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05-16-2014, 01:50 PM   #1
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APS-C sport lens

Hello
Is even possible shoot football with f/4 if I have "only" K20D (1.5 crop factor). I mean, the aperture would be 6 and that is just too much DOF isnt it? Have I buy 2.8 (which would be 4.2)? I would love football sample photos with aperture 4 with 1.5 crop factor.
Can I shoot football effectively with Sigma 70-200 2.8 (ofc I mean with the crop factor).. I read about focusing problems but maybe only because of "bad piece".
Thank you so much for answers.

05-16-2014, 02:11 PM   #2
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QuoteOriginally posted by DejmekPeter Quote
Hello
Is even possible shoot football with f/4 if I have "only" K20D (1.5 crop factor). I mean, the aperture would be 6 and that is just too much DOF isnt it? Have I buy 2.8 (which would be 4.2)? I would love football sample photos with aperture 4 with 1.5 crop factor.
Can I shoot football effectively with Sigma 70-200 2.8 (ofc I mean with the crop factor).. I read about focusing problems but maybe only because of "bad piece".
Thank you so much for answers.
What do you mean the "aperture would be 6"? F4 is F4, which should work. You might want to upgrade to a better AF body, like the K-5 IIs or K-3.

The Sigma 70-200mm is a great sports lens, as is the Pentax 60-250mm. You should check out our in-depth reviews:
Pentax DA* 60-250mm F4 Review - Introduction - Pentax Camera Forums
Fast Sports Zoom Lenses for Pentax - 70-200mm Sigma & Tamron - Pentax Camera Forums

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05-16-2014, 02:17 PM   #3
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crop factor make aperature 6
OR Do I still not understand?
05-16-2014, 02:46 PM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by DejmekPeter Quote
crop factor make aperature 6
Without looking at the video (won't play on this computer), the aperture stays the same for the same exposure. For depth of focus, there is a difference.

05-16-2014, 02:49 PM   #5
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Forget about crop factor unless you really have the need to compare sensor sizes, it is of no use if you only use it for one format. That video may state true facts but at the same time it's nothing you should really think of if you only use one format.

A 200mm F2.8 picture on aps-c is the same as a cropped fullframe one taken from the same distance and with the same settings. As cropping is very common in sports photography and the fact that you're more likely to crop a fullframe pic than an aps-c one taken with the same lens, same settings and same distance you will in many cases end up with two identical pics, no matter the sensor sizes.

---------- Post added 05-16-14 at 11:53 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by SpecialK Quote
Without looking at the video (won't play on this computer), the aperture stays the same for the same exposure. For depth of focus, there is a difference.
DOF will be different if you keep the subject the same size when composing by either using a different focal length or change the distance, yes.
If you use identical settings, keep the same distance and crop the fullframe pic to the same composition as the aps-c one, then they will be identical.
05-16-2014, 03:00 PM   #6
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I use a DA* 60-250 for outdoors sports (skiing, cycling, running) and it's great. Focus is definitely fast enough on my K-3.
I have a shoot approaching for a gymnastics meet and I'm a little worried I'd be wishing I had a faster lens for that. I've used the 60-250 for dance and it was reasonably good but gymnastics is likely to have less light and faster motion.
So I'm thinking of renting a Tamron 70-200/2.8 that weekend. If your shooting is primarily outside during the day the 60-250 should be a good match.
05-16-2014, 03:03 PM   #7
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So is possible get good football photo with APS-C + 100-300 f/4 or I should go for 70-200 f/2.8?

---------- Post added 05-16-14 at 03:07 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by mattb123 Quote
If your shooting is primarily outside during the day the 60-250 should be a good match.
Well I "do not careL" about light (I mean indoor or outdoor).. I afraid of DOF. (I need low DOF)
05-16-2014, 03:13 PM   #8
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The only one that can answer that is you yourself. I have trouble even getting a feel why the small differances in DOF is such a huge issue, I would be way more concerned with reach vs enough light to keep shutter speed down.
When i shoot things like hockey I often end up using smaller apertures than F2.8 to actually get atleast two struggling players in focus, and not just the puck or the face of only one player.

05-16-2014, 03:20 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by DejmekPeter Quote
In a sense it does, yes, if you're comparing the apparent Depth Of Field to a FF DSLR. But if you're talking about light gathering or exposure f/2.8 is f/2.8.

You'll need to decide what you want. Adam mentioned two good lenses, and of course there are others. You'll have to select one according to your taste. I've shot runners and some indoor dance competitions, and primes have worked out for me. But others prefer zooms.


Here are some typical shots of a field sport from another forum member using the Sigma 100-300/4:

G V LAX 2014 - Dadipentak


This may or may not be the types of shots you're after. I think you should study shots with various lenses, including looking at the exposure settings used, and then determine what will suit you.


I presume you're able to stand on or near the sidelines or goal line - is this correct?

Last edited by DSims; 05-16-2014 at 03:26 PM.
05-16-2014, 03:21 PM   #10
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You are worrying to much. At 300mm your lens will have plenty shallow DoF. I would be more inclined to stop it down a touch to optimise sharpness.

Go out and shoot.
05-16-2014, 03:31 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by DejmekPeter Quote
possible shoot football with f/4
Do you mean North American style football?
QuoteOriginally posted by DejmekPeter Quote
(I need low DOF)
Don't you want enough DOF to get a clear image of both sides of individual players?


These pictures were taken with a manual focus A 70-210 f4 at 1/160 second, if I had a faster lens, I could have decreased my ISO and had less noise. I don't understand why you would need (or even want) less DOF than what you can see here.
05-16-2014, 03:33 PM - 1 Like   #12
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Some of these shots may have been cropped. (I don't have most sports pics uploaded to flickr so bare the shifting quality)

In hockey I end up being close to the action and therefore need to stop down the lens so I can get everything I want to have in focus in focus.

/3.5 135.0 mm


/3.5 200.0 mm


/3.5 170.0 mm


Floorball is pretty similar

/3.2 180.0 mm


/3.5 110.0 mm


/3.5 93.0 mm


/3.5 180.0 mm


Soccer is quite different and I got enough light to bring some extra scenic in them. You can really see the DOF change with the distance.

/5.0 200.0 mm


/5.0 145.0 mm


/5.0 135.0 mm


/5.0 200.0 mm


/5.0 88.0 mm
05-16-2014, 03:54 PM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by RGlasel Quote
Do you mean North American style football?
I meant soccer. Thnak you anyway. Impressive manual focusing
05-16-2014, 04:17 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by DejmekPeter Quote
I meant soccer. Thnak you anyway. Impressive manual focusing
For soccer you gonna want reach and I felt a little short with a 70-200 when I shot soccer, haven't done it for a while. Standing at a good angle to get nice save/goal shots means shoting over about half the field and 300mm or more would be my choice. Though I would use two camera bodies with a shorter lens too for all the midfield tackles, dekes and screams at the refree.

On major tip is to shoot from low so that you look up on the players to get more "into the action".
05-16-2014, 05:02 PM   #15
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Do you have a budget? I ask because you may want to look at a camera body plus a lens or two.

But if you just get a lens you can still do fairly well on your K20D, just as long as you realize the focusing will be too slow at times.

---------- Post added 05-16-14 at 05:46 PM ----------

Also look at these threads, if you haven't already:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/115277-k-5-sports-photography-114.html
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/172-pentax-k-3/242969-sports-images-k-3-a-8.html
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