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05-27-2017, 02:35 AM   #16
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I have to second the
QuoteOriginally posted by IgorZ Quote
Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180 f2.8
(sometimes known as the "Olympia Sonnar" because the original lens was developed for the 1936 Berlin Olympics. It is sharp and fast. I guess it had to be sharp because there was a point being made at those Olympics, Mine is a Pentacon mount Zebra version which I use with an adapter. I believe multi-coated versions were also made. Because of its weight it is not a "walk around" lens. But it is cool just to look at.

05-27-2017, 02:59 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by IgorZ Quote
I only have one lens in that focal length, but it is one of my favourite lenses period. It is Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180 f2.8. I use in with my 645, but the same lens comes with a M42 mount. I've read a few times that it's the best lens ever made. Not sure about that, as I don't know how one can arrive at that conclusion, but I do know that it has the highest keeper rate among all my lenses. Pretty much anything you point this lens at will be rendered beautifully. It's a heavy beast though, probably 1.5kg, so not ideal for travel photography...
Is this the same lens that contains "Jena" descriptive word? In other words, is it the East Germany or Soviet lens, or something else? I am seriously interested in this lens and want to be sure I can get a good copy of the correct lens. Thank you.
05-27-2017, 03:56 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by ivanvernon Quote
Is this the same lens that contains "Jena"
Mine says "Carl Zeiss Jena" and "Sonnar". But what it says depends on when it was made and what markings could be used for certain markets. Some may not say "Sonnar" but just "S". Some may not say "Carl Zeiss Jena" but just "aus Jena" (that is "from Jena"). The Russians took over the running of the Jena factory for a short time after WWII but the lenses were all the original Zeiss formula. For most of the post war years it was state owned by the GDR. If you find a lens with a little "1" in a diamond, that indicates that it was first quality for export markets. This may have been a marking for certain batches. I don't know that every lens was tested and given the mark or not. A lens lacking that symbol is not necessarily of lesser quality. Basically, if it works and it is sharp it's a good lens. My Carl Zeiss Jena 135mm is just marked "S" instead of Sonnar. It doesn't have the "1" symbol but it is absolutely superb in handing and sharpness. It is probably the lens they would have to wrench from my cold, dead hands.

Last edited by PJ1; 05-27-2017 at 04:05 AM. Reason: clarification
05-27-2017, 05:22 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by ivanvernon Quote
Is this the same lens that contains "Jena" descriptive word? In other words, is it the East Germany or Soviet lens, or something else? I am seriously interested in this lens and want to be sure I can get a good copy of the correct lens. Thank you.
Thank you. Also, I do not find any K mount lenses, so I am thinking that M42 mount is the best way to go for use on Pentax cameras.

05-27-2017, 07:00 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by ivanvernon Quote
Is this the same lens that contains "Jena" descriptive word? In other words, is it the East Germany or Soviet lens, or something else? I am seriously interested in this lens and want to be sure I can get a good copy of the correct lens. Thank you.
As PJ1 said, the lens can have different markings and a different look depending on when and where it was made. In part it's because Carl Zeiss factory was split between East and West. Jena was in the east.
05-27-2017, 07:49 AM   #21
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My favourite is the Leitz 200mm f4 Telyt.

It was designed for the old Visoflex reflex housing (to convert a Leica rangefinder into a cludgy SLR) and it needs a stack of adapters and spacers to get it to fit a Pentax or Nikon. I have the regular focusing mount, but I often prefer to use the compact bellows instead for a bit wider focus range.

No autofocus, and you have to manually operate the pre-set aperture (those creepy little arms seen in the photo below might help), but the image quality it delivers makes it all worthwhile.
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05-27-2017, 08:10 AM   #22
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I have a love/hate thing with my Pentax M-200mm f4.

I got it to replace an 80-200 with separating elements, as I loved the way that lens handled. The 200 is the same... wonderful.

But I'm having a hard time getting consistent results out of it. I suspect operator error and the confusion that comes from swapping exposure modes with a lens that doesn't understand what that means...

Generally, though, it gives very good results stopped down to f5.6, and it doesn't require an adapter. I would suggest trying one as they are typically very affordable...

-Eric

05-27-2017, 10:15 AM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by TwoUptons Quote
I have a love/hate thing with my Pentax M-200mm f4.

I got it to replace an 80-200 with separating elements, as I loved the way that lens handled. The 200 is the same... wonderful.

But I'm having a hard time getting consistent results out of it. I suspect operator error and the confusion that comes from swapping exposure modes with a lens that doesn't understand what that means...

Generally, though, it gives very good results stopped down to f5.6, and it doesn't require an adapter. I would suggest trying one as they are typically very affordable...

-Eric
But do not overlook the SMCA 200 f4, which I believe has exactly same optical construction as the "M." Last time I looked the "A" version could be had for around $100 or a bit more if in outstanding condition.
05-27-2017, 12:34 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ontarian50 Quote
My favourite is the Leitz 200mm f4 Telyt.
I own an identical one!
It is said to be much better than the previous f/4.5 version for Leica rangefinders, but i expect it to be somewhat inferior, especially close up, to later optics with internal focusing and special glasses. I also believe that the diaphragm ring is a great equalizer At f/8 or f/11 the best vintage lenses are on par with more modern optical designs, resolution wise... and contrast can be pulled up in PP.
I still haven't tried it on my K-1, though. I will when i go home...
For those interested, there is a way to adapt it to PK mount. Easy to mount/unmount, and can work in Aperture Priority mode.
It is done using an OUBIO ring, plus a leitaxed "Viso M to Leica-R" 14167 adapter ring.
The same way i'm using the Summicron Canada 2/90mm i have with me, or the Elmarit 2.8/135mm i have at home.
For those willing to know about the details, it's all here:
Summicron 2/90 Canada + 14167 R adapter + Leitax ring. Anybody tried this mod? - PentaxForums.com

As Ontarian50 already stirred the pond... well, i'm curious to know if anybody else has a M42/T2/adapted tele (around 180/200mm) that still performs very well on recent sensors. I'm more interested in full frame, cause a 200mm is still an "everyday lens" on the larger sensor, but of course feel free to post your experiences, whatever they are.

cheers

Paolo
05-27-2017, 04:11 PM   #25
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Two of 'em. Unfortunately old eyes an' manual focus issues have relegated 'em to the pasture now. Both Tamron Adaptalls: the 180/2.5 (63B) and the 80-200/2.8 (30A).

Until the last few years if I could only own three lenses the AD-2 80-200/2.8 I owned would've been one of 'em. It matched the 180/2.8 in every practical sense except compact size and weight vs. utility.

Today the AF 90 macro (with a 1.4 TC as needed) and the AF 70-210 serve in their stead -- but it just isn't as satisfying.
06-02-2017, 09:19 AM   #26
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These days i'm using a great 180mm.
It sat for long time in a drawer, cause it was not the best focal for APS-C, and was too slow for low light use.
It is the Sigma Apo Macro 5.6/180mm. It was released in 1993, and was later made in AF mount too.
AFAIK the Pentax version was sold in MF version only.
On my K-1 is proving to be exceptional.
Only one limit: speed. Only one defect: the "Zen finish" has become goo-ish close to the diaphragm ring, where i used to hold the lens between my fingers (to support the camera or mount/unmount the objective).
Probably the last time i used it (in the woods) my sweat was acidic, or my fingers got in contact with some stuff that later attacked the non-slip, matte finish that protects the barrel. Sigma used it for a certain time, i remember.
The problem is not unknown, many Zen finish lenses are showing this kind of decay of the rubber coating.
If anyone has found a way to fix/harden the surface, making it less sticky without also removing the silkscreened markings, it would be a great information. Sharing it would help others in the same situation.
Fortunately my lens is not a mess, just a little sticky close to the diaphragm ring, while the rubber of the focusing ring is still fine.
All in all the problem is more psychological than practical... but it's a good reminder to always wipe the lens with a microfiber cloth after use, if it will be stored for some time!
Optically the lens is simply amazing, considering its age:
- sharp wide open, VERY sharp at f/8
- no CA at all, even in high contrast areas
- nice bokeh
In my experience, not all macros have a nice OOF rendition. For example, my Sigma EX DG Macro 2.8/50mm has a terrible bokeh, in my opinion.
The lens is very small for its focal, and very ergonomic to use (it's a PKA).
The only limitations are the macro range (1:2) and the speed (f/5.6).

It's an uncommon lens, but if you happen to find one, i suggest to give it a try. At close range it's the best 180/200mm i tried on the full frame.
Unfortunately i like low light photography, so my new Tamron 180mm will likely have more chances to illuminate the sensor of my K-1.
I don't expect the Tamron to outperform the Sigma Macro at mid diaphragms, though.
Anybody else owns this Sigma?

cheers

Paolo

Last edited by cyberjunkie; 06-02-2017 at 09:29 AM.
06-03-2017, 09:09 AM   #27
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It appears the Zen finish (and other faux rubberized textures applied to some cameras at that time) does deteriorate no matter what you do. I don't think wiping it off after use would have helped much. The polymer just breaks down with time.

If handling were much of a factor then those cameras/lenses that had that junk applied to them would have got sticky in areas of high contact, and not sticky where you don't touch much. But the whole thing goes gooey in a pretty uniform way, from what I've seen.

Anyway, the only thing I've found that gets rid of the stickies is to mix up a solution of TSP and warm water, and with a cloth, rub and rub until things improve. TSP is a powder sold here in the paint departments of hardware stores - tri-sodium phosphate - and is a strong cleaner to help get wallpaper residue off walls, among other things.

However, I don't hold much hope for the silk screened markings painted on top of the rubberized finish. But having tried all manner of cleaners and solvents on those "Zen" type finishes, TSP is the only thing I've found that had any effect.
06-06-2017, 11:15 AM   #28
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Did you stripe off the coating, or just remove the stickiness leaving some rubberized coating in place?

Regarding the reasons for the decay, i'm not sure it's independent from what the lens is exposed to.
Some lenses get sticky, other don't. Same model, same age.
I have an older Zen finish lens that is still fine, and my Apo Macro 180mm is sticky only in a very small area, which more or less corresponds to the place where my fingers routinely held the lens. All the rest of the barrel is still fine.Most of the unaffected area has been protected for all the time the lens was left unused, by the large hood that was mounted (reversed) on the lens itself. When i was not shooting, i always left the hood fitted that way. It could have prevented ontact with my fingers, and also avoided any contact with the nylon lens case that contained the lens.

cheers

Paolo
06-07-2017, 06:59 AM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by cyberjunkie Quote
Did you stripe off the coating, or just remove the stickiness leaving some rubberized coating in place?
The times I've done this cleaning, some semblance of the original rubberized texture remains. For instance, Nikon F80s (15+ year old film camera) and cousins have this spray-on texture on the handgrips and back doors. Rubbing TSP solution for some minutes gets rid of the tackiness but doesn't wreck the underlying texture.

This finish has been used on a host of other things beside Sigma lenses. If it degrades to the point where you feel you can scrape it off with a fingernail, then it's probably too far gone to rescue.

But I agree that the degradation is inconsistent. You can find two same-age cameras or lenses that differ in how they've degraded over time. Heat, humidity, handling, and even the vapours associated with camera bag liners likely all have some impact on how the finish holds up over time.
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