Jupiter-3 markings not lining up?

**BigMackCam** · 04-29-2017, 02:47 AM

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One for the rangefinder lens users, this...

I recently picked up a very nice, reasonably-priced Jupiter-3 which, after some gentle cleaning and maintenance, turns out to be a really good example optically, mechanically and cosmetically. I'm very pleased with it.

But there's one odd thing about the lens... when I mount it to my M39/E-mount adapter, the red arrow focus marker is facing downwards, so isn't visible when looking down at the top of the camera (other rangefinder lenses I own mount with the markings facing up).

I can't see any way to move the focus arrow and hyperfocal markings round, as it seems the rear section with the markings and the mount itself is all one solid piece.

I'm wondering if the lens has been modified by someone taking some material off the base to allow infinity focusing on certain cameras. It doesn't look like that's the case, but it's the only reason I can think of.

Any ideas, folks?

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Last edited by BigMackCam; 04-29-2017 at 05:18 AM.

Na Horuk · 04-29-2017, 04:03 AM - **1 Like**

I don't know about the specific lens you have, but when it comes to Soviet lenses, there are quite a few modified lenses and even frankenlenses (put together from a couple of different lenses)

Supakatti · 04-29-2017, 05:10 AM - **1 Like**

Possibly the rear piece is not on it's correct position. Often there's been two or three small screws that should keep it on it's place. Loosening them and twisting the rear piece on it's place and tightening them again should fix it.
But without seeing, can't say of it's your problem. Check, if there's a video on YouTube or anything else info in internet.

**BigMackCam** · 04-29-2017, 05:21 AM

Originally posted by Na Horuk

I don't know about the specific lens you have, but when it comes to Soviet lenses, there are quite a few modified lenses and even frankenlenses (put together from a couple of different lenses)

Yes, I've had a couple of those frankenlenses before

This looks original, but the alignment issue is odd...

Originally posted by Supakatti

Possibly the rear piece is not on it's correct position. Often there's been two or three small screws that should keep it on it's place. Loosening them and twisting the rear piece on it's place and tightening them again should fix it.
But without seeing, can't say of it's your problem. Check, if there's a video on YouTube or anything else info in internet.

That's what I thought too, but as I say, the part of the body with the red focus arrow marking and the M39 threads appears to be one solid section - no screws that I can see, and no gaps in the aluminium to suggest they are separate parts

35mmfilmfan · 04-29-2017, 05:31 AM - **1 Like**

Looking at the mount itself (I presume - the black ring between camera and lens ?), it looks similar to a T2 mount (though obviously with thread differences, before I get jumped on [fun, but not in my state of health !]), and I think I can see a small grub screw just below the 5.6 aperture marking on the lens. If you slacken that off (and its corresponding brethren around the mount) you may be able to rotate the inner portion of the mount until the lens achieves proper alignment. Good luck, anyway.

photoptimist · 04-29-2017, 05:46 AM - **1 Like**

A puzzler for sure!

Yet maybe someone did machine off 0.5 mm of the rear flange. To my eye it looks like there's a 1/2 mm of shiny ring near the mount surface which could be the residual tooling mark.

How is the lens in terms of focusing at infinity? Perhaps a 1/2 mm ring shim would fix it. Or you could get a second M39/E-mount adapter and machine off 1/2 mm from it. Either fix might also entail readjusting the focusing ring, infinity stop, or optical assembly to regain infinity-at-infinity focus. Or learn to hold the camera upside down -- LOL!

Good luck with this fun old lens!

IgorZ · 04-29-2017, 05:54 AM - **1 Like**

I have one and it doesn't line up on my Zorki either. I just got into the rangefinders so don't quote me on this, but I think unlike Leica lenses which have to be put in in a certain way, Soviet lenses don't have a set position from which to start screwing them in. Because of that, the final position is a bit random. The last time I put it in it almost lined up, but still not at 12 o'clock.

**BigMackCam** · 04-29-2017, 06:21 AM

Originally posted by 35mmfilmfan

Looking at the mount itself (I presume - the black ring between camera and lens ?), it looks similar to a T2 mount (though obviously with thread differences, before I get jumped on [fun, but not in my state of health !]), and I think I can see a small grub screw just below the 5.6 aperture marking on the lens. If you slacken that off (and its corresponding brethren around the mount) you may be able to rotate the inner portion of the mount until the lens achieves proper alignment. Good luck, anyway.

That black ring is part of the separate M39/E-mount adapter. And, yes, the adapter's inner ring position can be adjusted by loosening three grub screws... however, the other lenses I own line up more-or-less correctly at its current position. Thanks for the idea, though

Originally posted by photoptimist

A puzzler for sure!

Yet maybe someone did machine off 0.5 mm of the rear flange. To my eye it looks like there's a 1/2 mm of shiny ring near the mount surface which could be the residual tooling mark.

How is the lens in terms of focusing at infinity? Perhaps a 1/2 mm ring shim would fix it. Or you could get a second M39/E-mount adapter and machine off 1/2 mm from it. Either fix might also entail readjusting the focusing ring, infinity stop, or optical assembly to regain infinity-at-infinity focus. Or learn to hold the camera upside down -- LOL!

Good luck with this fun old lens!

Thanks

Re infinty focus, that's what really confuses me... It's absolutely spot on, with the hard stop at exactly the right point. So, if someone has machined any material off the base, it must have been because the lens previously wouldn't reach infinity focus.

The more I look at photos of other Jupiter-3 lenses, the more I'm convinced this has had some material removed. There are tooling marks, and the back edges of the teeth should be slightly chamfered (like the front edges) - but they're not.

It's a minor issue, frankly. I didn't pay much for it (perhaps this is the reason!), the glass is immaculate, and it works perfectly; better than I'd hoped, in all honesty. Plus, if it really bothered me, I could simply buy another inexpensive M39/E-mount adapter and set the inner ring position specifically for this lens. So I have options... it's just a bit puzzling, is all

Originally posted by IgorZ

I have one and it doesn't line up on my Zorki either. I just got into the rangefinders so don't quote me on this, but I think unlike Leica lenses which have to be put in in a certain way, Soviet lenses don't have a set position from which to start screwing them in. Because of that, the final position is a bit random. The last time I put it in it almost lined up, but still not at 12 o'clock.

Good to know - thanks

Perhaps that's the reason after all. I'm really not sure... My money's on some material having been removed, but then I don't understand why the lens wouldn't have reached infinity focus prior to this. Maybe when it was last serviced, the helicoids weren't put back together at the correct position and the owner chose to modify the mount rather than try the various helicoid positions... A strange choice, if that's the case, but I guess I'll never know for sure!

35mmfilmfan · 04-29-2017, 07:09 AM

Originally posted by BigMackCam

however, the other lenses I own line up more-or-less correctly at its current position. Thanks for the idea, though

Sorry, didn't realise you had more than 1 39mm thread lens. You could always buy another adaptor .. .. ..

emergo · 04-29-2017, 11:27 AM

buy an adapter where the center section can be adjusted. there is no need to modify the lens! similar to this one:

black Adapter for Leica L39 M39 Lens to Sony E NEX 3 NEX 5 NEX 7 NEX C3 5N + CAP | eBay

**BigMackCam** · 04-29-2017, 12:20 PM

Originally posted by BigMackCam

It's a minor issue, frankly. I didn't pay much for it (perhaps this is the reason!), the glass is immaculate, and it works perfectly; better than I'd hoped, in all honesty. Plus, if it really bothered me, I could simply buy another inexpensive M39/E-mount adapter and set the inner ring position specifically for this lens. So I have options... it's just a bit puzzling, is all

Originally posted by emergo

buy an adapter where the center section can be adjusted. there is no need to modify the lens! similar to this one:

Thanks

My current adapter is adjustable in that way... But my other M39-mount rangefinder lenses all line up more-or-less accurately with the adapter ring in its current position. I can buy a second adapter and adjust that ring specifically for this lens, and that's probably what I'll end up doing; it just puzzles me why this particular lens doesn't line up in the same way my others do when mounted. I'm sure it has been modified...

emergo · 04-30-2017, 10:47 AM

Originally posted by BigMackCam

Thanks

My current adapter is adjustable in that way... But my other M39-mount rangefinder lenses all line up more-or-less accurately with the adapter ring in its current position. I can buy a second adapter and adjust that ring specifically for this lens, and that's probably what I'll end up doing; it just puzzles me why this particular lens doesn't line up in the same way my others do when mounted. I'm sure it has been modified...

I've found this to be true of my russian lenses and c-mounts that I use. there's no consistency. I just get extra adapters and leave them on the lenses full time. much easier that way.

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04-29-2017, 04:03 AM - 1 Like	#2
Na Horuk Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Slovenia, probably Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,186	I don't know about the specific lens you have, but when it comes to Soviet lenses, there are quite a few modified lenses and even frankenlenses (put together from a couple of different lenses)

04-29-2017, 05:10 AM - 1 Like	#3
Supakatti Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Tuusula, Southern Finland Photos: Albums Posts: 135	Possibly the rear piece is not on it's correct position. Often there's been two or three small screws that should keep it on it's place. Loosening them and twisting the rear piece on it's place and tightening them again should fix it. But without seeing, can't say of it's your problem. Check, if there's a video on YouTube or anything else info in internet.

04-29-2017, 05:21 AM	#4
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,674 Original Poster	Originally posted by Na Horuk I don't know about the specific lens you have, but when it comes to Soviet lenses, there are quite a few modified lenses and even frankenlenses (put together from a couple of different lenses) Yes, I've had a couple of those frankenlenses before This looks original, but the alignment issue is odd... Originally posted by Supakatti Possibly the rear piece is not on it's correct position. Often there's been two or three small screws that should keep it on it's place. Loosening them and twisting the rear piece on it's place and tightening them again should fix it. But without seeing, can't say of it's your problem. Check, if there's a video on YouTube or anything else info in internet. That's what I thought too, but as I say, the part of the body with the red focus arrow marking and the M39 threads appears to be one solid section - no screws that I can see, and no gaps in the aluminium to suggest they are separate parts

04-29-2017, 05:31 AM - 1 Like	#5
35mmfilmfan Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Norfolk, UK Posts: 4,329	Looking at the mount itself (I presume - the black ring between camera and lens ?), it looks similar to a T2 mount (though obviously with thread differences, before I get jumped on [fun, but not in my state of health !]), and I think I can see a small grub screw just below the 5.6 aperture marking on the lens. If you slacken that off (and its corresponding brethren around the mount) you may be able to rotate the inner portion of the mount until the lens achieves proper alignment. Good luck, anyway.

04-29-2017, 05:46 AM - 1 Like	#6
photoptimist Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2016 Photos: Albums Posts: 5,126	A puzzler for sure! Yet maybe someone did machine off 0.5 mm of the rear flange. To my eye it looks like there's a 1/2 mm of shiny ring near the mount surface which could be the residual tooling mark. How is the lens in terms of focusing at infinity? Perhaps a 1/2 mm ring shim would fix it. Or you could get a second M39/E-mount adapter and machine off 1/2 mm from it. Either fix might also entail readjusting the focusing ring, infinity stop, or optical assembly to regain infinity-at-infinity focus. Or learn to hold the camera upside down -- LOL! Good luck with this fun old lens!

04-29-2017, 05:54 AM - 1 Like	#7
IgorZ Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Ottawa Posts: 1,735	I have one and it doesn't line up on my Zorki either. I just got into the rangefinders so don't quote me on this, but I think unlike Leica lenses which have to be put in in a certain way, Soviet lenses don't have a set position from which to start screwing them in. Because of that, the final position is a bit random. The last time I put it in it almost lined up, but still not at 12 o'clock.

04-29-2017, 06:21 AM	#8
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,674 Original Poster	Originally posted by 35mmfilmfan Looking at the mount itself (I presume - the black ring between camera and lens ?), it looks similar to a T2 mount (though obviously with thread differences, before I get jumped on [fun, but not in my state of health !]), and I think I can see a small grub screw just below the 5.6 aperture marking on the lens. If you slacken that off (and its corresponding brethren around the mount) you may be able to rotate the inner portion of the mount until the lens achieves proper alignment. Good luck, anyway. That black ring is part of the separate M39/E-mount adapter. And, yes, the adapter's inner ring position can be adjusted by loosening three grub screws... however, the other lenses I own line up more-or-less correctly at its current position. Thanks for the idea, though Originally posted by photoptimist A puzzler for sure! Yet maybe someone did machine off 0.5 mm of the rear flange. To my eye it looks like there's a 1/2 mm of shiny ring near the mount surface which could be the residual tooling mark. How is the lens in terms of focusing at infinity? Perhaps a 1/2 mm ring shim would fix it. Or you could get a second M39/E-mount adapter and machine off 1/2 mm from it. Either fix might also entail readjusting the focusing ring, infinity stop, or optical assembly to regain infinity-at-infinity focus. Or learn to hold the camera upside down -- LOL! Good luck with this fun old lens! Thanks Re infinty focus, that's what really confuses me... It's absolutely spot on, with the hard stop at exactly the right point. So, if someone has machined any material off the base, it must have been because the lens previously wouldn't reach infinity focus. The more I look at photos of other Jupiter-3 lenses, the more I'm convinced this has had some material removed. There are tooling marks, and the back edges of the teeth should be slightly chamfered (like the front edges) - but they're not. It's a minor issue, frankly. I didn't pay much for it (perhaps this is the reason!), the glass is immaculate, and it works perfectly; better than I'd hoped, in all honesty. Plus, if it really bothered me, I could simply buy another inexpensive M39/E-mount adapter and set the inner ring position specifically for this lens. So I have options... it's just a bit puzzling, is all Originally posted by IgorZ I have one and it doesn't line up on my Zorki either. I just got into the rangefinders so don't quote me on this, but I think unlike Leica lenses which have to be put in in a certain way, Soviet lenses don't have a set position from which to start screwing them in. Because of that, the final position is a bit random. The last time I put it in it almost lined up, but still not at 12 o'clock. Good to know - thanks Perhaps that's the reason after all. I'm really not sure... My money's on some material having been removed, but then I don't understand why the lens wouldn't have reached infinity focus prior to this. Maybe when it was last serviced, the helicoids weren't put back together at the correct position and the owner chose to modify the mount rather than try the various helicoid positions... A strange choice, if that's the case, but I guess I'll never know for sure!

04-29-2017, 07:09 AM	#9
35mmfilmfan Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Norfolk, UK Posts: 4,329	Originally posted by BigMackCam however, the other lenses I own line up more-or-less correctly at its current position. Thanks for the idea, though Sorry, didn't realise you had more than 1 39mm thread lens. You could always buy another adaptor .. .. ..

04-29-2017, 11:27 AM	#10
emergo Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Coloroado Photos: Gallery Posts: 271	buy an adapter where the center section can be adjusted. there is no need to modify the lens! similar to this one: black Adapter for Leica L39 M39 Lens to Sony E NEX 3 NEX 5 NEX 7 NEX C3 5N + CAP \| eBay

04-29-2017, 12:20 PM	#11
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,674 Original Poster	Originally posted by BigMackCam It's a minor issue, frankly. I didn't pay much for it (perhaps this is the reason!), the glass is immaculate, and it works perfectly; better than I'd hoped, in all honesty. Plus, if it really bothered me, I could simply buy another inexpensive M39/E-mount adapter and set the inner ring position specifically for this lens. So I have options... it's just a bit puzzling, is all Originally posted by emergo buy an adapter where the center section can be adjusted. there is no need to modify the lens! similar to this one: Thanks My current adapter is adjustable in that way... But my other M39-mount rangefinder lenses all line up more-or-less accurately with the adapter ring in its current position. I can buy a second adapter and adjust that ring specifically for this lens, and that's probably what I'll end up doing; it just puzzles me why this particular lens doesn't line up in the same way my others do when mounted. I'm sure it has been modified...

04-30-2017, 10:47 AM	#12
emergo Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Coloroado Photos: Gallery Posts: 271	Originally posted by BigMackCam Thanks My current adapter is adjustable in that way... But my other M39-mount rangefinder lenses all line up more-or-less accurately with the adapter ring in its current position. I can buy a second adapter and adjust that ring specifically for this lens, and that's probably what I'll end up doing; it just puzzles me why this particular lens doesn't line up in the same way my others do when mounted. I'm sure it has been modified... I've found this to be true of my russian lenses and c-mounts that I use. there's no consistency. I just get extra adapters and leave them on the lenses full time. much easier that way.