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12-24-2016, 11:58 AM   #61
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QuoteOriginally posted by BrianR Quote
Under Ricoh, he could have an unlimited photocopying budget?
Yep, post of the thread, IMHO.





12-26-2016, 02:46 AM   #62
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
I always wonder "what would I buy right now?"

There's always been a nagging feeling around our house that when we bought the 21 ltd, we should have bought the 15. And the end result of that was buying the Sigma 8-16. We won't make the same mistake with the K-1.

A 20mm ƒ3.5 or ƒ4 prime is about it.

If Pentax doesn't make that then I don't really care what they do. I'm good.
Your spot on there mate. Considering the fact the the k1 is primarily a landscape lens a 20 f4 would be probably the most requested lens of all
12-26-2016, 03:39 AM   #63
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Yes. But imagine the outrage if Pentax would actually launch an f/4 wide Fujifilm, after all, has a 23mm f/1.4

Pentax had a 20mm f/2.8, 67mm filters and weighting 255g. A modern version - albeit larger and heavier - might be a good idea.
12-26-2016, 12:25 PM - 1 Like   #64
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
Ricoh would be putting themselves in a catch 22 situation with that logic. They won't attract new users without a well fleshed out lens line, including a family of primes. Right now the biggest market for the K1 is people with a collection of legacy lenses. Once they have tapped that market out, they need something to entice new users.
I don't know, we have plenty of new users showing up here despite the current lens situation.

12-26-2016, 04:21 PM   #65
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Yes. But imagine the outrage if Pentax would actually launch an f/4 wide Fujifilm, after all, has a 23mm f/1.4

Pentax had a 20mm f/2.8, 67mm filters and weighting 255g. A modern version - albeit larger and heavier - might be a good idea.
The 23/1.4 from Fuji is an APS-C lens.
I think the problem we are going to see with fast full frame lenses is they are going to be big and expensive.

---------- Post added 12-26-16 at 05:25 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by leekil Quote
I don't know, we have plenty of new users showing up here despite the current lens situation.
Most people buy a camera and a couple of kit zooms and stop there. For every couple of dozen of them, one or two will buy something better than the kit zooms, but still zooms, and for every couple of dozen of them, a few will actually buy a group of high quality primes rather than zooms. It's a small market in reality, but the bait has to be there to attract in the fishes.
12-26-2016, 04:49 PM   #66
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
The 23/1.4 from Fuji is an APS-C lens.
I think the problem we are going to see with fast full frame lenses is they are going to be big and expensive.
It doesn't really matter for the complainers - but make it the Sony Sonnar T* E 24mm f/1.8 ZA, if you wish.

Someone's problem is somebody else's solution. Anyway, I guess I'll find something to my liking... I'm a bit worried about the "large aperture ultra wide-angle single focus lens" though, as those could get quite big. Even so, it should be more compact and lighter than the D FA 15-30mm.
12-26-2016, 07:48 PM   #67
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
Most people buy a camera and a couple of kit zooms and stop there. For every couple of dozen of them, one or two will buy something better than the kit zooms, but still zooms,
Might be more like "for every couple of hundred" The vast majority buy only the kit zoom. Some will then buy a longer tele-zoom. A very, very few will buy prime lenses. Is that few enough to be economically viable to produce lenses for? Time will tell.

Personally I prefer zooms for most things. About the only prime I would buy without thinking a lot about would be a 20mm f/2.8 or so if it has awesome starburst characteristics and takes filters. But I have a Pentax-A 20mm f/2.8 so even that would have to prove superior to what I have.

12-26-2016, 09:15 PM   #68
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84,000 K-1 annual planned production for 3+ years. I'd guess the total production might be 250,000 units. One of a hundred buyers is 1%. One of 100 of those is 1/10% 1/100%. Each 1% of K-1 buyers who buys a lens = 2,500 lenses. Each 1/10% is 250 1/100% = 25 lenses.

I suppose that's a significant difference. Is 250 lenses large enough to recover development cost?

Edited for 6th Grade math error.

Nevertheless, 1/100th of 1/100th is so small I doubt the assertion is correct.

Last edited by monochrome; 12-27-2016 at 05:13 AM.
12-26-2016, 10:01 PM - 2 Likes   #69
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Is it fair that some chickens apparently have 6 nuggets while others have 9? And a few chickens seem to have 20 nuggets.
12-26-2016, 10:17 PM   #70
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
84,000 K-1 annual planned production for 3+ years. I'd guess the total production might be 250,000 units. One of a hundred buyers is 1%. One of 100 of those is 1/10%. Each 1% of K-1 buyers who buys a lens = 2,500 lenses. Each 1/10% is 250 lenses.

I suppose that's a significant difference. Is 250 lenses large enough to recover development cost?
One of a hundred of 1% is 1/100%, i.e., 25 lenses.
12-26-2016, 10:41 PM   #71
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Is 250 lenses large enough to recover development cost?
Unlikely. But what I know about this stuff is essentially nothing, which rarely stops me from speculating....

QuoteOriginally posted by mee Quote
Is it fair that some chickens apparently have 6 nuggets while others have 9? And a few chickens seem to have 20 nuggets.
12-27-2016, 05:07 AM   #72
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QuoteOriginally posted by Paul the Sunman Quote
One of a hundred of 1% is 1/100%, i.e., 25 lenses.
Oops
12-27-2016, 05:41 AM   #73
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
Well, it's said he designed the 24-70.
Co designed,but he is out of this design team.
Still Tamron,but not in the lens design team anymore.
Best regards
12-27-2016, 06:47 AM   #74
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QuoteOriginally posted by Paul the Sunman Quote
One of a hundred of 1% is 1/100%, i.e., 25 lenses.
Initial production volume for the D FA 15-30 (the lowest I could find): 200 units per month. For the D FA* 70-200 and some other lenses: 1000 units per month.

Perhaps the assumptions that led to an estimation of 25 lenses in total isn't that accurate
12-27-2016, 09:00 AM   #75
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
It doesn't really matter for the complainers - but make it the Sony Sonnar T* E 24mm f/1.8 ZA, if you wish.

Someone's problem is somebody else's solution. Anyway, I guess I'll find something to my liking... I'm a bit worried about the "large aperture ultra wide-angle single focus lens" though, as those could get quite big. Even so, it should be more compact and lighter than the D FA 15-30mm.
I'm more optimistic. I look at what Sigma has, and feel that Pentax/Ricoh will be smaller for a similar lens just because they generally put in that effort.

I won't take the size of a zoom lens as an indicator of a prime lens. Afterall, zooms are always on the big side.

---------- Post added 12-27-2016 at 08:03 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
Might be more like "for every couple of hundred" The vast majority buy only the kit zoom. Some will then buy a longer tele-zoom. A very, very few will buy prime lenses. Is that few enough to be economically viable to produce lenses for? Time will tell.

Personally I prefer zooms for most things. About the only prime I would buy without thinking a lot about would be a 20mm f/2.8 or so if it has awesome starburst characteristics and takes filters. But I have a Pentax-A 20mm f/2.8 so even that would have to prove superior to what I have.
I think the problem with a lot of the logic being thrown around is that when it comes to the lenses (primes especially), I suspect people with bodies like the K-3, K-70, etc might actually buy those lenses too. It may not be many given the likely price point, but K-mounts aren't just for K-1s.
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