[callumross]

Hi all,

I recently bought a Jupiter 9 on eBay which was supposed to be in terrible condition, but turns out it just required some standard CLA. Luckily as it is M42 and not the complicated M39 variety it was easy to take apart and fix up.

Only problem remaining is the focus is still pretty stiff despite cleaning and regreasing the helicoid. I've even greased all moving parts where I think there is metal-on-metal contact, so mainly the inside of the body where the whole lens group moves up and down.

There's also a big chunk taken out of the side of the focus ring due to aluminium corrosion. Not a big deal, I've scraped away the corrosion but it just doesn't look all that pleasant. Thinking of crafting a little wooden focussing tab to stick on there.

Anyway, I was hoping someone on here might know what area I'm missing with regards to the stiff focus. Cheers

[BigMackCam]

Hello and welcome

Daft question, but how well did you clean the helicoids? Lenses like the Industar-50 have big threads with large tolerances, and even basic cleaning and re-lubricating will get them working well again. Other lenses have much shallower, tighter helicoids where you really need to get rid of every last bit of congealed lubricant and debris. I use a a stiff toothbrush and hot water plus washing up liquid to scrub helicoids clean, and wooden cocktail sticks to prize out any hardened grease from the threads. Also, what type of lubricant are you using? It shouldn't be too viscous. Also, you want only a small amount of lubricant on the threads. I normally apply a thin amount to both helicoids, then wipe my finger over the top of the threads to remove all of the lubricant except for what's actually in the grooves.

[stevebrot]

Also, what type of lubricant are you using? It shouldn't be too viscous. Also, you want only a small amount of lubricant on the threads. I normally apply a thin amount to both helicoids, then wipe my finger over the top of the threads to remove all of the lubricant except for what's actually in the grooves.

What he said ^ ^ ^

MicroLubrol Helimax-XP comes highly recommended. I have a small tub but have not yet gotten to actually using it. On deck for a relube are my 2007 J-8 (yes, overly-stiff straight from the factory), Helios 44M, 1962 J-8 (Contax/Kiev) and a couple Carl Zeiss Jena lenses in Exakta mount. Yes, I am a glutton for punishment.

MicroLubrol - Ultra Performance Lubricants - Optical Helicoid Grease

(...no relation to MicroLubrol...)


Steve

[BigMackCam]

MicroLubrol Helimax-XP comes highly recommended. I have a small tub but have not yet gotten to actually using it. On deck for a relube are my 2007 J-8 (yes, overly-stiff straight from the factory), Helios 44M, 1962 J-8 (Contax/Kiev) and a couple Carl Zeiss Jena lenses in Exakta mount.

I've been using a good marine-grade white lithium / zinc-oxide grease which is great for deeper helicoids, but not so good for shallower, multiple threads - no hysteresis, but a bit too much resistance.

Funnily enough, I recently took delivery of a decent quantity of Helimax-XP, but haven't got round to decanting it into small tubs - because I haven't actually bought the small tubs yet

Like you, I have a bunch of lenses waiting to be serviced - several M39 and M42 Helios 44-2 variants, several Industar-50 and 50-2's, a lovely old M39 Jupiter-9, a Telear-H 3.5/200, an MTO-1000 and... I can't remember now, but a few. All Soviet, all victims of Soviet congealed "ear-wax" grease I may do one of the Industar-50's with XP tomorrow

Yes, I am a glutton for punishment.

I can relate to that. Oh, how I can relate...

[stevebrot]

If you want something you can buy in your local hardware store, "Super Lube" Multi Purpose is a nice stable synthetic that is very inexpensive. Viscosity is somewhere between the light Nyogel and the Micro-Lubrol. Adding a drop or two of a PTFE adjuvant like Tri-Flow might help as well.

Thanks for the additional options. I had wondered about adding Tri-Flow to hardware store white lithium and might give that a try someday too. Which Nyogel spec grease do you use? (There are about ten different formulations.)


Steve

[BigMackCam]

I'd skip the Micro-Lubrol. Waaaay Waaaay, ridiculously way too thick for camera lens helicals. Think telescope or binocular applications.

I'm surprised you say that, Brian (not that I doubt it - Heaven knows you have the experience). I've only rub-tested it between my fingers and it feels rather like a very light cold-cream - much lighter than the white lithium zinc-oxide grease I've put up with so far, and I've been fairly happy with that on some of the lenses I've done. As I mentioned above, it's too heavy for multiple shallow threads and those with very close tolerances, but I was hoping the XP would be a big improvement. It feels like it should be, but... you've got me worried now

[BigMackCam]

I'm wondering if they reformulated. Last I tried it was a couple of years ago. Very sticky stuff, almost like fork grease.

They must have done. I swear, this stuff isn't sticky at all. It's like sun-burn lotion or make-up remover.. er, not that I know what that feels like, of course, being a guy

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Last edited by BigMackCam; 08-01-2017 at 01:06 PM.

[stevebrot]

I'm actually using the Molykote 44 at the moment. For the Nyogel, maybe a 744 or so? 774 if you want to go a little thicker.

Just be careful with the Tri-Flow, as too much can lead to migration problems. The stuff goes where it wants to go. A small amount mixed in a thicker grease usually keep sit in one place.

---------- Post added 08-01-17 at 12:36 PM ----------



I'm wondering if they reformulated. Last I tried it was a couple of years ago. Very sticky stuff, almost like fork grease.

Mine is as BigMackCam described...like cold cream.


Steve

[IgorZ]

I'm actually using the Molykote 44 at the moment. For the Nyogel, maybe a 744 or so? 774 if you want to go a little thicker.

Just be careful with the Tri-Flow, as too much can lead to migration problems. The stuff goes where it wants to go. A small amount mixed in a thicker grease usually keep sit in one place.

---------- Post added 08-01-17 at 12:36 PM ----------



I'm wondering if they reformulated. Last I tried it was a couple of years ago. Very sticky stuff, almost like fork grease.

Would Molykote 55 work? That's what Amazon has at the moment... and it's far easier to buy from them, than from the manufacturer...

[Not a Number]

I've used the MicroLubrol on 4 lenses and a telescope. I don't find it too stiff at all. If anything the telescope is a bit softer what I remember of the original grease. Which is actually better as the helicoid has a very long throw. It all comes to down personal preferences any way.

[callumross]

Hi all,

I cleaned the helicoid as well as I could with toothpicks, toothbrush, tiny bit of lighter fluid on a q-tip. I'm using Castrol LM grease, it's lithium based. It did a good job for my Industar-50 (m39 slr mount) but that was alot easier as the helicoid fully unscrews. The Jupiter 9 helicoid does not unscrew fully from the body though, so perhaps there's lots of hardened grease I can't get to. If so does anyone know how I can unscrew it all the way? Cheers for all your tips

Whilst you're here, here's a quick test shot I took with the lens mounted on my ME Super whilst trying out Fomapan 100:



... and a picture of the unfortunate corrosion on an otherwise almost-mint body:



(apologies, the weird glow effect is due to my Moto G 2015's HDR mode which I forgot to switch off)

[callumross]

If you are doing a lot of these lenses, I'd seriosuly consider investing in an ultrasonic cleaner. You can get a 2L unit which should be large enough for most lens jobs from eBay UK for about 70 quid shipped.

Once you've tried one, you'll wonder how you ever lived without it. These things take off every last bit of hardened grease. Just avoid putting external parts in with anything but plain water or a mix the gentlest detergent, since it can actually take off engraving paint and cause discoloration in anodized surfaces.

Nice soap bubbles, BTW.

Not sure I do enough to warrant buying an ultrasonic cleaner. This Jupiter 9 is definitely the worse condition lens I've bought but I knew that when I bought it. That said, the price I paid for it plus £70 would probably still be less than even an ok-condition goes for now.

I take it those things are only useful if you can isolate the parts you want to clean? As I said, I can't full unscrew the Jupiter 9 helicoid which is the main obstacle.

Also cheers, I wanted a good sharpness / bokeh test so chose some small flowers with a string of fairy-lights in the background. I can't deduce much about sharpness as the grain of fomapan 100 adds a sort of sharpness illusion to anything from what I've found, but the white flowers I set the focus are glowing which I quite the look of. Probably wouldn't work well in colour.

[IgorZ]

I've no experience with it, but it appears to be an o ring grease. If using it, I'd avoid getting it on rubber grips, etc, since it might loosen them.

Here's a small tub of 44 light on Amazon for $4.95. Not sure about shipping to Canada, though.

https://www.amazon.com/Corning-Molykote-Silicone-Temperature-Consistency/dp/...ds=molykote+44

Thanks for the link. I picked some 44 from Ebay... Have a few lenses waiting for it

[stevebrot]

... and a picture of the unfortunate corrosion on an otherwise almost-mint body:

Corrosion? I don't think so. That lens appears to have have been dropped, which may explain the stiffness you are encountering and the problem fully disassembling the focus helicoid.


Steve

[callumross]

Corrosion? I don't think so. That lens appears to have have been dropped, which may explain the stiffness you are encountering and the problem fully disassembling the focus helicoid.


Steve

I hadn't even thought of that as the seller only said that it was corrosion, but you're probably right. I don't think it's the cause of the stiffness though as the only damage is to the focus ring which came off with no difficulties.