1.2 and the M50/1.7, I see little reason to spring for the faster lens.

To mess things up a little more, consider the budget version M50/2 (much cheaper when new and less sophisticated design) in the same test. It lags the pack all the way to f/8. I don't know what the story is with the A50/2. It looks to be the top performer except that it appears that its shots were done from a closer tripod position and therefore not strictly comparable to the others.


Steve
06-23-2013, 05:48 PM   #66
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Caveat venditor.

It's a tough moral call because the inherent adversarial position about maximizing a bargain through knowledge is part of market rules, it is generally (and often legally) frowned upon for one party to have secret knowledge. It's not up to you to correct his knowledge. If he'd offered a 50/2 and it turned out to be a 1.2, then you'd be in a position of mistrust with the onus on you to correct the terms. Since he offered a 1.2 and bargained to vend one, with plenty of opportunity to have a look around about fair value prior to closing, then the onus was on him. Your agin, but not really his actual loss. Sounds like his loss was market opportunity, not mercantile.

Enjoy.
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