Revisiting the HD DA 20-40mm Limited

Eyewanders · 02-16-2014, 04:31 PM

Originally posted by loganross

OP here. Still testing the 20-40, but also looking at alternative systems, namely Fuji. Regarding the 20-40, I think it takes very impressive photos, matching and sometimes surpassing my FA31. No kidding, the FA31 may be an amazing lens, but time waits for no one and technology has allowed for the creation of many worthy competitors (including the 20-40).......

Really??? This surprises me a great deal. I've been looking at Fuji quite a bit as well. The upcoming X-T1 has my very serious attention. I once shot with a Fuji some years back, an upper end digicam, during the grey area of time between having all my film gear stolen and before I really got on-board with DSLR. I've also owned an x100 for a time and enjoyed it, though eventually sold it after a month or two. If anyone is truly innovating currently, I will say that Fuji is up there.

Uluru · 02-16-2014, 06:42 PM - **3 Likes**

The only difference between a good lens, and a bad lens, is in time allowed to understand it and pull out our maximum of knowledge and possibilities about it. Whoever thinks that a good lens should in general provide a 100% of keepers and utterly magnificent photograph each time shutter is pressed, is seriously deluded.

Old rule was 1 good frame in 3 rolls of film, and the preference was always given to the subject and the narrative over the mere technical quality of the best overall image. Even if the lens is technically mastered and understood, the hard part still remains, every single time: to make that what fits inside the frame lines worth capturing, and ourselves capable of doing it.

Many confuse the two, the lens and its subject, and find excuses for the latter in the realm of the former. So no wonder many famous photographers used just one or two lenses, that made them famous. However, many totally forget about the lens inside their mind: less time they had spent on understanding the lens on the camera, more time was left to dedicate to subjects.

**Pål Jensen** · 02-18-2014, 07:45 AM

Originally posted by monochrome

Except that Hoya 'retired' the genius who was instrumental in designing the Limiteds, who now works for a third-party lens maker and, possibly, some contract work. Consequently there can be no assurance Pentax can make such lenses today.

...but he didn't design the 31 Limited....
Nor the FA* 200/4 Macro for that matter....

**monochrome** · 02-18-2014, 08:32 AM

Originally posted by Pål Jensen

...but he didn't design the 31 Limited....
Nor the FA* 200/4 Macro for that matter....

I think the question will be whether Computer Aided Design supersedes human brilliance and how Ricoh balances investment in technology versus people.

Further, the more hand-assembly required the more expensive a lens will be. One of the benefits of CAD is designing products all the way through the manufacturing and assembly process literally into the packaging to be efficient - but math being what it is that can conceivably make lenses (any product) very similar to one designed by another company.

The more efficient and economically productive the product the less unique, IMHO.

Of course I don't know anything specific about Ricoh or Pentax and you may well. I just know in general how Ricoh has turned inefficent old companies with good products and recognized brands into more profitable product lines over time.

Tbone51 · 03-15-2014, 02:26 PM - **1 Like**

I am pleased with the lens. Good image quality, nice bokeh, excellent build, weather-sealed, nearly-silent focus, lightweight, and small in size. It takes photos which match those taken with the 21mm limited and the FA 55mm f/1.4, both of which I sold to help pay for this lens. It also has the ability to shoot close to the subject for quasi-macro use. I am looking forward to traveling with this lens and with the (also maligned) Pentax DA 18-135 lens. The latter takes wonderful photos outdoors and accommodates a polarizing filter, but is rather large and heavy.. The 20-40mm limited will be useful for street photos, and indoor flash-less museum work. With my K5 it takes great photos at ISO 1600-3200. I can't imagine lugging around an 18-35mm F/1.8 monster. The advantage of the Pentax Limited series has been met with this lens: high quality, light-weight, portable.

ogl · 03-19-2014, 10:03 AM

It's sad...but I've changed 20-40 to FA31. I can't get any predictable results from 20-29 mm focal range. 30-40 mm is close to excellent.
It seems to me my copy is decentering, but the service center says that everything is very good.
But...I had sharp right corner at 20 mm and very soft left corner and so-so center. I never had such results with my lenses for 34 year of my photo life.
I've tried to tweak AF, used MF, LV - no any result. The right corner is sharper than left corner and center at 20-29 mm.

Uluru · 03-19-2014, 03:02 PM

Originally posted by ogl

It's sad...but I've changed 20-40 to FA31. I can't get any predictable results from 20-29 mm focal range. 30-40 mm is close to excellent.
It seems to me my copy is decentering, but the service center says that everything is very good.
But...I had sharp right corner at 20 mm and very soft left corner and so-so center. I never had such results with my lenses for 34 year of my photo life.
I've tried to tweak AF, used MF, LV - no any result. The right corner is sharper than left corner and center at 20-29 mm.

You could have asked for another copy of DA20-40, to verify your tests?

ogl · 03-19-2014, 11:11 PM

Originally posted by Uluru

You could have asked for another copy of DA20-40, to verify your tests?

Yes. But I want to make photos, not tests.

I've bought this lens in official Pentax internet shop rather far from me and I don't like lottery

My lens is almost 1 month in the service center and I didn't even see any official conclusion.

Only manager's words. And I can't get any conclusion on paper from them.

They agreed to change 20-40 to FA31 with some additional payment.
And I'm happy. I don't want to waste the time for 20-40. As for new DA lenses - I like only DA70.

Uluru · 03-20-2014, 04:36 AM

Originally posted by ogl

Yes. But I want to make photos, not tests.

I've bought this lens in official Pentax internet shop rather far from me and I don't like lottery

My lens is almost 1 month in the service center and I didn't even see any official conclusion.

Only manager's words. And I can't get any conclusion on paper from them.

They agreed to change 20-40 to FA31 with some additional payment.
And I'm happy. I don't want to waste the time for 20-40. As for new DA lenses - I like only DA70.

Mine DA40 is like that. I don't know how it happened, but I have kept it because it gives a subtly unique quality to the photographs. Hard to see unless you stare closely, but nevertheless, I love it. Lenses are like children: if everything seems to be perfect, you're off to a most boring and predictable parenthood.

02-16-2014, 06:42 PM - 3 Likes	#47
Uluru Banned Join Date: May 2010 Location: Back to my Walkabout Creek Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,535	The only difference between a good lens, and a bad lens, is in time allowed to understand it and pull out our maximum of knowledge and possibilities about it. Whoever thinks that a good lens should in general provide a 100% of keepers and utterly magnificent photograph each time shutter is pressed, is seriously deluded. Old rule was 1 good frame in 3 rolls of film, and the preference was always given to the subject and the narrative over the mere technical quality of the best overall image. Even if the lens is technically mastered and understood, the hard part still remains, every single time: to make that what fits inside the frame lines worth capturing, and ourselves capable of doing it. Many confuse the two, the lens and its subject, and find excuses for the latter in the realm of the former. So no wonder many famous photographers used just one or two lenses, that made them famous. However, many totally forget about the lens inside their mind: less time they had spent on understanding the lens on the camera, more time was left to dedicate to subjects. Last edited by Uluru; 02-17-2014 at 01:46 AM.

03-19-2014, 11:11 PM	#53
ogl Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Sankt Peterburg Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 8,382	Originally posted by Uluru You could have asked for another copy of DA20-40, to verify your tests? Yes. But I want to make photos, not tests. I've bought this lens in official Pentax internet shop rather far from me and I don't like lottery My lens is almost 1 month in the service center and I didn't even see any official conclusion. Only manager's words. And I can't get any conclusion on paper from them. They agreed to change 20-40 to FA31 with some additional payment. And I'm happy. I don't want to waste the time for 20-40. As for new DA lenses - I like only DA70. Last edited by ogl; 03-20-2014 at 03:24 AM.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Sigma 18-35 1.8 art vs HD DA 20-40mm F2.8 - 4 Limited DC WR	jrcastillo	Pentax SLR Lens Discussion	111	09-22-2015 03:02 PM
DA 20-40mm Limited review posted	Adam	Pentax SLR Lens Discussion	80	01-30-2014 06:28 AM
Is there a store who has the HD DA 20-40mm in stock?	brosen	Pentax SLR Lens Discussion	5	12-17-2013 04:57 AM
PENTAX HD DA 20-40mm F2.8-4 LIMITED AU$929	i_trax	Pentax Price Watch	2	12-06-2013 03:33 AM

02-16-2014, 04:31 PM	#46
Eyewanders Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Land of the Salish Sea Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,343	Originally posted by loganross OP here. Still testing the 20-40, but also looking at alternative systems, namely Fuji. Regarding the 20-40, I think it takes very impressive photos, matching and sometimes surpassing my FA31. No kidding, the FA31 may be an amazing lens, but time waits for no one and technology has allowed for the creation of many worthy competitors (including the 20-40)....... Really??? This surprises me a great deal. I've been looking at Fuji quite a bit as well. The upcoming X-T1 has my very serious attention. I once shot with a Fuji some years back, an upper end digicam, during the grey area of time between having all my film gear stolen and before I really got on-board with DSLR. I've also owned an x100 for a time and enjoyed it, though eventually sold it after a month or two. If anyone is truly innovating currently, I will say that Fuji is up there.

02-18-2014, 07:45 AM	#48
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	Originally posted by monochrome Except that Hoya 'retired' the genius who was instrumental in designing the Limiteds, who now works for a third-party lens maker and, possibly, some contract work. Consequently there can be no assurance Pentax can make such lenses today. ...but he didn't design the 31 Limited.... Nor the FA* 200/4 Macro for that matter....

02-18-2014, 08:32 AM	#49
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Originally posted by Pål Jensen ...but he didn't design the 31 Limited.... Nor the FA* 200/4 Macro for that matter.... I think the question will be whether Computer Aided Design supersedes human brilliance and how Ricoh balances investment in technology versus people. Further, the more hand-assembly required the more expensive a lens will be. One of the benefits of CAD is designing products all the way through the manufacturing and assembly process literally into the packaging to be efficient - but math being what it is that can conceivably make lenses (any product) very similar to one designed by another company. The more efficient and economically productive the product the less unique, IMHO. Of course I don't know anything specific about Ricoh or Pentax and you may well. I just know in general how Ricoh has turned inefficent old companies with good products and recognized brands into more profitable product lines over time.

03-15-2014, 02:26 PM - 1 Like	#50
Tbone51 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 120	I am pleased with the lens. Good image quality, nice bokeh, excellent build, weather-sealed, nearly-silent focus, lightweight, and small in size. It takes photos which match those taken with the 21mm limited and the FA 55mm f/1.4, both of which I sold to help pay for this lens. It also has the ability to shoot close to the subject for quasi-macro use. I am looking forward to traveling with this lens and with the (also maligned) Pentax DA 18-135 lens. The latter takes wonderful photos outdoors and accommodates a polarizing filter, but is rather large and heavy.. The 20-40mm limited will be useful for street photos, and indoor flash-less museum work. With my K5 it takes great photos at ISO 1600-3200. I can't imagine lugging around an 18-35mm F/1.8 monster. The advantage of the Pentax Limited series has been met with this lens: high quality, light-weight, portable.

03-19-2014, 10:03 AM	#51
ogl Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Sankt Peterburg Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 8,382	It's sad...but I've changed 20-40 to FA31. I can't get any predictable results from 20-29 mm focal range. 30-40 mm is close to excellent. It seems to me my copy is decentering, but the service center says that everything is very good. But...I had sharp right corner at 20 mm and very soft left corner and so-so center. I never had such results with my lenses for 34 year of my photo life. I've tried to tweak AF, used MF, LV - no any result. The right corner is sharper than left corner and center at 20-29 mm.

03-19-2014, 03:02 PM	#52
Uluru Banned Join Date: May 2010 Location: Back to my Walkabout Creek Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,535	Originally posted by ogl It's sad...but I've changed 20-40 to FA31. I can't get any predictable results from 20-29 mm focal range. 30-40 mm is close to excellent. It seems to me my copy is decentering, but the service center says that everything is very good. But...I had sharp right corner at 20 mm and very soft left corner and so-so center. I never had such results with my lenses for 34 year of my photo life. I've tried to tweak AF, used MF, LV - no any result. The right corner is sharper than left corner and center at 20-29 mm. You could have asked for another copy of DA20-40, to verify your tests?

03-20-2014, 04:36 AM	#54
Uluru Banned Join Date: May 2010 Location: Back to my Walkabout Creek Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,535	Originally posted by ogl Yes. But I want to make photos, not tests. I've bought this lens in official Pentax internet shop rather far from me and I don't like lottery My lens is almost 1 month in the service center and I didn't even see any official conclusion. Only manager's words. And I can't get any conclusion on paper from them. They agreed to change 20-40 to FA31 with some additional payment. And I'm happy. I don't want to waste the time for 20-40. As for new DA lenses - I like only DA70. Mine DA40 is like that. I don't know how it happened, but I have kept it because it gives a subtly unique quality to the photographs. Hard to see unless you stare closely, but nevertheless, I love it. Lenses are like children: if everything seems to be perfect, you're off to a most boring and predictable parenthood.