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02-12-2016, 08:37 PM   #1
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What's so special about the 77 limited?

This lens was designed for film and would be the perfect portrait lens but on and APS-C camera why wouldn't the 50 mm 1.4 be just as good?
Is the 77 really worth that much more$$$$?

02-12-2016, 08:39 PM   #2
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Yes, it's worth much, much more than it's current price.

Just take a peek at the FA Limited lens club.
02-12-2016, 08:42 PM - 1 Like   #3
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Hi Robert. I suggest that you strap yourself in and be prepared for an avalanche of responses !!!
02-12-2016, 08:58 PM - 6 Likes   #4
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Because wide open it can do this:







02-12-2016, 09:08 PM - 5 Likes   #5
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Size, tactile quality, speed and it looks absolutely gorgeous.Thats just the outside. The FA and DA 50s look and feel like a McDonalds takeaway sitting alongside a Michelin star main course. Next up is the rendering, with the 77, beautifully detailed in the centre with a delicious transition to OOF areas. Skin tones are picked up marvelously. The FA50 will be softer wide open, less contrasty and corner to corner sharpness falls off sooner. The DA50 being more of a planar design than the FA will be a bit sharper across the frame than the FA but will lack the 3D bite of the 77. Main weakness of the 77 is purple fringing at wide apertures in high contrast scenes. DA50 is a great starter lens, overall probably better than the FA50 but the FA can produce a nice dreamy like shot that the DA can't. The 77 is designed from the ground up to be a high quality short tele and hits the bullseye. Different class of optic, different class of build, ultimately a different class in rendering. Worth every penny.

Last edited by robbiec; 03-02-2016 at 06:39 AM.
02-12-2016, 09:13 PM   #6
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Robbie provided the words I was trying to say in pictures.
Case closed.
02-12-2016, 09:17 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by Sandy Hancock Quote
Because wide open it can do this:
Someone took the color out of the first two.

I have often wondered what the big fuss is over the 31, 43, and 77 other than odd focal lengths.
02-12-2016, 09:24 PM - 2 Likes   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by VoiceOfReason Quote
Someone took the color out of the first two.
Thanks for pointing that out. Whoever it was will get a stern talking to....

QuoteQuote:
I have often wondered what the big fuss is over the 31, 43, and 77 other than odd focal lengths.
Own them and you might understand

02-12-2016, 09:36 PM - 3 Likes   #9
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It's really quite a good lens. Well worth the cost. There is just a "thing" about the FA ltds and especially the 77. Here, a couple more photos.





Plus, 7 is my lucky number.
02-12-2016, 10:00 PM - 1 Like   #10
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I am predicting that this thread will get to about 12 pages.

At least 8... but I am saying 12.
02-12-2016, 10:05 PM - 7 Likes   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by VoiceOfReason Quote
Someone took the color out of the first two.

I have often wondered what the big fuss is over the 31, 43, and 77 other than odd focal lengths.
QuoteOriginally posted by Sandy Hancock Quote
Own them and you might understand
What Sandy said (and showed, with the brilliant series of wide open shots)


QuoteOriginally posted by ChatMechant Quote
Here, a couple more photos.
That cat shot is just deliciously rendered.



I own all 3 FA limiteds, along with a number of other highly regarded Pentax primes - the 77 and 31 most consistently produce attention-grabbing shots. It's hard to quantify why sometimes, but IMHO often has to do with nearly unmatched sharp-to-OOF transitions, fantastic bokeh, warmish color rendering, and frequent 3d "pop". They were intentionally designed not to hit it out of the park in test charts, but to produce images that hit it out of the park. I havent' been disappointed.




-Brandon
02-12-2016, 10:50 PM   #12
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I think I want one!

That is some terrific photo.
02-13-2016, 12:07 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by VoiceOfReason Quote
I have often wondered what the big fuss is over the 31, 43, and 77 other than odd focal lengths.
In fact, the 31, 43, 77 focal lengths are pretty close to the "traditional" 35, 50, 85, and don't really cause much difference in usage.

The "fuss" about this trio of lenses lies in their beautiful, signature manner of rendering images.

Not something easily quantifiable in terms of test charts and numbers. Not that I'm discounting those.

But you see it in the real-world photos taken. Magic.

---------- Post added 02-13-16 at 04:11 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by bpv_UW Quote
I own all 3 FA limiteds... They were intentionally designed not to hit it out of the park in test charts, but to produce images that hit it out of the park.
Well put.

It's all in the images.

Last edited by KDAFA; 02-13-2016 at 12:13 AM.
02-13-2016, 12:44 AM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by robert Quote
This lens was designed for film and would be the perfect portrait lens but on and APS-C camera why wouldn't the 50 mm 1.4 be just as good?
Sorry to be so simple, but first of all , you can't compare 77mm and 50mm for portraits as the angle of view / distance, hence result would be fairly different regardless of the quality of the glass.
Now, the reason why the 77 Ltd produces a specific 3D effect versus a similar but newer lens design such as the HD 70mm Ltd, is the gradient of sharpness between the center and the edges. Wide open, the 77 is still resolving a lot of lpmm in the center and gradually gets softer away from the center, which renders high contrast of the subject (when the subject is centered, for instance portrait) with gradually softening bokeh towards the edges. If you consider the 70 Ltd, is a different optical design, the peak sharpness/contrast in the center is less than peak center sharpness of the 77 ltd, but on the edges the 70 Ltd is sharper which render a harsher bokeh and overall less 3D pop effect as the 77 Ltd. Some lenses are better for some applications. You may consider faster lenses, such as 85 f1.2 and you might think that because the lens if faster , it would give you more 3D pop effect, but it does not necessarily render that much 3D pop if the contrast and sharpness of the center decreases as much as the edges when used wide open. You may even find f0/95 lenses they render crappy wide open because both edges and center are softened by the same amount, no sharpness gradient and no much 3D pop effect. Last but not least, the FA Ltd lenses don't have the latest coatings used for digital , so the drawback is that those lenses are more prone to flare and ghosting, but in good lighting conditions they render a colors with some kind of "natural, unfiltered" closer to what it was like in film days, you can't get that rendering with, for instance, the HD coating of the latest lens models.

Last edited by biz-engineer; 02-13-2016 at 01:00 AM.
02-13-2016, 01:09 AM   #15
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It has character, something akin to how some would describe a CCD vs a CMOS captured image ... a intangible feature.
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