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04-14-2014, 08:35 AM - 1 Like   #1
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The K-Mount is actually good for Sigma, Tamron, etc - long live the K-mount

Much has been said recently about that interview by the Sigma boss that the K-mount is not so good business for Sigma because of the outdated mechanical aperture lever (which Nikon also uses). And I've seen a lot of negativity in this forum because of it.

But as I was kind of looking at how much it would cost to get a Canon system together, I realized that buying 3rd party lenses for Canon cameras is a waste of money in the long run. All the good old glass from Sigma, Tokina and Tamron can't be properly used in the newer bodies because aperture can't be set - the chipset won't have the necessary settings. Only Canon lenses stay compatible when newer generation of Canon bodies are released.

Not so with Pentax. I can get a Sigma 24mm f/2.8 AF Superwide II from over 20 years ago for my Pentax camera and everything still works as it should - full programming mode options, full AF, etc - regardless of which Pentax body I choose. I can get a ton of lenses from the 70s and 80s and 90s and they will either work perfectly in manual mode, or in program mode if they have the A setting - and some lenses from Sigma, for example, will have an aperture ring in K-mount which won't exist in Canon mount!!!

Third party manufacturers should embrace Pentax because the K-mount is friendly to them. They should be happy to see Pentax succeed. Pentax created the K-mount to be a "standard industry mount", so that is why it is friendly to other manufacturers. No other camera maker has the backwards compatibility that Pentax has. Period. So I really hope that they never change the K-mount (unless it is to un-cripple it... I know some would like that, but I don't really care much...)

Long live the K-mount!!!

04-14-2014, 09:10 AM   #2
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No argument from me on any of this.
04-14-2014, 09:19 AM   #3
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Yes, your 20 year old Superwide still works on the latest Pentax, but how does that benefit Sigma? Imagine if Pentax changed their mount and all old lenses stopped working. It would be bad for us Pentax users, and bad for Ricoh if people jump ship to other systems. Sigma, on the other hand, would benefit if the K mount died. People would need to buy more new lenses. Few people would blame Sigma for Ricoh's engineering change so their reputation wouldn't suffer.
04-14-2014, 09:29 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by DeadJohn Quote
Yes, your 20 year old Superwide still works on the latest Pentax, but how does that benefit Sigma? Imagine if Pentax changed their mount and all old lenses stopped working. It would be bad for us Pentax users, and bad for Ricoh if people jump ship to other systems. Sigma, on the other hand, would benefit if the K mount died. People would need to buy more new lenses. Few people would blame Sigma for Ricoh's engineering change so their reputation wouldn't suffer.
This. Sigma likes the EF mount because they can sell 200 people new 24mm lenses instead of having those 200 people buy 20-year-old Superwides.

04-14-2014, 09:29 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by DeadJohn Quote
Few people would blame Sigma for Ricoh's engineering change so their reputation wouldn't suffer.
How could their reputation suffer? Old timers already call them "Stigma".
04-14-2014, 10:01 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by ChristianRock Quote

Third party manufacturers should embrace Pentax because the K-mount is friendly to them.
No, it is friendly to Pentax consumers, not manufacturers. The fact that we can still use old lenses (which is the primary reason I stay with Pentax) only benefits us. It actually hurts the third party manufacturers because we're buying old stuff, not their new stuff.
04-14-2014, 10:10 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
How could their reputation suffer? Old timers already call them "Stigma".


Yep, Sigma used to place in the bottom 30th %-tile for 3rd-party lens makers. Things were not always as they are today.


Steve

---------- Post added 04-14-14 at 10:14 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by OregonJim Quote
The fact that we can still use old lenses (which is the primary reason I stay with Pentax) only benefits us. It actually hurts the third party manufacturers because we're buying old stuff, not their new stuff.
The same is true of many Canon and MILC users. One could argue that sustained enthusiast interest is good all round for the industry and users. Even those of us who like vintage gear buy new on occasion and when we do, we typically don't skimp.


Steve

(...New Sigma lens due to arrive on Wednesday...)
04-14-2014, 11:24 AM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
How could their reputation suffer? Old timers already call them "Stigma".
People that weren't around the photography scene 20-30 years ago - or people that are open to a company's ability to improve - know them as a good value.

Lately their offerings have been better optically than the OEM lenses.

04-14-2014, 11:25 AM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by DeadJohn Quote
Yes, your 20 year old Superwide still works on the latest Pentax, but how does that benefit Sigma?
Well, as I said in my original post: if I were to buy into the Canon system, I would not buy third party lenses, ever. Only Canon lenses, for longevity reasons.

I consider third party lenses for Pentax because I know that when I upgrade my body, the lenses will still work.

Maybe I didn't express myself properly? I thought I laid that case pretty well in the post, but I might be wrong.
04-14-2014, 11:35 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by ChristianRock Quote
Well, as I said in my original post: if I were to buy into the Canon system, I would not buy third party lenses, ever. Only Canon lenses, for longevity reasons.

I consider third party lenses for Pentax because I know that when I upgrade my body, the lenses will still work.

Maybe I didn't express myself properly? I thought I laid that case pretty well in the post, but I might be wrong.
I think both of you expressed yourselves clearly.

Point: If new cameras consistently disallow use of third party lenses, a third-party lensmaker's offerings won't be trusted.
Counterpoint: If new cameras never need new lenses, than third-party (and OEM) lensmakers will not have the sales they desire.

Hmmm, does this mean that Pentax is due for a mount change?
04-14-2014, 12:11 PM   #11
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I hope not. No reason to.
04-14-2014, 12:58 PM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by ChristianRock Quote
Well, as I said in my original post: if I were to buy into the Canon system, I would not buy third party lenses, ever. Only Canon lenses, for longevity reasons.

I consider third party lenses for Pentax because I know that when I upgrade my body, the lenses will still work.

Maybe I didn't express myself properly? I thought I laid that case pretty well in the post, but I might be wrong.
I don't know Canon history very well but I thought their mount change made old lenses unusable. If Canon changed mounts again it could cripple existing Sigma and Canon lenses equally.
04-14-2014, 02:21 PM   #13
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That is exactly why Sigma likes Canon. Changed mount means having to purchase (yet another) new lens = more business/profit.
They 'really' don't want you to purchase a used lens from someone else, but a brand new lens from them.
04-14-2014, 02:34 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by DeadJohn Quote
I don't know Canon history very well but I thought their mount change made old lenses unusable. If Canon changed mounts again it could cripple existing Sigma and Canon lenses equally.
I'm talking about third party lenses released AFTER Canon changed its mount to the current configuration. Third party lenses released for Canon in the 90s don't (way after the EF mount was released) don't work on current Canon bodies, because these newer bodies won't send the electronic signals that the lens is expecting. But Canon lenses do.

Another thing is AF and AF confirmation - I guess Pentax can have problems with 3rd party compatibility if the 3rd party lens has a built-in motor but for all the lenses that are screw driven, the compatibility with all Pentax cameras remains.
Not really so with Canon or Nikon...

QuoteOriginally posted by formercanuck Quote
That is exactly why Sigma likes Canon. Changed mount means having to purchase (yet another) new lens = more business/profit.
They 'really' don't want you to purchase a used lens from someone else, but a brand new lens from them.
Yeah but there's plenty of people that know that if you buy a lens from Sigma today for your Canon, it might not work tomorrow. Yes there are people that spend thousands of dollars on DSLR equipment and are ignorant - but there's plenty of informed photogs out there as well.
04-14-2014, 05:46 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by ChristianRock Quote
Much has been said recently about that interview by the Sigma boss that the K-mount is not so good business for Sigma because of the outdated mechanical aperture lever (which Nikon also uses). And I've seen a lot of negativity in this forum because of it.

But as I was kind of looking at how much it would cost to get a Canon system together, I realized that buying 3rd party lenses for Canon cameras is a waste of money in the long run. All the good old glass from Sigma, Tokina and Tamron can't be properly used in the newer bodies because aperture can't be set - the chipset won't have the necessary settings. Only Canon lenses stay compatible when newer generation of Canon bodies are released.

Not so with Pentax. I can get a Sigma 24mm f/2.8 AF Superwide II from over 20 years ago for my Pentax camera and everything still works as it should - full programming mode options, full AF, etc - regardless of which Pentax body I choose. I can get a ton of lenses from the 70s and 80s and 90s and they will either work perfectly in manual mode, or in program mode if they have the A setting - and some lenses from Sigma, for example, will have an aperture ring in K-mount which won't exist in Canon mount!!!

Third party manufacturers should embrace Pentax because the K-mount is friendly to them. They should be happy to see Pentax succeed. Pentax created the K-mount to be a "standard industry mount", so that is why it is friendly to other manufacturers. No other camera maker has the backwards compatibility that Pentax has. Period. So I really hope that they never change the K-mount (unless it is to un-cripple it... I know some would like that, but I don't really care much...)

Long live the K-mount!!!
What you are actually seeing is why many people I know have either stayed away from canon, or dropped them at some point. They seem to think they have sufficient market strength to screw over their customer base by making the lens mount obsolete. They did this twice in the 1990's already
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