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12-10-2013, 09:35 AM   #61
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QuoteOriginally posted by DragonLord Quote
I should be able to drop off my lens tomorrow at the local UPS pick-up point, using a label provided to me by Ricoh. Once they receive it, a replacement will be shipped as soon as possible.

--DragonLord
QuoteOriginally posted by crewl1 Quote
I was watching this space to see when you would get a resolution. Good to hear.
QuoteOriginally posted by interested_observer Quote
Wonderful, Outstanding news!!!!

Good for you, DL and good for Ricoh, too!!

01-24-2014, 02:31 PM   #62
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A replacement has just shipped and is scheduled for delivery on Friday, January 31.

--DragonLord
01-24-2014, 05:53 PM   #63
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Great news!
01-28-2014, 09:05 AM   #64
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Shipping is delayed--but to test the lens!

C.R.I.S. didn't actually ship out the lens. When I checked last night, it said that it needed my attention. I got worried that something might have went wrong during the shipping stage...

It turns out Pentax instructed C.R.I.S. to test the lens before shipping it out. I have a basketball game to shoot on Friday, so I have spoken to them about expedited shipping options and will get a call back shortly.

--DragonLord

01-28-2014, 09:16 AM - 1 Like   #65
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Well gotta admit, it's nice that Pentax gave specific instructions to test the lens before sending to you
01-28-2014, 10:46 AM   #66
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QuoteOriginally posted by DragonLord Quote
C.R.I.S. didn't actually ship out the lens. When I checked last night, it said that it needed my attention. I got worried that something might have went wrong during the shipping stage...

It turns out Pentax instructed C.R.I.S. to test the lens before shipping it out. I have a basketball game to shoot on Friday, so I have spoken to them about expedited shipping options and will get a call back shortly.

--DragonLord
This sounds nuts. I've been a mechanic for over 40 years. It should be standard practice to test something that has been repaired. Almost all come backs can be avoided by a simple "test". Yeah, it takes a little more time but you avoid the "we do it right because we do it twice" reputation.
01-28-2014, 11:07 AM   #67
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QuoteOriginally posted by JinDesu Quote
Well gotta admit, it's nice that Pentax gave specific instructions to test the lens before sending to you
QuoteOriginally posted by reeftool Quote
This sounds nuts. I've been a mechanic for over 40 years. It should be standard practice to test something that has been repaired. Almost all come backs can be avoided by a simple "test". Yeah, it takes a little more time but you avoid the "we do it right because we do it twice" reputation.
If I am not mistaken Pentax is sending a brand new replacement lens since there has been so much heartache for DragonLord and his original DA*60~250. I think he's simply pointing out the irony that, trying to be absolutely certain he gets a tuned, factory-spec lens - C.R.I.S. and Pentax may actually have sorta stubbed their toe again.

Can we say 'SnakeBit?'
01-28-2014, 11:09 AM   #68
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I can finally see this through...

Technician says lens is "perfect" and that "he wouldn't want to touch it". It is being shipped via UPS Second Day Air at no charge.



--DragonLord

P.S. What probably happened is that the replacement was tested and confirmed to be sharp corner to corner (beyond specification). I am so happy to finally have my lens back...

01-28-2014, 09:34 PM   #69
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Package is in transit and scheduled for delivery on Thursday, January 30.

--DragonLord
01-30-2014, 06:07 AM   #70
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QuoteOriginally posted by DragonLord Quote
Technician says lens is "perfect" and that "he wouldn't want to touch it". It is being shipped via UPS Second Day Air at no charge.



--DragonLord

P.S. What probably happened is that the replacement was tested and confirmed to be sharp corner to corner (beyond specification). I am so happy to finally have my lens back...
For that price, "sharp corner to corner" shouldn't be beyond specification. I don't think it's possible for the entire frame to be sharper than the theoretical lens design would allow, and I'd consider the design to be the specification. Every copy will fall short in some respect, since manufacturing can't be as perfect as theory. But with a lens that expensive, you expect the product to come relatively close to the design. I have doubts, based on my experience with Pentax and Sigma anyway, that there are actually sharpness specifications - like so many lines per millimeter before the lens is "bad." My guess is that it's more based on customer complaint persistence. Certainly the factory doesn't test lenses to that degree, and the (factory, not CRIS) service I've experienced either hasn't had the capability to do it, or has chosen not to.

However in this case it's encouraging that there's at at least a possible resolution to this in progress. We're all eagerly awaiting a verdict on the new lens.
01-30-2014, 07:27 AM   #71
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QuoteOriginally posted by tibbitts Quote
For that price, "sharp corner to corner" shouldn't be beyond specification. I don't think it's possible for the entire frame to be sharper than the theoretical lens design would allow, and I'd consider the design to be the specification. Every copy will fall short in some respect, since manufacturing can't be as perfect as theory. But with a lens that expensive, you expect the product to come relatively close to the design. I have doubts, based on my experience with Pentax and Sigma anyway, that there are actually sharpness specifications - like so many lines per millimeter before the lens is "bad." My guess is that it's more based on customer complaint persistence. Certainly the factory doesn't test lenses to that degree, and the (factory, not CRIS) service I've experienced either hasn't had the capability to do it, or has chosen not to.

However in this case it's encouraging that there's at at least a possible resolution to this in progress. We're all eagerly awaiting a verdict on the new lens.
How much would the price increase if they started discarding lenses that didn't meet the selected spec? The assumption you make that undermines this theory is, that the lens could be produced to a specific sharpness spec, for the same money it is produced now. Assuming that they should be able to do it, doesn't mean it's possible. And that wouldn't solve the problem of the lens being at the bottom of a palate on the UPS truck and being dropped 3 feet with a pile of other stuff on top of it coming off the back of a plane conveyor. . Manufacture to tighter spec, build lenses like tanks essentially making them shock proof... or maybe this is the best set of compromises. I don't claim to have any specific knowledge as to what might be the case...and I'm pretty sceptical of anyone who claims they do.

Last edited by normhead; 01-30-2014 at 07:33 AM.
01-30-2014, 07:09 PM   #72
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Just opened the box--and some good news right off the bat.

The lens isn't new old stock. It is shipped in full retail packaging, and the box is marked "Pentax Ricoh Imaging Co., Ltd." with an "AW - All Weather" mark on it. The supplied operating manual is branded "Ricoh". The "Notification of Change in Company Name" reflects the most recent name change to "Ricoh Imaging Company Ltd." as of August 1, 2013.

This is a new production lens. There is no reason to be concerned about the SDM at all.

I'll post test results soon.

--DragonLord
01-30-2014, 07:16 PM   #73
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
How much would the price increase if they started discarding lenses that didn't meet the selected spec? The assumption you make that undermines this theory is, that the lens could be produced to a specific sharpness spec, for the same money it is produced now. Assuming that they should be able to do it, doesn't mean it's possible. And that wouldn't solve the problem of the lens being at the bottom of a palate on the UPS truck and being dropped 3 feet with a pile of other stuff on top of it coming off the back of a plane conveyor. . Manufacture to tighter spec, build lenses like tanks essentially making them shock proof... or maybe this is the best set of compromises. I don't claim to have any specific knowledge as to what might be the case...and I'm pretty sceptical of anyone who claims they do.
Almost all manufacturers discard or recycle items that don't meet specifications. The only debate is with regard to lenses is:

1. is there any testing at all?

2. if so what are the tolerances relative to the specifications?

It's also possible that the only testing relative to a specification is, for example, physical alignment of the components. Sometime each component can be very close to specified alignment, but the aggregate of several tolerances being off can combine to result in poor performance. It's possible that each individual tolerance is being measured, but not the resulting aggregate performance. We won't know, unless somebody involved on the manufacturing side tells us.

I don't believe the UPS scenario as affects a high percentage of lenses, since if it did, the manufacturers would respond by (relatively low cost) packaging improvements. Some extra foam is cheaper than having a high percentage of lenses returned as defective.
01-30-2014, 07:19 PM - 1 Like   #74
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Finally!

The lens has been confirmed as sharp corner to corner.

--DragonLord
01-30-2014, 07:25 PM   #75
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QuoteOriginally posted by DragonLord Quote
The lens has been confirmed as sharp corner to corner.

--DragonLord
Alright, now go and take some pictures! And share with us!
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