The ultimate LBA...

heatherslightbox · 04-13-2008, 06:17 AM

My goodness! We actually now have a lens that could dethrone the 31 as the cream of the crop and it's a good bit cheaper, too!

I suppose that one reason that I could justify having both the 43 and 35 is that the 43 would do better in low light, due to it's bigger maximum aperture. Hmmm...

Here is a brick wall pic taken with the 43 that I had in my collection. Would it be possible to do a fair comparison to the 35 with this one?

If you want to see it original size, click on this link:
IMGP0756.JPG photo - Heather photos at pbase.com

Heather

Last edited by heatherslightbox; 04-13-2008 at 06:28 AM.

Pentaxke · 04-13-2008, 06:52 AM

Originally posted by barbosas

Has anyone compared it to the FA35 ?

This thread is making my 35LBA come again... beside the 1:1 macro is there a very big difference in image quality to the FA35?

I never had the FA 35 f/2, but I think it's save to say that the 31 ltd is the better over the FA 35. Since my conclusion is that the DA 35 macro is still (marginally) better, you can draw your own conclusions...

The FA 35 is not a bad lens, and IMHO it will boil down to f/2 versus 1:1 reproduction ratio, and plastic construction versus all metal construction (and Quick Shift Focus!)

It's your choice...

Pentaxke · 04-13-2008, 07:09 AM

Originally posted by hwblanks

If you want to see it original size, click on this link:
IMGP0756.JPG photo - Heather photos at pbase.com

Heather

Heather,

I already apologize, because I think I didn't make your LBA any easier, au contraire.

That said, I don't think you can make a fair conclusion between the 43 and DA 35 if you don't compare them side by side. I never had the chance to try the 43 ltd so I cannot comment about it, but I do know that it's a great optical performer. So is the DA 35 I think.

So, in the end I think your conclusion should be based on what is more important for you: f/1,9 versus 1:1 macro (if we make the assumption that both are great in optical terms.) When the DA 35 macro was first announced I hoped for it to have a bright f/2, but now I have come to the conclusion if it had been an f/2, the lens would have been rediculously big and maybe it wouldn't have been as sharp as it is now... I have bought the 31 Limited for its bright f/1,8 feature, but, while I love it, I don't use it all that much. So, there you have it: for me the brighter f-stop isn't the dealmaker (at least not as much as it used to be), and in the end, you cranck up ISO and you continue shooting...

BTW: you have some lovely images in you pbase that you made with the 43 ltd! I love the one that is called 'Emily...' and you have some beautifull flowershots...
This one is my faveroute: IMGP0988.JPG photo - Heather photos at pbase.com

frank · 04-13-2008, 07:32 AM

The FA31 is a great lens, I still think it's one of the best AF lenses ever made by any manufacturer. But to be honest, the DA35 macro is much more fun lens to use. I don't think I'd let go of the FA31, or any of the FA Limiteds (unless I'm done w/ Pentax, even so, I probably would still keep these three), but I can foresee I'd use the DA35 alot more often than the FA31

Here is another quick snap I took today w/ K20D and DA35 (JPG resized w/ minimum PPing), a street cat which can be seen almost everywhere in Singapore:

aegisphan · 04-13-2008, 08:05 AM

Nice shot, Frank. It shows the viciousness of them "wild" cats.

Anyway, I gave in and bought the last DA 35 from prodigital. Hopefully, it will arrive in time for my second round of macro showdown. This round will be more intense, I have three other macros coming, making a total of 5 contenders. I think it's time for my LBA remission

.

JJJPhoto · 04-13-2008, 09:07 AM

Originally posted by frank

Here is another quick snap I took today w/ K20D and DA35 (JPG resized w/ minimum PPing), a street cat which can be seen almost everywhere in Singapore:

Frank, stop posting photos like that! You're practically forcing me to buy this lens.

nostatic · 04-13-2008, 09:21 AM

know going in that it won't be anything like a typical 100mm macro. But it'll work in a pinch

thePiRaTE!! · 04-13-2008, 09:34 AM

I'm a fan of tests. Helps put that little nagging voices in the back of my mind to rest about the subjective things I notice in regular use. Its interesting to note the darkness apparent in the DA shots vs anything else. I'm not sure what causes it, but one would need an EV boost to get the lens back on par with the brightness of pretty much any other lens I've used. This bothered me. I noted the same characteristic in my testing (and use). While the shots at near infinity and beyond are close are far as relative IQ, it must also be noted that the DA35 has a magnification advantage (8.8%) next to the FA31. Its subject is a bit 'closer' than the FAs, which _should_ favor the DA in the perception of fine detail - so it bodes well for the FA that its argueably still the winner from your shots, but even more apparent in the ones I took (copy variance? tighter cropping?). Putting both lenses next to the K helps to emphasize however, that both the FA and DA have high potential in these regards, its a good reference to see that.

With the short time I had my 35, I did discover the advantage such a short working distance can have in minimizing hand-shake on macro shots. This was unexpected and useful if its something one might do a lot of, perhaps even because they can now. For myself, the brightness, extra speed and IQ of the 31 make it ideal for what I do. I gathered from your tests, the same as I gathered from my own in this regard. But still, the 35 has a niche as a casual walk-around macro that can perform outside of its design as a normal shooter as well, but that darkness thing (and resulting speed hit) and sharpness made the 31 the lens I would always go to for anything outside of said casual macro work. It wasn't enough for me to keep the 35 after I had made the comparison.

Still though, for those without a 31 on hand, the 35 is obviously a good lens, its noted advantages and disadvantages about even. And at half the price, it will be more popular than the 31 as time goes on, but for me - the 31 is still in my bag.

Not to add even more LBA to already LBA'd thread, but if I might show a close-focus example of the 31 to muddy the waters a little more for everyone - hee hee!

Just had to represent the 31 afterall

Nice pics from the 35 btw Marc, you use it well! And nice cat there Frank! Though I'm sure it took some brightening

Buddha Jones · 04-13-2008, 09:39 AM

I swear this lens may never come off my camera. I have it so built up in my head that it is greatness that I am teeming with anticipation. The 200mm may not even make it out of the box if this keeps up.

Pentaxke · 04-13-2008, 10:43 AM

@ Pirate: the darkness from the shots of the DA is easily explained: the shot at wide open was 1/4000s for the 31 ltd and 1/1500ish for the DA 35. Apart from the 1/4000s never be real 1/4000s (not in a million years), I think it should have been 1/5000s or sth, and that is sth my ist D is not up to... In normal working conditions, I can only say that the DA 35 is almost always spot on...

Perhaps you are right that the 31 ltd is in a disadvantage in this test due to the focal lenght, but I think it puts things in perspective, and I sure know that I'm glad with the optical performance!

Pentaxke · 04-13-2008, 10:48 AM

@ Frank and Nostatic: very nice pictures. I still have a lot to learn...

heatherslightbox · 04-13-2008, 02:51 PM

Marc,

Thanks for the compliments. The one you picked as one of your favorites is also one of my favorites. As for Emily the cat, she is as sweet as she looks, but also has a rather mischevious side to her, which makes her fun to be around.

One way I could still get the DA35 and have a low light option would be to either use the M50/1.4 that I already have or pick up a FA50/1.4 or A50/1.4.

Anyway, I'm not going to be buying right away, so I still have time to think about what I really want.

Heather

frank · 04-13-2008, 07:06 PM

Originally posted by aegisphan

Nice shot, Frank. It shows the viciousness of them "wild" cats.

Anyway, I gave in and bought the last DA 35 from prodigital. Hopefully, it will arrive in time for my second round of macro showdown. This round will be more intense, I have three other macros coming, making a total of 5 contenders. I think it's time for my LBA remission

.

Thanks Hiep

Looking forward to your ultimate macro shootout soon

frank · 04-13-2008, 07:07 PM

Originally posted by JJJPhoto

Frank, stop posting photos like that! You're practically forcing me to buy this lens.

Haha, better get one then. I'm sure it'd perform even better in experienced hands like yours

frank · 04-13-2008, 07:09 PM

Originally posted by Buddha Jones

I swear this lens may never come off my camera. I have it so built up in my head that it is greatness that I am teeming with anticipation. The 200mm may not even make it out of the box if this keeps up.

So finally you got the DA200? That's another excellent lens. I've done a comparison between the DA and FA200, both about the same. I like the look of FA200 but prefer the SDM/Weatherseal/QuickShift on the DA200.

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04-13-2008, 06:17 AM	#61
heatherslightbox Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Gainesville, FL Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,599	My goodness! We actually now have a lens that could dethrone the 31 as the cream of the crop and it's a good bit cheaper, too! I suppose that one reason that I could justify having both the 43 and 35 is that the 43 would do better in low light, due to it's bigger maximum aperture. Hmmm... Here is a brick wall pic taken with the 43 that I had in my collection. Would it be possible to do a fair comparison to the 35 with this one? If you want to see it original size, click on this link: IMGP0756.JPG photo - Heather photos at pbase.com Heather Last edited by heatherslightbox; 04-13-2008 at 06:28 AM.

04-13-2008, 06:52 AM	#62
Pentaxke Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Belgium Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 476 Original Poster	Originally posted by barbosas Has anyone compared it to the FA35 ? This thread is making my 35LBA come again... beside the 1:1 macro is there a very big difference in image quality to the FA35? I never had the FA 35 f/2, but I think it's save to say that the 31 ltd is the better over the FA 35. Since my conclusion is that the DA 35 macro is still (marginally) better, you can draw your own conclusions... The FA 35 is not a bad lens, and IMHO it will boil down to f/2 versus 1:1 reproduction ratio, and plastic construction versus all metal construction (and Quick Shift Focus!) It's your choice...

04-13-2008, 07:09 AM	#63
Pentaxke Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Belgium Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 476 Original Poster	Originally posted by hwblanks If you want to see it original size, click on this link: IMGP0756.JPG photo - Heather photos at pbase.com Heather Heather, I already apologize, because I think I didn't make your LBA any easier, au contraire. That said, I don't think you can make a fair conclusion between the 43 and DA 35 if you don't compare them side by side. I never had the chance to try the 43 ltd so I cannot comment about it, but I do know that it's a great optical performer. So is the DA 35 I think. So, in the end I think your conclusion should be based on what is more important for you: f/1,9 versus 1:1 macro (if we make the assumption that both are great in optical terms.) When the DA 35 macro was first announced I hoped for it to have a bright f/2, but now I have come to the conclusion if it had been an f/2, the lens would have been rediculously big and maybe it wouldn't have been as sharp as it is now... I have bought the 31 Limited for its bright f/1,8 feature, but, while I love it, I don't use it all that much. So, there you have it: for me the brighter f-stop isn't the dealmaker (at least not as much as it used to be), and in the end, you cranck up ISO and you continue shooting... BTW: you have some lovely images in you pbase that you made with the 43 ltd! I love the one that is called 'Emily...' and you have some beautifull flowershots... This one is my faveroute: IMGP0988.JPG photo - Heather photos at pbase.com

04-13-2008, 07:32 AM	#64
frank Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Singapore Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,202	The FA31 is a great lens, I still think it's one of the best AF lenses ever made by any manufacturer. But to be honest, the DA35 macro is much more fun lens to use. I don't think I'd let go of the FA31, or any of the FA Limiteds (unless I'm done w/ Pentax, even so, I probably would still keep these three), but I can foresee I'd use the DA35 alot more often than the FA31 Here is another quick snap I took today w/ K20D and DA35 (JPG resized w/ minimum PPing), a street cat which can be seen almost everywhere in Singapore:

04-13-2008, 08:05 AM	#65
aegisphan Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: New Mexico Posts: 815	Nice shot, Frank. It shows the viciousness of them "wild" cats. Anyway, I gave in and bought the last DA 35 from prodigital. Hopefully, it will arrive in time for my second round of macro showdown. This round will be more intense, I have three other macros coming, making a total of 5 contenders. I think it's time for my LBA remission .

04-13-2008, 09:07 AM	#66
JJJPhoto Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 419	Originally posted by frank Here is another quick snap I took today w/ K20D and DA35 (JPG resized w/ minimum PPing), a street cat which can be seen almost everywhere in Singapore: Frank, stop posting photos like that! You're practically forcing me to buy this lens.

04-13-2008, 09:21 AM	#67
nostatic Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: socal Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,575	know going in that it won't be anything like a typical 100mm macro. But it'll work in a pinch

04-13-2008, 09:34 AM	#68
thePiRaTE!! Inactive Account Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Calgary, AB Photos: Gallery Posts: 942	I'm a fan of tests. Helps put that little nagging voices in the back of my mind to rest about the subjective things I notice in regular use. Its interesting to note the darkness apparent in the DA shots vs anything else. I'm not sure what causes it, but one would need an EV boost to get the lens back on par with the brightness of pretty much any other lens I've used. This bothered me. I noted the same characteristic in my testing (and use). While the shots at near infinity and beyond are close are far as relative IQ, it must also be noted that the DA35 has a magnification advantage (8.8%) next to the FA31. Its subject is a bit 'closer' than the FAs, which _should_ favor the DA in the perception of fine detail - so it bodes well for the FA that its argueably still the winner from your shots, but even more apparent in the ones I took (copy variance? tighter cropping?). Putting both lenses next to the K helps to emphasize however, that both the FA and DA have high potential in these regards, its a good reference to see that. With the short time I had my 35, I did discover the advantage such a short working distance can have in minimizing hand-shake on macro shots. This was unexpected and useful if its something one might do a lot of, perhaps even because they can now. For myself, the brightness, extra speed and IQ of the 31 make it ideal for what I do. I gathered from your tests, the same as I gathered from my own in this regard. But still, the 35 has a niche as a casual walk-around macro that can perform outside of its design as a normal shooter as well, but that darkness thing (and resulting speed hit) and sharpness made the 31 the lens I would always go to for anything outside of said casual macro work. It wasn't enough for me to keep the 35 after I had made the comparison. Still though, for those without a 31 on hand, the 35 is obviously a good lens, its noted advantages and disadvantages about even. And at half the price, it will be more popular than the 31 as time goes on, but for me - the 31 is still in my bag. Not to add even more LBA to already LBA'd thread, but if I might show a close-focus example of the 31 to muddy the waters a little more for everyone - hee hee! Just had to represent the 31 afterall Nice pics from the 35 btw Marc, you use it well! And nice cat there Frank! Though I'm sure it took some brightening

04-13-2008, 09:39 AM	#69
Buddha Jones Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Charlotte, NC Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,587	I swear this lens may never come off my camera. I have it so built up in my head that it is greatness that I am teeming with anticipation. The 200mm may not even make it out of the box if this keeps up.

04-13-2008, 10:43 AM	#70
Pentaxke Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Belgium Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 476 Original Poster	@ Pirate: the darkness from the shots of the DA is easily explained: the shot at wide open was 1/4000s for the 31 ltd and 1/1500ish for the DA 35. Apart from the 1/4000s never be real 1/4000s (not in a million years), I think it should have been 1/5000s or sth, and that is sth my ist D is not up to... In normal working conditions, I can only say that the DA 35 is almost always spot on... Perhaps you are right that the 31 ltd is in a disadvantage in this test due to the focal lenght, but I think it puts things in perspective, and I sure know that I'm glad with the optical performance!

04-13-2008, 10:48 AM	#71
Pentaxke Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Belgium Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 476 Original Poster	@ Frank and Nostatic: very nice pictures. I still have a lot to learn...

04-13-2008, 02:51 PM	#72
heatherslightbox Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Gainesville, FL Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,599	Marc, Thanks for the compliments. The one you picked as one of your favorites is also one of my favorites. As for Emily the cat, she is as sweet as she looks, but also has a rather mischevious side to her, which makes her fun to be around. One way I could still get the DA35 and have a low light option would be to either use the M50/1.4 that I already have or pick up a FA50/1.4 or A50/1.4. Anyway, I'm not going to be buying right away, so I still have time to think about what I really want. Heather

04-13-2008, 07:06 PM	#73
frank Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Singapore Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,202	Originally posted by aegisphan Nice shot, Frank. It shows the viciousness of them "wild" cats. Anyway, I gave in and bought the last DA 35 from prodigital. Hopefully, it will arrive in time for my second round of macro showdown. This round will be more intense, I have three other macros coming, making a total of 5 contenders. I think it's time for my LBA remission . Thanks Hiep Looking forward to your ultimate macro shootout soon

04-13-2008, 07:07 PM	#74
frank Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Singapore Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,202	Originally posted by JJJPhoto Frank, stop posting photos like that! You're practically forcing me to buy this lens. Haha, better get one then. I'm sure it'd perform even better in experienced hands like yours

04-13-2008, 07:09 PM	#75
frank Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Singapore Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,202	Originally posted by Buddha Jones I swear this lens may never come off my camera. I have it so built up in my head that it is greatness that I am teeming with anticipation. The 200mm may not even make it out of the box if this keeps up. So finally you got the DA200? That's another excellent lens. I've done a comparison between the DA and FA200, both about the same. I like the look of FA200 but prefer the SDM/Weatherseal/QuickShift on the DA200.