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07-18-2008, 08:20 AM   #46
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QuoteOriginally posted by creampuff Quote
If information relating to the lens was supposed to have been embargoed but released prematurely, then it is only correct that Pentax took appropriate action to rein in the leak.

On another point, I'm in full agreement with welshwizard645. I am frankly pretty sick and tired reading posts of those threatening to switch brands. Bottomline is if you don't think Pentax is the right camera for you, then why prolong the agony? Take the bold step now and jump ship. Far better than moaning and bitching and continuing the constant tirade about Pentax's shortcomings. Isn't it better to sing praise about something you like rather that talking negative all the time?
Actually, I don't have all my eggs in one basket. I do have a Nikon D70s and an EOS A2 film camera with a canon ring flash system, but the preponderance of my gear is Pentax and has been for 22 years.

07-18-2008, 08:21 AM   #47
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
Thats funny. Canon, and Nikon are so far ahead of Pentax that their arses aren't even specks on Pentax's horizon.
That's not totally true unless you go to the $5000 camera bodies.
07-18-2008, 08:33 AM   #48
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Wheatfield, I take your point but I also think people need to take a realistic perspective of where Pentax is at.

Pentax is still trying to reverse the legacy of the severe decline many years ago when they kept producing crappy AF film cameras that were simply flops in the retail arena. Declining sales led to factory closures within Japan and relocation of production facilities outside Japan and the forced discontinuation of many lenses in the FA series line-up simply because nobody were buying their unimaginative film cameras in a declining film market. Thankfully Hoya's takeover has kicked out the unimaginative bums on the Pentax board but the damage in terms of brand awareness, market share, equipment availability, tech know-how plus the financial position of the company has already left it's negative mark.

Is it any wonder that Pentax was late to catch the DSLR wave, and always playing catch-up in product development and product introductions. I think Pentax has made great strides in camera development. The ist series were just incremental improvements while the K series has helped restore the company's fortunes somewhat. The user base has increased but it also means new challenges to meet. I'd cut them some slack because they have a long way to go to gain mainstream recognition what more product roll-out and having a pervasive retail presence.

As I said previously, if one is of the opinion that other offerings from the market leaders are demonstrably better, then as the saying goes, put your money where your mouth is and make the change. I'm sure the folks at Pentax are doing their utmost best but I think bitching about shortcomings is counterproductive.

Last edited by creampuff; 07-18-2008 at 08:39 AM.
07-18-2008, 08:37 AM   #49
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QuoteOriginally posted by Cam Traviss Quote
Knock it off with that crap. What are you? 5 years old?
you're saying this to the person who is defending himself? why not tell it to the internet tough guy.

07-18-2008, 08:37 AM   #50
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Hi Chris,
Youíve been very considerate in the past. And Ned and others, generally have a healthy view of things, Iím sure things can be settled in a correct manner, so no negativity come of it.

A lot of great replies in the beginning of the thread. In the end, it seems more minute discussions.

I didnít get to see the original thread, but looking forward to the release or more info from the lens. A good taster, nonetheless
07-18-2008, 08:39 AM   #51
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Done and done

QuoteOriginally posted by OniFactor Quote
you're saying this to the person who is defending himself? why not tell it to the internet tough guy.

Maybe we all oughta move on.
07-18-2008, 08:51 AM   #52
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Exactly...

QuoteOriginally posted by OniFactor Quote
you're saying this to the person who is defending himself? why not tell it to the internet tough guy.
Wheatfield's been doing all the provoking. We were all having a nice discussion in support of Chris until his inflammatory personal remarks.

Cheers,
Cameron
07-18-2008, 08:59 AM   #53
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
Of course this is just the opinion of an internet badass who has invested several tens of thousands of dollars in support of Pentax, and for his trouble has the pleasure of having people lie about what he says on internet forums......
Why would someone spend "several tens of thousands of dollars" on a company without doing due diligence to see what that company's reputation was? I have been a Pentax user since the early 80's, and they missed deadlines then, and have ever since.

It's a real pity that you have spent so much money on equipment that you feel is so far behind Canon and Nikon, but WTF - if you think those brands are so much better, why do you own Pentax?

As for "internet badass", well, let's just call it lame and leave it at that.

07-18-2008, 09:00 AM   #54
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QuoteOriginally posted by Cambo Quote
Wheatfield's been doing all the provoking. We were all having a nice discussion in support of Chris until his inflammatory personal remarks.

Cheers,
Cameron


Yeah, I apologize for my remark.
07-18-2008, 09:36 AM   #55
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tom S. Quote
Why would someone spend "several tens of thousands of dollars" on a company without doing due diligence to see what that company's reputation was? I have been a Pentax user since the early 80's, and they missed deadlines then, and have ever since.

It's a real pity that you have spent so much money on equipment that you feel is so far behind Canon and Nikon, but WTF - if you think those brands are so much better, why do you own Pentax?

As for "internet badass", well, let's just call it lame and leave it at that.
When I bought into Pentax initially, I practiced as much due diligence as was possible in the pre internet era. Canon had just screwed their FD user base by completely abandoning the lens mount, Nikon had just gone from the F3 to a camera nearly as big as my Pentax 6x7, and Minolta was putting out what I considered to be flashy junk, and had indicated that their manual focus camera line was dead in the water with the X-700.
The LX suited my 35mm film needs perfectly, far better than anything else out there at the time.
They had, at the time, a reputation as being a camera company that was at, or at least, close to the apex of Japanese photographic companies.
Don't talk to me about due diligence, I've been around long enough to remember when Pentax was "it", not "was".
Pentax lenses are, in my opinion, still the best out there.
My concern isn't missing deadlines, my concern is that they have, for several years, not been able to make a deadline and then stick anywhere near it.
This isn't about the other guys being better, this is about the guys I support not being good enough, and I would be concerned about it even if Pentax was #1 in the market place rather than number three, poised to slip to #5.
I'm really happy you'all have a nice little close minded community here, and I am the first to admit I can be rather provocative, but sometimes people need to have a pin stuck into their balloon to kickstart the thought processes.
Support this Chris guy all you like, call me whatever names you want, threaten me however you like, the fact is, whether it was spelled out in small easily understood words for him or not, he broke an embargo, and he may have damaged Pentax's future willingness to trust beta testers with pre release equipment.
Or, you all could wake up and smell the coffee.
07-18-2008, 09:41 AM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
I promise you that you would not say this kind of stuff to my face. You would be gator bait.
Isn't this what you really said?

Dear Wheatfield,

Blue has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to entitled - NOTE: DA* 60-250 thread pulled - in the Pentax SLR Lens Discussion forum of PentaxForums.com.

This thread is located at:
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/32376-note-da-...-new-post.html

Here is the message that has just been posted:
***************

In a word, fukk you.
***************


There may also be other replies, but you will not receive any more notifications until you visit the forum again.

All the best,
PentaxForums.com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Nice to see you have the courage of your convictions.
07-18-2008, 10:20 AM   #57
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
When I bought into Pentax initially, I practiced as much due diligence as was possible in the pre internet era. Canon had just screwed their FD user base by completely abandoning the lens mount, Nikon had just gone from the F3 to a camera nearly as big as my Pentax 6x7, and Minolta was putting out what I considered to be flashy junk, and had indicated that their manual focus camera line was dead in the water with the X-700.
The LX suited my 35mm film needs perfectly, far better than anything else out there at the time.
They had, at the time, a reputation as being a camera company that was at, or at least, close to the apex of Japanese photographic companies.
Don't talk to me about due diligence, I've been around long enough to remember when Pentax was "it", not "was".
Pentax lenses are, in my opinion, still the best out there.
My concern isn't missing deadlines, my concern is that they have, for several years, not been able to make a deadline and then stick anywhere near it.
This isn't about the other guys being better, this is about the guys I support not being good enough, and I would be concerned about it even if Pentax was #1 in the market place rather than number three, poised to slip to #5.

All of this is well and good, but it doesn't explain why you still have Pentax equipment after making the statement: "Canon, and Nikon are so far ahead of Pentax that their arses aren't even specks on Pentax's horizon." That statement was made in direct reference to the very Pentax lenses you hold so dear.

I'm really happy you'all have a nice little close minded community here, and I am the first to admit I can be rather provocative, but sometimes people need to have a pin stuck into their balloon to kickstart the thought processes.
Support this Chris guy all you like, call me whatever names you want, threaten me however you like, the fact is, whether it was spelled out in small easily understood words for him or not, he broke an embargo, and he may have damaged Pentax's future willingness to trust beta testers with pre release equipment.
Or, you all could wake up and smell the coffee.
As for the community here, it isn't mine, it's ours - including you. Nor am I closed mind. If I had such a distaste for an equipment maker as you do, regardless of brand, I would be switching.

Lastly, my post had nothing to do with Chris. What happened is between him and Pentax, as only they know what, if any, rules have been broken.
07-18-2008, 10:42 AM   #58
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tom S. Quote
As for the community here, it isn't mine, it's ours - including you. Nor am I closed mind. If I had such a distaste for an equipment maker as you do, regardless of brand, I would be switching.

It comes down to a few things.
One, it has taken me many years of effort to put together one of the most complete lens kits a photographer could want, and I have no intention of doing it again.
Two, money, plain and simple. I couldn't replace my lens kit with another brand in an affordable fashion.
Three, I really do like Pentax lenses, and I like the K20, although I do feel it is rather lightly built.

That the other guys are more than somewhat ahead of Pentax in terms of technical sophistication doesn't cause me to lose any sleep, I would just like to be able to buy a 60-250mm lens when they originally said I'd be able to, not several years later.
07-18-2008, 10:47 AM   #59
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
It comes down to a few things.
One, it has taken me many years of effort to put together one of the most complete lens kits a photographer could want, and I have no intention of doing it again.
Two, money, plain and simple. I couldn't replace my lens kit with another brand in an affordable fashion.
Three, I really do like Pentax lenses, and I like the K20, although I do feel it is rather lightly built.

That the other guys are more than somewhat ahead of Pentax in terms of technical sophistication doesn't cause me to lose any sleep, I would just like to be able to buy a 60-250mm lens when they originally said I'd be able to, not several years later.
Fair enough.
07-18-2008, 10:57 AM   #60
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
Isn't this what you really said?

Dear Wheatfield,

Blue has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to entitled - NOTE: DA* 60-250 thread pulled - in the Pentax SLR Lens Discussion forum of PentaxForums.com.

This thread is located at:
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/32376-note-da-...-new-post.html

Here is the message that has just been posted:
***************

In a word, fukk you.
***************


There may also be other replies, but you will not receive any more notifications until you visit the forum again.

All the best,
PentaxForums.com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Nice to see you have the courage of your convictions.
This is getting absolutely out of control...fukk you are 2 words.
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