Which DA lenses are actually full frame capable?

Noisychip · 04-14-2008, 11:52 AM

Hi,

I recently mounted my 18-55 on an older film SLR, just for fun. Guess what? There was vignetting at ~22m and less only!

I know that DA and DA* lenses are specified for crop sensors only, that's why I was a bit confused.

So I started searching for information on full frame capability of DA lenses, which could be really interesting since there seems to be a Samsung full frame sensor being developed.

Here's what I found out. The following lenses are said to be full frame usable without vignetting. Can anybody confirm this? Are there more???

- DA 70mm f/2.4 Limited
- DA 40mm f/2.8 Limited
- DA*200mm f/2.8
- DA*300mm f/4.0
- DA 35mm f/2.8 Macro

Big Dave · 04-14-2008, 02:51 PM

Originally posted by Noisychip

Hi,

I recently mounted my 18-55 on an older film SLR, just for fun. Guess what? There was vignetting at ~22m and less only!

I know that DA and DA* lenses are specified for crop sensors only, that's why I was a bit confused.

So I started searching for information on full frame capability of DA lenses, which could be really interesting since there seems to be a Samsung full frame sensor being developed.

Here's what I found out. The following lenses are said to be full frame usable without vignetting. Can anybody confirm this? Are there more???

- DA 70mm f/2.4 Limited
- DA 40mm f/2.8 Limited
- DA*200mm f/2.8
- DA*300mm f/4.0
- DA 35mm f/2.8 Macro

Notice that all of those listed are prime lenses. I think that a smaller image circle is used to make the DA zooms more compact. This wouldn't be necessary on the primes which are small already.

Dave

Dave

Noisychip · 04-15-2008, 12:20 AM

Does anybody know about zooms?

axl · 04-15-2008, 12:36 AM

I don't think any DA zooms are FF capable. But can't confirm...

frank · 04-15-2008, 02:15 AM

IIRIC, the DA1645 can be used on FF w/o vignetting from 24mm and above, the DA1017 can be used on FF w/o vignetting from 15mm to 17mm. But heard the DA*1650 and 50135 would have vignetting all the way through the entire zoom range.

thePiRaTE!! · 04-15-2008, 02:29 AM

It is indeed the 68 thousand dollar question. I like to speculate that Pentax has been sliding us some FF compatible lenses for a while, quietly building up a line-up that will see them able to transition smoothly when the time comes for a larger sensor. But, it has been proffered much yet understood no better. It comes to this. Again.

I went so far as to ask Klaus at Photozone if he might add to his tests some FF performance specs for upcoming Pentax reviews strictly out of curiosity, but he didn't seem to envisage their usefulness, suggesting it likely that a FF design would be far off until enough qualified releases were on the table. But I still was left with the same question...

Entropy · 04-15-2008, 04:44 AM

Zooms are usually known for vignetting the most at the wide end of their range.

In the case of zooms that vignette in only part of their range - these could never be marketed as a FF lens, as the severe vignetting in parts of the zoom range would be unacceptable, even if there is none/insignificant vignetting at the long end of the zoom range.

knyghtfall · 04-15-2008, 05:48 AM

Just tried the DA 70 Ltd on a film body last wknd, it is FF compatible. Only gripe is that there's no aperture ring, so have to rely on progamme mode/shutter priority on my MZ -3. Though I suppose it'd work fine on other film bodies that allow Av control on the camera body.

Slightly off tangent for the thread, but I tried the Sigma 17 - 70 DC on a film camera too, there was vignetting throughout the whole range of the zoom. Ditto for the distortion effect, which was quite noticeable even at 70mm. At 17mm its almost a fisheye.

thePiRaTE!! · 04-15-2008, 05:59 AM

Originally posted by knyghtfall

Just tried the DA 70 Ltd on a film body last wknd, it is FF compatible. Only gripe is that there's no aperture ring, so have to rely on shutter priority on my MZ -3. Though I suppose it'd work fine on other film bodies that allow Av control on the camera body.

Slightly off tangent for the thread, but I tried the Sigma 17 - 70 DC on a film camera too, there was vignetting throughout the whole range of the zoom. Ditto for the distortion effect, which was quite noticeable even at 70mm. At 17mm its almost a fisheye.

THanks. Were you able to note edge sharpness? I'd be curious to see a scan of a lens chart snap or something. Could finally start to know for sure the full capabilities of the primes, anyways.

knyghtfall · 04-15-2008, 06:09 AM

Gee sorry - it wasn't my lens and my camera wasn't loaded, so didn't take any test shots with it. It looked fine through the viewfinder with no vignetting that I could see, but that's not saying much on corner sharpness.

Now you've got me piqued on trying DA lenses on a film body, will see if anyone's willing to lend me their lens to do so!

**Ron Boggs** · 04-15-2008, 07:33 AM

When someone gets curious enough to burn a quick roll of film, make sure it's slide film so processing won't disguise any effects. I'm not curious enough to do the test and all but one of my lenses are FF anyway. Hope someone burns a roll soon.

Noisychip · 04-15-2008, 03:10 PM

It would be really great if we could build up some kind of 'database' for full frame usable DA lenses.

This seems valuable information to me, as it looks like we're going to see a full frame Pentax some day, maybe in a couple of years.

vizjerei · 05-01-2008, 01:17 PM

I tried my DA 16-45, and it is good around 22mm above can cover the full frame with my K2

ricosuave · 05-01-2008, 02:33 PM

IIRC the 35 does vignette.

kenyee · 05-01-2008, 02:46 PM

Originally posted by knyghtfall

Slightly off tangent for the thread, but I tried the Sigma 17 - 70 DC on a film camera too, there was vignetting throughout the whole range of the zoom. Ditto for the distortion effect, which was quite noticeable even at 70mm. At 17mm its almost a fisheye.

And FYI, the Sigma 10-20 clips (not vignettes because vignetting usually means slightly darker instead of black corners :-) at all focal lengths. I believe the 17-70 does as well at the wide end.

04-14-2008, 11:52 AM	#1
Noisychip Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 282	Which DA lenses are actually full frame capable? Hi, I recently mounted my 18-55 on an older film SLR, just for fun. Guess what? There was vignetting at ~22m and less only! I know that DA and DA* lenses are specified for crop sensors only, that's why I was a bit confused. So I started searching for information on full frame capability of DA lenses, which could be really interesting since there seems to be a Samsung full frame sensor being developed. Here's what I found out. The following lenses are said to be full frame usable without vignetting. Can anybody confirm this? Are there more??? - DA 70mm f/2.4 Limited - DA 40mm f/2.8 Limited - DA200mm f/2.8 - DA300mm f/4.0 - DA 35mm f/2.8 Macro

04-15-2008, 05:48 AM	#8
knyghtfall Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Singapore Photos: Gallery Posts: 348	Just tried the DA 70 Ltd on a film body last wknd, it is FF compatible. Only gripe is that there's no aperture ring, so have to rely on progamme mode/shutter priority on my MZ -3. Though I suppose it'd work fine on other film bodies that allow Av control on the camera body. Slightly off tangent for the thread, but I tried the Sigma 17 - 70 DC on a film camera too, there was vignetting throughout the whole range of the zoom. Ditto for the distortion effect, which was quite noticeable even at 70mm. At 17mm its almost a fisheye. Last edited by knyghtfall; 04-15-2008 at 05:57 AM.

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04-14-2008, 02:51 PM	#2
Big Dave Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: San Antonio, Texas Photos: Gallery Posts: 547	Originally posted by Noisychip Hi, I recently mounted my 18-55 on an older film SLR, just for fun. Guess what? There was vignetting at ~22m and less only! I know that DA and DA* lenses are specified for crop sensors only, that's why I was a bit confused. So I started searching for information on full frame capability of DA lenses, which could be really interesting since there seems to be a Samsung full frame sensor being developed. Here's what I found out. The following lenses are said to be full frame usable without vignetting. Can anybody confirm this? Are there more??? - DA 70mm f/2.4 Limited - DA 40mm f/2.8 Limited - DA200mm f/2.8 - DA300mm f/4.0 - DA 35mm f/2.8 Macro Notice that all of those listed are prime lenses. I think that a smaller image circle is used to make the DA zooms more compact. This wouldn't be necessary on the primes which are small already. Dave Dave

04-15-2008, 12:20 AM	#3
Noisychip Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 282 Original Poster	Does anybody know about zooms?

04-15-2008, 12:36 AM	#4
axl Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Nove Zamky, Slovakia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 7,183	I don't think any DA zooms are FF capable. But can't confirm...

04-15-2008, 02:15 AM	#5
frank Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Singapore Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,202	IIRIC, the DA1645 can be used on FF w/o vignetting from 24mm and above, the DA1017 can be used on FF w/o vignetting from 15mm to 17mm. But heard the DA*1650 and 50135 would have vignetting all the way through the entire zoom range.

04-15-2008, 02:29 AM	#6
thePiRaTE!! Inactive Account Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Calgary, AB Photos: Gallery Posts: 942	It is indeed the 68 thousand dollar question. I like to speculate that Pentax has been sliding us some FF compatible lenses for a while, quietly building up a line-up that will see them able to transition smoothly when the time comes for a larger sensor. But, it has been proffered much yet understood no better. It comes to this. Again. I went so far as to ask Klaus at Photozone if he might add to his tests some FF performance specs for upcoming Pentax reviews strictly out of curiosity, but he didn't seem to envisage their usefulness, suggesting it likely that a FF design would be far off until enough qualified releases were on the table. But I still was left with the same question...

04-15-2008, 04:44 AM	#7
Entropy Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Owego, NY Posts: 976	Zooms are usually known for vignetting the most at the wide end of their range. In the case of zooms that vignette in only part of their range - these could never be marketed as a FF lens, as the severe vignetting in parts of the zoom range would be unacceptable, even if there is none/insignificant vignetting at the long end of the zoom range.

04-15-2008, 05:59 AM	#9
thePiRaTE!! Inactive Account Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Calgary, AB Photos: Gallery Posts: 942	Originally posted by knyghtfall Just tried the DA 70 Ltd on a film body last wknd, it is FF compatible. Only gripe is that there's no aperture ring, so have to rely on shutter priority on my MZ -3. Though I suppose it'd work fine on other film bodies that allow Av control on the camera body. Slightly off tangent for the thread, but I tried the Sigma 17 - 70 DC on a film camera too, there was vignetting throughout the whole range of the zoom. Ditto for the distortion effect, which was quite noticeable even at 70mm. At 17mm its almost a fisheye. THanks. Were you able to note edge sharpness? I'd be curious to see a scan of a lens chart snap or something. Could finally start to know for sure the full capabilities of the primes, anyways.

04-15-2008, 06:09 AM	#10
knyghtfall Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Singapore Photos: Gallery Posts: 348	Gee sorry - it wasn't my lens and my camera wasn't loaded, so didn't take any test shots with it. It looked fine through the viewfinder with no vignetting that I could see, but that's not saying much on corner sharpness. Now you've got me piqued on trying DA lenses on a film body, will see if anyone's willing to lend me their lens to do so!

04-15-2008, 07:33 AM	#11
Ron Boggs Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: MT Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,349	When someone gets curious enough to burn a quick roll of film, make sure it's slide film so processing won't disguise any effects. I'm not curious enough to do the test and all but one of my lenses are FF anyway. Hope someone burns a roll soon.

04-15-2008, 03:10 PM	#12
Noisychip Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 282 Original Poster	It would be really great if we could build up some kind of 'database' for full frame usable DA lenses. This seems valuable information to me, as it looks like we're going to see a full frame Pentax some day, maybe in a couple of years.

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05-01-2008, 01:17 PM	#13
vizjerei Veteran Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Toronto Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,418	I tried my DA 16-45, and it is good around 22mm above can cover the full frame with my K2

05-01-2008, 02:33 PM	#14
ricosuave Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: NC Photos: Gallery Posts: 298	IIRC the 35 does vignette.

05-01-2008, 02:46 PM	#15
kenyee Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Boston, PRofMA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,026	Originally posted by knyghtfall Slightly off tangent for the thread, but I tried the Sigma 17 - 70 DC on a film camera too, there was vignetting throughout the whole range of the zoom. Ditto for the distortion effect, which was quite noticeable even at 70mm. At 17mm its almost a fisheye. And FYI, the Sigma 10-20 clips (not vignettes because vignetting usually means slightly darker instead of black corners :-) at all focal lengths. I believe the 17-70 does as well at the wide end.