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**DDoram** · 07-12-2014, 05:47 AM

I was able to purchase a copy of the Sigma 8-16mm yesterday and it seems like a fun lens. While Sigma doesn't make this lens in Pentax mount anymore, I am greatful to have a copy of the widest lens available for APSC. The HSM focussing works well and feel well made. While it is a very specialty lens that won't get used that much, it is nice to have it for those ultra wide moments. Some initial photos taken with the K3 included.

Dale

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OregonJim · 07-12-2014, 06:08 AM

Originally posted by DDoram

I am greatful to have a copy of the widest lens available for APSC

There are wider ones available. Here's an example:

Amazon.com : Vivitar VIV-7MM-P 7mm F3.5 Fisheye Lens for Pentax : Camera Lenses : Camera & Photo

1mm may seem like a small difference, but the AOV jumps from 121 deg. (8mm) to 180 deg. (7mm). Still, the Sigma is a great tool. Glad you enjoy it!

**DDoram** · 07-12-2014, 06:17 AM

Hi Jim:

The Vivitar is a fisheye and not a rectangular lens though.

Dale

Fire Angel · 07-12-2014, 07:54 AM - **2 Likes**

Why do people keep repeating the myth that Sigma have discontinued this lens for Pentax? According to their web site they haven't. According to a Sigma UK rep I spoke to recently they haven't. It's often necessary to place an order to get it as it is produced in limited numbers due to relatively low demand since the 10-20mm f3.5 was launched, but it is still being made in the Pentax K mount. Can't somebody in the admin here contact Sigma and ask them? Then someone can put the reviews for this lens back where they belong, among Sigma's current range of zooms, instead of where they are currently, in the legacy range.

I wish I could justify the expense, because if I had an 8-16mm it would not be rarely used, I assure you!

Last edited by Fire Angel; 07-12-2014 at 08:00 AM.

**interested_observer** · 07-12-2014, 08:43 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by OregonJim

There are wider ones available. Here's an example:

Amazon.com : Vivitar VIV-7MM-P 7mm F3.5 Fisheye Lens for Pentax : Camera Lenses : Camera & Photo

1mm may seem like a small difference, but the AOV jumps from 121 deg. (8mm) to 180 deg. (7mm). Still, the Sigma is a great tool. Glad you enjoy it!

All fisheyes are (usually) 180 degrees wide (on the diagonal) by their design - in terms of fisheye zooms they are (usually) 180 degrees wide at their widest end. What varies across the fisheyes and their focal length differences is the magnification at the center point and type of projection used and the extent of the projection across the corners and in particular the sides. The diagonal corner points are going to be at least 180 degrees and on some of the more extreme fisheyes more.

In terms of the focal length across both a fisheye and rectilinear lens, the only reasonable comparison is the magnification used at the center point. After that, the barrel distortion takes over - in the case of the fisheye it is uncorrected, while in the case of the rectilinear it is corrected to maintain straight lines (at the expense of artificially stretching the view). The other aspect is how the projection from the lens is laid down across the sensor. Some fisheyes have the entire projection with in the sensor (circular fisheye) - while others have the extent of the sensor within the projection of the lens (full frame fisheye).

The other aspect of fisheye lenses is how the photographer employs the lens. Walk up close to a subject and the lens will pull the center of the view in and diminish the edges. Then have the object move out of the frame, and the center suddenly becomes push back and diminished while the edges and corners appear to become drawn in.

Looking at a zoom fisheye, at its widest they are running 180 degrees corner to corner. However, when you zoom in, nothing optically really changes with the lens - the lens does not change its projection or anything, its just the extent of the projection that is laid across the sensor. So effectively, you are loosing view across the corners and edges. Using the 10-17 lens as an example, you zoom from 180 field of view (on the diagonal) to about 100 degrees at 17mm. Essentially you are just magnifying the center as you zoom and the wider view (of the corners and edges) roll off the edge of the sensor - in essence you are cropping the view from 10mm to 17mm.

Most folks think that fisheye lenses portray an extreme and un-natural view of the world. In some cases they are correct. However, again its up the the photographer and how they employ the lens. When comparing a fisheye to a rectilinear across the same identical scene, the fisheye can appear more natural in its view of the world - where as with the rectilinear the lines may be straighter - but the view un-naturally stretched, elongated and distorted. It all comes down to what looks the best in terms of what the photographer intends to present.

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/10-pentax-slr-lens-discussion/235102-uwa-...omparison.html

**interested_observer** · 07-12-2014, 12:39 PM

Originally posted by Fire Angel

Why do people keep repeating the myth that Sigma have discontinued this lens for Pentax? According to their web site they haven't. According to a Sigma UK rep I spoke to recently they haven't. It's often necessary to place an order to get it as it is produced in limited numbers due to relatively low demand since the 10-20mm f3.5 was launched, but it is still being made in the Pentax K mount. Can't somebody in the admin here contact Sigma and ask them? Then someone can put the reviews for this lens back where they belong, among Sigma's current range of zooms, instead of where they are currently, in the legacy range.

I wish I could justify the expense, because if I had an 8-16mm it would not be rarely used, I assure you!

At one time the Sigma site did not list the Pentax mount as being available. This was a bit after I had purchased mine. So, I just went back to the Sigma site and they are now listing the Pentax mount as being available. Also B&H has the lens in stock.

**Mikesul** · 07-15-2014, 08:18 AM

Unfortunately, BandH does not have it in stock now and the Sigma site lists no dealers who have stock. Bummer. But your explanation of fisheye/rectilinear was very helpful. Thanks.

Fire Angel · 07-15-2014, 12:02 PM

Originally posted by interested_observer

At one time the Sigma site did not list the Pentax mount as being available. This was a bit after I had purchased mine. So, I just went back to the Sigma site and they are now listing the Pentax mount as being available. Also B&H has the lens in stock.

It's great that this lens is slightly easier to obtain nowadays, though the Sigma person I spoke to admitted that few dealers will stock this lens and it must almost always be ordered. I have often thought that I'd like to get it but I can't justify spending that much on a lens, at least not until I finish my music studies (sometime late in 2017). I will probably get one of the 10-20mm options instead and then see if I really develop the skills and need for the extra width that this lens offers. I would expect the 8mm end of such a zoom to be difficult to use to best advantage.

**Digitalis** · 07-15-2014, 07:57 PM

Originally posted by Fire Angel

I would expect the 8mm end of such a zoom to be difficult to use to best advantage.

I won't deny it is difficult, but there are certain subjects that call for 8mm focal lengths.

Pentax K5IIs - Sigma 8-16mm f/4.5-5.6 ASPH DG@ 8mm

Pentax K5IIs - Sigma 8-16mm f/4.5-5.6 ASPH DG @ 8mm

vonBaloney · 07-15-2014, 09:00 PM

I'm pretty sure one of the Sigma people did confirm at one point that it was no longer available, at least in the U.S. It *used* to be stocked by all the usual places... I ordered mine from B&H back when, came immediately.

**Digitalis** · 07-16-2014, 12:29 AM

Originally posted by Fire Angel

Why do people keep repeating the myth that Sigma have discontinued this lens for Pentax?

Probably because the lens is listed on the pentax forums lens review pages under legacy sigma lenses.

vonBaloney · 07-16-2014, 08:15 AM

It is not listed for sale on any USA site -- it is not out of stock at B&H, etc, it is just gone completely. There are some listed on Amazon, but all shipping from Japan looks like. Prices a bit higher than it was previously listed for USA (which was $650ish). So it can still be gotten (and there should be used ones floating around for years to come) but not from the usual channels and probably with no warranty...

Fire Angel · 07-16-2014, 10:54 AM

Originally posted by vonBaloney

It is not listed for sale on any USA site -- it is not out of stock at B&H, etc, it is just gone completely. There are some listed on Amazon, but all shipping from Japan looks like. Prices a bit higher than it was previously listed for USA (which was $650ish). So it can still be gotten (and there should be used ones floating around for years to come) but not from the usual channels and probably with no warranty...

Yeah that's normal now, if you want it it usually has to be ordered from a dealer, even the Sigma rep I spoke to said he didn't know of anywhere in London (which is a pretty big city) that would stock it. If you want it in Canon or Nikon mount of course there are several places that do stock it, but nowadays Pentax have a much smaller market share so...

vonBaloney · 07-16-2014, 11:21 AM

Originally posted by Fire Angel

Yeah that's normal now, if you want it it usually has to be ordered from a dealer, even the Sigma rep I spoke to said he didn't know of anywhere in London (which is a pretty big city) that would stock it. If you want it in Canon or Nikon mount of course there are several places that do stock it, but nowadays Pentax have a much smaller market share so...

It seems to me you can't even order it from a dealer (in the US).

In this thread:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/10-pentax-slr-lens-discussion/265783-sigm...ing-going.html

This was posted:

Originally posted by rgknief60

Since one PF review seemed to suggest a local dealer might be able to obtain the lens, I checked with my local Sigma dealer. He never replied. I called Sigma USA. The representative confirmed to me that this lens has indeed been discontinued in the Pentax mount. She further confirmed that dealers are unable to obtain any more stock.

Fire Angel · 07-16-2014, 12:00 PM

That's evidently very different from the UK position then; however if they really have discontinued it in the USA then I would expect the UK to follow sometime fairly soon. In spite of what the Sigma rep said I've even found some places that have it in stock in the Pentax mount. One is the highly reputable SRS Microsystems.

07-12-2014, 08:43 AM - 1 Like	#5
interested_observer Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Tumbleweed, Arizona Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,707	Originally posted by OregonJim There are wider ones available. Here's an example: Amazon.com : Vivitar VIV-7MM-P 7mm F3.5 Fisheye Lens for Pentax : Camera Lenses : Camera & Photo 1mm may seem like a small difference, but the AOV jumps from 121 deg. (8mm) to 180 deg. (7mm). Still, the Sigma is a great tool. Glad you enjoy it! All fisheyes are (usually) 180 degrees wide (on the diagonal) by their design - in terms of fisheye zooms they are (usually) 180 degrees wide at their widest end. What varies across the fisheyes and their focal length differences is the magnification at the center point and type of projection used and the extent of the projection across the corners and in particular the sides. The diagonal corner points are going to be at least 180 degrees and on some of the more extreme fisheyes more. In terms of the focal length across both a fisheye and rectilinear lens, the only reasonable comparison is the magnification used at the center point. After that, the barrel distortion takes over - in the case of the fisheye it is uncorrected, while in the case of the rectilinear it is corrected to maintain straight lines (at the expense of artificially stretching the view). The other aspect is how the projection from the lens is laid down across the sensor. Some fisheyes have the entire projection with in the sensor (circular fisheye) - while others have the extent of the sensor within the projection of the lens (full frame fisheye). The other aspect of fisheye lenses is how the photographer employs the lens. Walk up close to a subject and the lens will pull the center of the view in and diminish the edges. Then have the object move out of the frame, and the center suddenly becomes push back and diminished while the edges and corners appear to become drawn in. Looking at a zoom fisheye, at its widest they are running 180 degrees corner to corner. However, when you zoom in, nothing optically really changes with the lens - the lens does not change its projection or anything, its just the extent of the projection that is laid across the sensor. So effectively, you are loosing view across the corners and edges. Using the 10-17 lens as an example, you zoom from 180 field of view (on the diagonal) to about 100 degrees at 17mm. Essentially you are just magnifying the center as you zoom and the wider view (of the corners and edges) roll off the edge of the sensor - in essence you are cropping the view from 10mm to 17mm. Most folks think that fisheye lenses portray an extreme and un-natural view of the world. In some cases they are correct. However, again its up the the photographer and how they employ the lens. When comparing a fisheye to a rectilinear across the same identical scene, the fisheye can appear more natural in its view of the world - where as with the rectilinear the lines may be straighter - but the view un-naturally stretched, elongated and distorted. It all comes down to what looks the best in terms of what the photographer intends to present. https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/10-pentax-slr-lens-discussion/235102-uwa-...omparison.html Last edited by interested_observer; 07-12-2014 at 09:00 AM.

07-12-2014, 12:39 PM	#6
interested_observer Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Tumbleweed, Arizona Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,707	Originally posted by Fire Angel Why do people keep repeating the myth that Sigma have discontinued this lens for Pentax? According to their web site they haven't. According to a Sigma UK rep I spoke to recently they haven't. It's often necessary to place an order to get it as it is produced in limited numbers due to relatively low demand since the 10-20mm f3.5 was launched, but it is still being made in the Pentax K mount. Can't somebody in the admin here contact Sigma and ask them? Then someone can put the reviews for this lens back where they belong, among Sigma's current range of zooms, instead of where they are currently, in the legacy range. I wish I could justify the expense, because if I had an 8-16mm it would not be rarely used, I assure you! At one time the Sigma site did not list the Pentax mount as being available. This was a bit after I had purchased mine. So, I just went back to the Sigma site and they are now listing the Pentax mount as being available. Also B&H has the lens in stock. 8-16mm F4.5-5.6 DC HSM \| Sigma Corporation of America Sigma Pentax 8-16mm F4.5-5.6 DC HSM

07-15-2014, 12:02 PM	#8
Fire Angel Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 136	Originally posted by interested_observer At one time the Sigma site did not list the Pentax mount as being available. This was a bit after I had purchased mine. So, I just went back to the Sigma site and they are now listing the Pentax mount as being available. Also B&H has the lens in stock. 8-16mm F4.5-5.6 DC HSM \| Sigma Corporation of America Sigma Pentax 8-16mm F4.5-5.6 DC HSM It's great that this lens is slightly easier to obtain nowadays, though the Sigma person I spoke to admitted that few dealers will stock this lens and it must almost always be ordered. I have often thought that I'd like to get it but I can't justify spending that much on a lens, at least not until I finish my music studies (sometime late in 2017). I will probably get one of the 10-20mm options instead and then see if I really develop the skills and need for the extra width that this lens offers. I would expect the 8mm end of such a zoom to be difficult to use to best advantage.

07-15-2014, 07:57 PM	#9
Digitalis Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Melbourne, Victoria Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,694	Originally posted by Fire Angel I would expect the 8mm end of such a zoom to be difficult to use to best advantage. I won't deny it is difficult, but there are certain subjects that call for 8mm focal lengths. Pentax K5IIs - Sigma 8-16mm f/4.5-5.6 ASPH DG@ 8mm Pentax K5IIs - Sigma 8-16mm f/4.5-5.6 ASPH DG @ 8mm Last edited by Digitalis; 07-15-2014 at 08:16 PM.

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07-12-2014, 06:08 AM	#2
OregonJim Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Willamette Valley, Oregon Posts: 1,327	Originally posted by DDoram I am greatful to have a copy of the widest lens available for APSC There are wider ones available. Here's an example: Amazon.com : Vivitar VIV-7MM-P 7mm F3.5 Fisheye Lens for Pentax : Camera Lenses : Camera & Photo 1mm may seem like a small difference, but the AOV jumps from 121 deg. (8mm) to 180 deg. (7mm). Still, the Sigma is a great tool. Glad you enjoy it!

07-12-2014, 06:17 AM	#3
DDoram Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Edmonton, Alberta Canada Posts: 632 Original Poster	Hi Jim: The Vivitar is a fisheye and not a rectangular lens though. Dale

07-12-2014, 07:54 AM - 2 Likes	#4
Fire Angel Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 136	Why do people keep repeating the myth that Sigma have discontinued this lens for Pentax? According to their web site they haven't. According to a Sigma UK rep I spoke to recently they haven't. It's often necessary to place an order to get it as it is produced in limited numbers due to relatively low demand since the 10-20mm f3.5 was launched, but it is still being made in the Pentax K mount. Can't somebody in the admin here contact Sigma and ask them? Then someone can put the reviews for this lens back where they belong, among Sigma's current range of zooms, instead of where they are currently, in the legacy range. I wish I could justify the expense, because if I had an 8-16mm it would not be rarely used, I assure you! Last edited by Fire Angel; 07-12-2014 at 08:00 AM.

07-15-2014, 08:18 AM	#7
Mikesul Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 7,594	Unfortunately, BandH does not have it in stock now and the Sigma site lists no dealers who have stock. Bummer. But your explanation of fisheye/rectilinear was very helpful. Thanks.

07-15-2014, 09:00 PM	#10
vonBaloney Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 6,029	I'm pretty sure one of the Sigma people did confirm at one point that it was no longer available, at least in the U.S. It used to be stocked by all the usual places... I ordered mine from B&H back when, came immediately.

07-16-2014, 12:29 AM	#11
Digitalis Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Melbourne, Victoria Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,694	Originally posted by Fire Angel Why do people keep repeating the myth that Sigma have discontinued this lens for Pentax? Probably because the lens is listed on the pentax forums lens review pages under legacy sigma lenses.

07-16-2014, 08:15 AM	#12
vonBaloney Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 6,029	It is not listed for sale on any USA site -- it is not out of stock at B&H, etc, it is just gone completely. There are some listed on Amazon, but all shipping from Japan looks like. Prices a bit higher than it was previously listed for USA (which was $650ish). So it can still be gotten (and there should be used ones floating around for years to come) but not from the usual channels and probably with no warranty...

07-16-2014, 10:54 AM	#13
Fire Angel Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 136	Originally posted by vonBaloney It is not listed for sale on any USA site -- it is not out of stock at B&H, etc, it is just gone completely. There are some listed on Amazon, but all shipping from Japan looks like. Prices a bit higher than it was previously listed for USA (which was $650ish). So it can still be gotten (and there should be used ones floating around for years to come) but not from the usual channels and probably with no warranty... Yeah that's normal now, if you want it it usually has to be ordered from a dealer, even the Sigma rep I spoke to said he didn't know of anywhere in London (which is a pretty big city) that would stock it. If you want it in Canon or Nikon mount of course there are several places that do stock it, but nowadays Pentax have a much smaller market share so...

07-16-2014, 11:21 AM	#14
vonBaloney Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 6,029	Originally posted by Fire Angel Yeah that's normal now, if you want it it usually has to be ordered from a dealer, even the Sigma rep I spoke to said he didn't know of anywhere in London (which is a pretty big city) that would stock it. If you want it in Canon or Nikon mount of course there are several places that do stock it, but nowadays Pentax have a much smaller market share so... It seems to me you can't even order it from a dealer (in the US). In this thread: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/10-pentax-slr-lens-discussion/265783-sigm...ing-going.html This was posted: Originally posted by rgknief60 Since one PF review seemed to suggest a local dealer might be able to obtain the lens, I checked with my local Sigma dealer. He never replied. I called Sigma USA. The representative confirmed to me that this lens has indeed been discontinued in the Pentax mount. She further confirmed that dealers are unable to obtain any more stock.

07-16-2014, 12:00 PM	#15
Fire Angel Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 136	That's evidently very different from the UK position then; however if they really have discontinued it in the USA then I would expect the UK to follow sometime fairly soon. In spite of what the Sigma rep said I've even found some places that have it in stock in the Pentax mount. One is the highly reputable SRS Microsystems.