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12-23-2017, 12:48 AM   #31
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Don't write off the DFA15-30. It is a superb lens for tight indoor spaces



01-03-2018, 03:06 PM   #32
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Hi again everyone, in case anyone wondered what I decided to do, it's not much at the moment, I'm not "sold" on anything yet...

What has happened is that I got a used plastic fantastic 35 and tried it out for christmas, and while not the zoom I want and also a bit to narrow FOV, it's has more of what I want in IQ =) (I know, not fair comparing primes to zooms, but we're talking less than 1/10th the price of a new 24-70 DFA).

I also got a used Tamron 28-75, a copy which seems a tad decentered, but even with the "good" edge and corner I'm doubtful after just doing some test shots (possibly can be better if a good copy, will give it a shot later on for real pictures and not just test shots).

And after re-reading the DFA24-70 PF article/review (with the political-wording-and-pro-pentax-sentiment-filter-glasses on), I still lean towards that I could be content with it for IQ, but not IQ+price factored in at the moment, more like $6-700 or so would satisfy that.

Maybe I was spoiled by the "prime-ness" of my DA 12-24, but for now I'm thinking I'll "bite the bullet" and go prime and perhaps cropping when needed..using the DA as a 24 prime or copped when that FOV is needed, plastic fantastic 35 (most of the time for "normal" indoors I guess), and F1.7 50 for when a bit more space is available and more portrait-ish cases (and above that tamron 70-200 or F*4.5 300). I'll miss some shots no doubt due having the wrong focal length mounted, but on the other hand I'll get more pics that will put a smile on my face when pp:ing, and being a hobby, that's maybe more important =).

So that's probably it for now, maybe try FA 24-50 or 24-90 if I see a good deal, but other than that wait/dream about a 24-70-ish star lens or if some third party decide the K1 made it worth releaseing something new/better/price-vs-IQ-better for pentax (not getting my hopes up too much on that).

---------- Post added 01-03-2018 at 11:08 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Sandy Hancock Quote
Don't write off the DFA15-30. It is a superb lens for tight indoor spaces
I believe so! But only the 24-30-part would be of great interest to me, and not "fix" my want to not to have to change lens between 24 and 35/50 (or even 70 if possible), and when being so expensive, it's not realistically that interesting for now I'm afraid. (Also, the PF article says purple fringing is non-existent on the 15-30, but isn't that what is seen (even on this downsized version) on the left rock in that image? At f9!?)

Last edited by Igor123; 01-03-2018 at 03:14 PM.
01-03-2018, 03:33 PM   #33
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If you really want the 24-70 f/2.8 range keep an eye out for the Sigma 24-70 f/2.8 EX HSM. I have one. it's great.
01-03-2018, 03:56 PM   #34
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After reading your current thoughts have you thought about F/FA 17-38 Fisheye?

SMC Pentax-F 17-28mm F3.5-4.5 Fish-Eye Reviews - F Zoom Lenses - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database

Another option: the FA 28mm f/2.8 (better than the 35mm in terms of FOV I'm sure given your statements about 35mm being too narrow). Lighter than the 15-30 by leaps and bounds.

Final option: FA* 28-70 - not as sexy as the 24-70 nor as wide but very nice reputation and in the price range you quoted I think.

01-03-2018, 04:16 PM   #35
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Igor123,

Very interesting thread that I only just came across. I'm in a similar situation. I have a K-1 and the Pentax 28-105, which is a fine lens. But I want something wider, while continuing to keep and use the 28-105 as a sterling walk around lens. I also have a Pentax 12-24mm lens that I use on my K10D and K-5. This lens is / has been phenomenal. It has spoiled me and is the lens that I compare all other wide angles. What I want is a faster (say F2.8) 12-24, but full frame lens.

The 24-70 F 2.8 Tamron/Pentax has not got me impressed enough to go out and buy one. The 15-30 yes, but boy is it pricey, not saying it's not worth it, but....

I hope thie thread keeps on rolling. Think a lot of Pentaxians are facing a similar decision. What to do.
01-04-2018, 12:46 PM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by UncleVanya Quote
After reading your current thoughts have you thought about F/FA 17-38 Fisheye?

SMC Pentax-F 17-28mm F3.5-4.5 Fish-Eye Reviews - F Zoom Lenses - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database

Another option: the FA 28mm f/2.8 (better than the 35mm in terms of FOV I'm sure given your statements about 35mm being too narrow). Lighter than the 15-30 by leaps and bounds.

Final option: FA* 28-70 - not as sexy as the 24-70 nor as wide but very nice reputation and in the price range you quoted I think.
Thanks for the tips, but I'm not sure:

I never liked fisheyes, and even if I did the sharpness reviews don't seem to be that great?

The FA prime would maybe be better FL than the 35 plastic (and hopefully as good IQ), but won't solve the "whole" thing (that I want a great zoom in the 24-35 range to avoid swapping lenses and missing shots due to that, and preferably to 50 or even 70mm). If I happen to find the 28 at a good price it would be interesting to try it as an alternative/improvement of the current "role" the 35 plays for me now.

The FA* might be in that price range, but that price range was for a lens with the DFA IQ/properties...even if the FA has a bit better IQ, WR is worth about $100 to me, and that 24-28 part means a lot of shots/lens swaps so another $150 off in my book, so then I'm not sure my would-by-price is still in the price range of the FA* =).

I know, I'm being difficult, but I would pay even more than the current DFA price, IF it was a bit better and achieved *-level IQ (mainly thinking edges/corners), and perhaps some more metal instead of plastic =), since that would mean I could forget about that FL range altogether for a good number of years at least...but the options available today are all a compromise in some way, hence this thread. But as I said before, I probably wouldn't think about it that much if actually getting and using it, but in my mind it wouldn't be the endgame lens I want, and then the current price is a bit high for me for a non-endgame lens.

But don't get me wrong, I always appreciate good suggestions!
01-04-2018, 02:43 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by Igor123 Quote
Thanks for the tips, but I'm not sure:



The FA prime would maybe be better FL than the 35 plastic (and hopefully as good IQ), but won't solve the "whole" thing (that I want a great zoom in the 24-35 range to avoid swapping lenses and missing shots due to that, and preferably to 50 or even 70mm). If I happen to find the 28 at a good price it would be interesting to try it as an alternative/improvement of the current "role" the 35 plays for me now.

I know, I'm being difficult, but I would pay even more than the current DFA price, IF it was a bit better and achieved *-level IQ (mainly thinking edges/corners), and perhaps some more metal instead of plastic =), since that would mean I could forget about that FL range altogether for a good number of years at least...but the options available today are all a compromise in some way, hence this thread. But as I said before, I probably wouldn't think about it that much if actually getting and using it, but in my mind it wouldn't be the endgame lens I want, and then the current price is a bit high for me for a non-endgame lens.

But don't get me wrong, I always appreciate good suggestions!
It's all good. You aren't being difficult. I pointed to the fisheye because the reviewer used it with his k-1 and the images looked good. You might reach out directly to see if you could get some full size samples to satisfy yourself three lens won't work. Like other fisheye zooms it has a reputation for being less fishy in the long end.

In the end I hope you find a good balance, I'm no expert, I'm using s k-3 and valuing crop sensor sized lenses too much so far to change.
01-04-2018, 03:04 PM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by lesmore49 Quote
Igor123,

Very interesting thread that I only just came across. I'm in a similar situation. I have a K-1 and the Pentax 28-105, which is a fine lens. But I want something wider, while continuing to keep and use the 28-105 as a sterling walk around lens. I also have a Pentax 12-24mm lens that I use on my K10D and K-5. This lens is / has been phenomenal. It has spoiled me and is the lens that I compare all other wide angles. What I want is a faster (say F2.8) 12-24, but full frame lens.

The 24-70 F 2.8 Tamron/Pentax has not got me impressed enough to go out and buy one. The 15-30 yes, but boy is it pricey, not saying it's not worth it, but....
You've pretty much answered your own question: a faster 12-24 in full frame is the 15-30. And yes, it's not cheap, but I've certainly found it to be worth it.
What I'd like is a small, sharp, all-weather, autofocus 20mm to pair with the 28-105 for travel and hiking.

01-05-2018, 12:01 AM   #39
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I guess there is no "endgame", and very likely there will never be, even if we limit our consideration to mature technologies.
Some CRT monitors, now abandoned, were the best of their breed, like certain Eizo models, and AFAIK are still the benchmark in the graphic business, but were released at the very end of the life span of the technology.
Endothermic engines are another example. They are not doomed (not yet at least) but they are a very mature technology, nevertheless fuel consumption and performance are getting better every year.
If you are looking for the very best, I'm afraid no solution will ever be definitive.
If you are concerned about absolute sharpness - I am not, thanks Chaos there is some variety in this world, but if I were in your shoes I would wait till you are perfectly fine buying an expensive item, pass on the DFA, and do the same thing I've done for different reasons/purposes: find a nice second-hand Sigma HSM 24-70.
It lacks WR, but it's in the same league as the DFA, IQ wise, and with the latest firmware works great with the AF of the K-1. I use it as a complement to the primes, in some circumstances, or when I want to go out with just one camera + one lens.

Regarding Sigma modern high end zooms, according to personal experience is better to thoroughly test them after the purchase, especially if second-hand.
The lens could look mint, and be seriously out of whack. A strong knock on the front of the objective is enough to bend the plastic focusing and/or the zoom sleeve inside the barrel, without leaving any external trace.
For a number of reasons, I often have a new purchase shipped elsewhere, and sometimes it takes months before I can actually check the item. It has always worked fine buying old MF lenses on Ebay, only a couple of times they were beyond (economically viable) repair, but I've been burned twice buying expensive, high-end AF zooms.
Pictures tell a lot about old manual lenses, but modern zooms can be defective even when esthetically impeccable.
I'm not an expert, but I am afraid that all high-end zooms are made more or less the same, no matter the brand.
The pictures on lensrentals.com confirm that, and the kind of damage they have to deal with is for the most part similar to what I personally found.

I guess we'll never see an all-metal AF zoom in the future, because of cost and weight issues. Better pet our zooms without getting too anal, and use a robust prime if we are afraid the lens could get a beating

Cheers

Paolo



01-05-2018, 05:07 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by lesmore49 Quote
Igor123,

Very interesting thread that I only just came across. I'm in a similar situation. I have a K-1 and the Pentax 28-105, which is a fine lens. But I want something wider, while continuing to keep and use the 28-105 as a sterling walk around lens. I also have a Pentax 12-24mm lens that I use on my K10D and K-5. This lens is / has been phenomenal. It has spoiled me and is the lens that I compare all other wide angles..
Hint: Put the 12-24 on your K-1 ... fine from 17mm onwards. You may have saved yourself a lot of money.
01-05-2018, 07:40 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
Hint: Put the 12-24 on your K-1 ... fine from 17mm onwards. You may have saved yourself a lot of money.
Thanks I'm going to try that. I was told on the forum that if I put a ASP-C lens , like the 12-24, even if I put the camera internal setting on full frame, not use the framed in the viewfinder, ASP-C setting that I will only get 15 mps, not the full benefit of the 36. something full frame sensor . Is this true ?

I'm not very technical.

Les
01-05-2018, 08:35 PM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by lesmore49 Quote
I was told on the forum that if I put a ASP-C lens , like the 12-24, even if I put the camera internal setting on full frame, not use the framed in the viewfinder, ASP-C setting that I will only get 15 mps, not the full benefit of the 36. something full frame sensor . Is this true ?
Nope. Don't believe everything you read on the internet. If you put the camera in 'crop' mode then yes, 15MP. But in full frame mode you get the 36MP. However, if the lens does not cover the full frame sensor entirely the edges might vignette. I've not tried the 12-24 but if Clackers says it works from 17mm up then the vignetting will be minimal between 17 and 24 and noticeable from 12 to 17mm. But regardless of how dark the edges are it will still be a 36MP image.
01-05-2018, 08:45 PM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
Nope. Don't believe everything you read on the internet. If you put the camera in 'crop' mode then yes, 15MP. But in full frame mode you get the 36MP. However, if the lens does not cover the full frame sensor entirely the edges might vignette. I've not tried the 12-24 but if Clackers says it works from 17mm up then the vignetting will be minimal between 17 and 24 and noticeable from 12 to 17mm. But regardless of how dark the edges are it will still be a 36MP image.
That's great. Thank you for that info. I couldn't understand how the ASP-C lens would only be @ 15 mp, when the camera was set at full frame.
01-06-2018, 12:20 AM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by lesmore49 Quote
That's great. Thank you for that info. I couldn't understand how the ASP-C lens would only be @ 15 mp, when the camera was set at full frame.
The problem is that there are DA lenses that barely cover anything outside of the crop frame, something like those would effectively give no more than the 15mp in crop mode. The images would be 36mp pictures with a lot of black surrounding the crop area. Other crop lenses do a good job covering outside of the crop frame and can deliver the full 36mp. Some like the 12-24 cover adequately only within a portion of the zoom range.
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