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12-30-2013, 06:35 PM   #1
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Pentax teleconvertor

The Pentax Rod Map for 2013 includes a x1.4 teleconvertor. Just wondering if this has been brought out yet?

Also - I wonder what future plans Pentax have in closing the gap between the DA*300 & the DA560?? (in both focal length terms and monetary values).

Personally, after having a third party lens fail on me (because Pentax don't do similar focal lengths)...I'm seriously considering alternative options, not because I don't like Pentax - I think they make great equipment, but because the gaps are huge and it's blatantly obvious to me now, that Pentax do not cater for sports photographers like myself.

There is a gap of at least $5k and 260mm that Pentax will have to address at some point, otherwise - they will be shutting more people like myself out of the Pentax/Ricoh system.

I'm interested to know if there are others out there who are faced with the same dilemma.

Thank you and Happy New Year to all.

12-30-2013, 06:53 PM   #2
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QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
The Pentax Rod Map for 2013 includes a x1.4 teleconvertor. Just wondering if this has been brought out yet?
No, the road map says 2013 or later. So unless there is a major announcement tomorrow, we are going into 'later'. I think that TC has been on the road map for about 5 years now.
QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
I wonder what future plans Pentax have in closing the gap between the DA*300 & the DA560??
There is a 120-380ish zoom on the road map but nothing, not even rumors on a possible release date or price. And nothing at all on other long glass. That is certainly a hole in their line up, but filling it will be expensive for them and not likely to be profitable.
QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
it's blatantly obvious to me now, that Pentax do not cater for sports photographers like myself.
Probably true. Canon and Nikon both have a much bigger presence in that area along with the glass and pro support needed.
QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
There is a gap of at least $5k and 260mm that Pentax will have to address at some point, otherwise - they will be shutting more people like myself out of the Pentax/Ricoh system.
Possibly true, assuming they are trying to compete in that area. I'm not sure they are or that it would be smart to do so. Sports photography is pretty locked up with high end Canon/Nikon stuff and to even attempt to crack that market would take enormous resources at this time.

Unfortunately, if big, long, fast glass is what you need Pentax may not be the brand for you.
12-30-2013, 07:39 PM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
Possibly true, assuming they are trying to compete in that area. I'm not sure they are or that it would be smart to do so. Sports photography is pretty locked up with high end Canon/Nikon stuff and to even attempt to crack that market would take enormous resources at this time.
Thanks for your reply Jatrax.

I think that you could apply your comment to FF as well - seeing as that particular market is also locked up with Canon/Nikon, but I digress....

QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
Unfortunately, if big, long, fast glass is what you need Pentax may not be the brand for you.
Bit sad really. Pentax made some fine glass of this nature many years ago.

Cheers.
12-30-2013, 08:52 PM   #4
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If you think to go FF you may want to think twice. The equivalent to the Pentax 560mm F5.6 is an 800mm F5.6. Nikons model costs USD 18000, or more than twice that of the Pentax. In my view APS-C is the way to go for telephoto for cost and weight reasons.

With a 24 MP sensor the gap from 300mm to 560mm isn't larger than it can be covered by cropping, it isn't even a factor of two. And it would be somewhat inconvenient to be swapping between 300mm, 400mm, 500mm, 600mm primes all the time even if you had the entire array! Long lenses are monsters and not that easy to handle.

For sports I would think a zoom would be the way to go if you don't want to go the cropping route. Granted, you'd have to go third party for that.

With all that said - the Pentax 560mm is probably not ideal for sports. It is quite long physically and clumsy to handle. It feels at home on a gimbal head for birding and such. Believe me, I've tried it.

If you can find the FA* 400mm that might be an option. It is compact for its focal length, tack sharp, and can even be handheld with good results (in-camera shake reduction helps of course). But still - the zoom route for sports might be preferable.

12-31-2013, 03:23 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ole Quote
If you think to go FF you may want to think twice. The equivalent to the Pentax 560mm F5.6 is an 800mm F5.6. Nikons model costs USD 18000, or more than twice that of the Pentax. In my view APS-C is the way to go for telephoto for cost and weight reasons.

With a 24 MP sensor the gap from 300mm to 560mm isn't larger than it can be covered by cropping, it isn't even a factor of two. And it would be somewhat inconvenient to be swapping between 300mm, 400mm, 500mm, 600mm primes all the time even if you had the entire array! Long lenses are monsters and not that easy to handle.

For sports I would think a zoom would be the way to go if you don't want to go the cropping route. Granted, you'd have to go third party for that.

With all that said - the Pentax 560mm is probably not ideal for sports. It is quite long physically and clumsy to handle. It feels at home on a gimbal head for birding and such. Believe me, I've tried it.

If you can find the FA* 400mm that might be an option. It is compact for its focal length, tack sharp, and can even be handheld with good results (in-camera shake reduction helps of course). But still - the zoom route for sports might be preferable.
Come on, the Pentax 560 cannot be compared to an 800 mm lens. It should be compared to a 2.8/300 and 2x TC - something Pentax decided not to present. Instead they designed a funny long long 560 mm design.

Pentax does not offer high end long tele glass, so TCs are not really needed. I keep my Tamron 1.4x TC with SDM support for my 4/300. Pentax missed a great opportunity with the 5.6/560 - a 2.8/300 plus 2x TC would have been much more interesting, but somebody decided that a 2.8 lens is to close to a 4/300.
Why do you mention the FA*400/5.6 lens and not the FA*2.8/300 or the FA*4/600. Not too long ago Pentax had seomthing to offer in this range. The 50-135 needs no TC because there are too many 70-200 mm options out there with f/2.8. Below an effective f-stop of 4 Pentax cameras have trouble to focus correctly, so there are many reasons for no TC in Pentax land.
12-31-2013, 05:06 PM   #6
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Thanks for your replies.

Look, if there is no TC and no plans for a TC - Remove it from the Roadmap(s). It's all "speculation" with Pentax. What direction are they heading in...does anybody know?

As for "cropping" my images to achieve a greater magnification, you've got to be kidding? The practice of cropping takes away from the art of photography IMHO.

I think Jatrax hit he nail on the head by his remark that Pentax is not for people like me (sports photographer). Well...that's just another whole group of photgraphers that Pentax do not cater to.
Point and shoot - that's where the future lies for Pentax. I'm getting out now before I invest anymore in the Pentax system that seems to have a multitude of holes in the system and doe not cater for people like myself. Just one converter....as per their very own road map....it's not like I'm asking where the Full Frame camera is? Just the converter.....
12-31-2013, 05:36 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
if there is no TC and no plans for a TC - Remove it from the Roadmap(s).
The road map is a statement of intent. So far Ricoh has provided everything they said they would so until that changes I am going to assume they will continue to do so. if they intend to bring it out why would they take it off the map?
QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
As for "cropping" my images to achieve a greater magnification, you've got to be kidding? The practice of cropping takes away from the art of photography IMHO.
I think you are kidding, seriously you never crop an image? If not then IMHO you are really restricting your artistic skills. I almost always crop, often several different ways from the same image.
QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
that Pentax is not for people like me (sports photographer). Well...that's just another whole group of photgraphers that Pentax do not cater to.
You can't be everything to everyone. A smart company competes in the areas they think they can make money in and does not waste resources on small niches that are already well covered.
QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
Point and shoot - that's where the future lies for Pentax.
I'll have to disagree there, and that comment really shows you do not know much about Pentax. They currently have the best in class APS-C camera, and possibly the best selling MILC camera line in Japan. Just because they don't cater to your small specialty does not mean they do not make excellent gear.
QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
I'm getting out now before I invest anymore in the Pentax system that seems to have a multitude of holes in the system and doe not cater for people like myself.
Do consider putting your gear up for sale here in the marketplace, I think you should find good buyers.
QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
Just one converter....as per their very own road map...
Perhaps you should re-read the road map. It clearly states 2013 or later. So we are now in later, maybe it will come out in 2014, or later.

And I honestly do not understand your fixation on a TC, just crop the image if you need more reach. If you are serious about sports then I doubt you want a TC anyway, you need long fast glass and a TC is just going to slow your maximum aperture down and reduce the image quality. If you are serious get a D4 and an 200-400 f/4 and do the job right.
12-31-2013, 06:35 PM   #8
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Jatrax- fixation now ended mate.

Thanks for all your feedback. You went from saying that that there was a hole in that focal length range and that the TC has been on the roadmap for 5 years, but liked to insinuate that I don't seem to know much about Pentax and questioned my fixation. Also - I said that I think that Pentax make same excellent glass. I'm not completely bagging them mate. They make great stuff and now they have the best DSLR with the worst lens line-up.

I love your comment about referring to "your small specialty"...

Mate, watch the news, watch sports, pick up a magazine and once you finish taking your head out of the sand, you'll see that the use of Long zooms/telephoto's is not a "small specialty". Why should Pentax cater any differently to me than what they cater for yourself?

Mate, it's simple - you kindly answered my query and I agreed with what you had to say in your initial post.

Thank you.

12-31-2013, 07:28 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
fixation now ended mate.
Good. While I have an excellent TC for the Pentax system (F AFA 1.7x), with today's digital cameras I'm not sure the need is there anymore. Might be one reason its not a priority for Ricoh.
QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
TC has been on the roadmap for 5 years
Yes, but most of those years were either before Pentax got bought out or while under Hoya. The Hoya years were not a good time for Pentax. I don't think it fair to compare management in those days to what Ricoh is doing. I do think we will see a TC eventually. I just don't think its a good idea for a pro sports photographer who intends to sell images.
QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
They make great stuff and now they have the best DSLR with the worst lens line-up.
Maybe not worst, but certainly plenty of holes if you think of them as just another Canon or Nikon. They are not, at least right now and maybe never will be. They have a lot of things Canon or Nikon do not, and if those things matches with a particular photographers need then great, if not then perhaps another brand would work better.
QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
I love your comment about referring to "your small specialty"... Mate, watch the news, watch sports, pick up a magazine and once you finish taking your head out of the sand, you'll see that the use of Long zooms/telephoto's is not a "small specialty".
Sorry, did not mean to insult you but sports photography is a small subset of total camera sales. It is just not a big enough market to justify the expense in development and support required. I'm not saying it is not important, or that it can be profitable, just that there is a whole world out there that does not revolve around sports.
QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
Why should Pentax cater any differently to me than what they cater for yourself?
Because they cannot afford to or have decided that they cannot make money in that area. At least now, who knows what the future will bring. But to be serious in sports requires at least one, if not more, FF camera bodies, a complete lineup of fast long glass (of which Pentax currently has zero) and a pro support network for lens loaning, and fast repair turnaround. Pentax does not have any of that, and will not for many years.
QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
Mate, it's simple - you kindly answered my query and I agreed with what you had to say in your initial post.
Glad I could help, and again I did not mean to insult you or your specialty, just to point out that it is not an area that Pentax is particularly suited to. Come back in 5 years and maybe things will be different. I think at this time Pentax and pro sports are like round peg in square hole. Yes, you can do it, but there are much better alternatives.

I have seen too many posters come here and bash Pentax for not being something they are not so maybe I'm a little sensitive about that. But I wish people who would be happier with Canon or Nikon would just buy what they need rather than trying to change something that is not suited for the purpose. If you are a pro and intend to make money at photography then cameras and lenses are just tools, buy and use the ones that let you do the job and make money.
12-31-2013, 08:36 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
Thanks for your replies.

Look, if there is no TC and no plans for a TC - Remove it from the Roadmap(s). It's all "speculation" with Pentax. What direction are they heading in...does anybody know?

As for "cropping" my images to achieve a greater magnification, you've got to be kidding? The practice of cropping takes away from the art of photography IMHO.

I think Jatrax hit he nail on the head by his remark that Pentax is not for people like me (sports photographer). Well...that's just another whole group of photgraphers that Pentax do not cater to.
Point and shoot - that's where the future lies for Pentax. I'm getting out now before I invest anymore in the Pentax system that seems to have a multitude of holes in the system and doe not cater for people like myself. Just one converter....as per their very own road map....it's not like I'm asking where the Full Frame camera is? Just the converter.....
Humm.... so you're a "sports photographer" who is invested in Pentax.... just what gear are you actually using/invested in? Sounds like you're a Canon or Nikon user who just wants to crap on Pentax. Canon and Nikon are great gear...
have at it....
01-12-2014, 06:01 AM   #11
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Oh here we go...

Jatrax, thank you for your reply. I didn't want to carry this on. You clearly made your point. Again, thanks. (By the way, good t0 see that you have put forward the question re: teleconverters to Adam. Thanks, I appreciate that.)

As for the post below yours...all that I can say is this. I am a Pentax user. I use a K5-ii with a Sigma 150-500mm for the extra focal length that I need for the type of photography I enjoy. I also use the DA 18-135mm as my walk-about lens. I also use a 10-17mm that I use in custom made water housing for my K5-ii.

I bought the K5-ii because I thought that it was a brilliant camera (and still do). I am not crapping on Pentax. Your comment is ridiculous.

Yep, I shoot sports...but I'm not a pro. Never said I was. What....Pentax users can't shoot sports...is that what you are implying (now YOU are crapping on Pentax)?

Just so you know...the colour rendition with Pentax cameras is awesome and that's why I purchased the K5-ii. I wanted a different look. The attached photo was shot on Jan 6, using a K5-ii with the said 10-17mm nestled in my housing. What, I can't come to a forum and ask questions about the roadmap or lenses?

Apologies to Jatrax for being overzealous. Your response was fair.

Woody, if you'd like to see more of my "Pentax" snaps, I'll forward them to you. I'll stop here and AWAIT YOUR APOLOGY FOR SAYING THAT I AM A CANIKON
USER...Somehow, I don't think that will happen.

Pentax K5-II / TAV - 1/1250, f7.1, ISO 640 - Dave Kelly Custom Housing (Newcastle, Australia) @ 11mm; Post processed in LR4





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01-12-2014, 08:12 AM   #12
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"I want to do bird photography and I want to do this with the Pentax Kll and the Sigma 2.8 300mm lens and it will be necessary to have the Sigma 1.4 Teleconvertor to get the necessary reach while still having a lens that can be used without a tripod. Has the 1.4 teleconvertor been discontinued?? If so there is no other quality fast telephoto option for the Pentax in 300mm. Are Pentax owners being closed out of fast telephoto photography? Can I find the 1.4 somewhere? Is Sigma dumoing Pentax??

Thanks, Bob "

Hey Woody...how can you justify replying to my post in the way that you did...when the above quote is one of YOUR posts?

YOU are quite happy to CRAP ON SIGMA DUE TO A SHORTFALL WITH PENTAX...and then have the nerve to challenge my post requesting from Pentax exactly what you requested from Sigma!!!

Maybe you'd like to explain yourself..or maybe..just maybe - YOU are the CANIKON GUY?

If you were SMARTER than me (especially being a senior member) YOU TOO, should've realised that what YOU WANT IS NOT BEING CATERED FOR!!!!
01-12-2014, 08:27 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
I think that TC has been on the road map for about 5 years now.
This is not so straightforward. The rear converter was shown in the 2008 roadmap, but Hoya discontinued the TC project and did not release any roadmaps. Ricoh has revived both the lens roadmap and the TC project. There is reason to believe we will see a 1.4X TC soon, due to posts on DPR by asahiman, whose insider info has been pretty reliable.
01-12-2014, 09:59 AM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
Jatrax, thank you for your reply. I didn't want to carry this on. You clearly made your point. Again, thanks. (By the way, good t0 see that you have put forward the question re: teleconverters to Adam. Thanks, I appreciate that.)
You are welcome, I would like to see the TC available as well, along with a number of other things. Sometimes it is a little frustrating waiting but I do think good things are coming, perhaps not at the pace we would like though.

QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
Apologies to Jatrax for being overzealous. Your response was fair.
No worries, I might have been a bit snippy myself. What you are saying strikes a nerve with long time Pentax users. We would like very much to see Pentax compete in other areas (like sports) but right now they are not there. And it will take a lot of work to get to where they can.

I don't do sports, or indeed shoot much of anything that moves, so Pentax works great for me. But choices for those shooting fast things are a bit limited. May I suggest you take a look at this thread: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/122-lens-clubs/55946-300mm-plus-lens-club...ng-lenses.html Many folks there shoot birds in flight, not quite the same but they have good tips on shooting fast things at long focal lengths.

Just curious but for what you are shooting what do you think you need? Besides the TC that is. Very nice shot you posted by the way, creative and well framed.
01-12-2014, 10:19 AM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by PJay Quote
Oh here we go...

Jatrax, thank you for your reply. I didn't want to carry this on. You clearly made your point. Again, thanks. (By the way, good t0 see that you have put forward the question re: teleconverters to Adam. Thanks, I appreciate that.)

As for the post below yours...all that I can say is this. I am a Pentax user. I use a K5-ii with a Sigma 150-500mm for the extra focal length that I need for the type of photography I enjoy. I also use the DA 18-135mm as my walk-about lens. I also use a 10-17mm that I use in custom made water housing for my K5-ii.

I bought the K5-ii because I thought that it was a brilliant camera (and still do). I am not crapping on Pentax. Your comment is ridiculous.

Yep, I shoot sports...but I'm not a pro. Never said I was. What....Pentax users can't shoot sports...is that what you are implying (now YOU are crapping on Pentax)?

Just so you know...the colour rendition with Pentax cameras is awesome and that's why I purchased the K5-ii. I wanted a different look. The attached photo was shot on Jan 6, using a K5-ii with the said 10-17mm nestled in my housing. What, I can't come to a forum and ask questions about the roadmap or lenses?

Apologies to Jatrax for being overzealous. Your response was fair.

Woody, if you'd like to see more of my "Pentax" snaps, I'll forward them to you. I'll stop here and AWAIT YOUR APOLOGY FOR SAYING THAT I AM A CANIKON
USER...Somehow, I don't think that will happen.

Pentax K5-II / TAV - 1/1250, f7.1, ISO 640 - Dave Kelly Custom Housing (Newcastle, Australia) @ 11mm; Post processed in LR4





Happy with that?
Nice shot!

(If you say anything negative, people tend to take it personally - I've found - and get all indignant like you have no right to say that you are not pleased with something. Personally I agree with you. The pentax lineup is lacking in that not everything they've released is worth buying. So now I'm looking at Sigma and Tamron offerings, which have been recommended by pros. I think we have to keep Pentax on their toes and say when something does not stand up to scrutiny. Cheers!)
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