[Kunzite]

The D FA*'s full price is $1,796.95, sorry for not mentioning it. The other lens with a discount is the Canon - full price $2,099.00.

[awscreo]

That's precisely what I said, but let me make it a little clearer: don't make the K-1, Pentax! Nobody would buy your 2000 euro camera!

What is desperately (IMHO) needed is the ring type SDM which can be introduced only in high end lenses. What is needed is regaining their reputation as a lens maker; I remember claims that Pentax could not possibly make high-end optics, unlike Sigma - let's not forget the endless claims that every new Pentax lens is a rebadged something. That's absurd, and must be put to an end.
And if high spenders looking at the K-mount system would rather have a high-end 50mm than the film era FA, who are we to say they're wrong?

---------- Post added 05-01-18 at 06:28 PM ----------


Let me challenge that claim. After a brief visit on B&H's website:
1. Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 70-200mm f/2.8E FL ED VR Lens 100th Anniversary Edition - $3,999.95
2. Sony 70-200mm f/2.8 G SSM II Lens - $2,998.00
3. Sony FE 70-200mm f/2.8 GM OSS Lens - $2,598.00
4. Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 70-200mm f/2.8E FL ED VR Lens - $2,796.95
5. Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II Lens - $2,096.95
6. Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II USM Lens - $1,899.00
7. Pentax HD PENTAX D FA* 70-200mm f/2.8 ED DC AW Lens - $1,596.95

As for the other part - did anyone said, and presented proof that it's optically worse?

Since it's the best 70-200 available for the system, I'd say it's not that important how it stacks up to other systems, can't stick those on a K mount anyway)) Hope I can upgrade to the DFA sometime in future, if only for build quality and silent af (I'm sure it's optically much better than older 70-200's available in K mount).

[Mikesul]

I think that the fact that those planning to buy the lens seems to stay at around 20% is not a bad sign of possible sales. Did 20% of us buy the 70-200 or the 150-450 when they were introduced? In time a higher percentage will pick it up if it lives up to expectations.

[Rondec]

I have yet to see definite answer to that. I have noticed no one says it's better, when discussing the lens. And you quoted the discounted price. To bad you didn't do the undiscounted price of each lens, while you were at it. But hey, good to know, my apologies for not looking these up myself before posting.

I don't understand why the "retail price" of the lens matters. Would you pay that if you can get the lens cheaper? The question is more one of street prices and as such they are an equal comparison.

[lesmore49]

I never buy anything on first release. I think it's unwise. I usually wait for about a year, maybe more. See how things go with the new product, see if there are any 'pattern' problems, see how well it performs, how durable it is. I avoid succumbing to the newest, latest, greatest...avoid the hype of something new, something shiny...wait till a few miles roll over on someone else's odometer.

The K-1 had been out for a year before I bit the bullet. In that time I checked on all the info I could, before making the final, informed decision.

[jatrax]

I think that the fact that those planning to buy the lens seems to stay at around 20% is not a bad sign of possible sales. Did 20% of us buy the 70-200 or the 150-450 when they were introduced?

Agree. In fact 20% is about what I expected for a 'good' result. 20% of Pentax Forum translates into maybe 3 to 5% of Pentax users generally and that is likely to result in adequate sales for such a niche lens.

[wed7]

if only the other wider primes were released first, I am preety sure there will be more than 20% interest we can see here.

[jatrax]

if only the other wider primes were released first, I am preety sure there will be more than 20% interest we can see here.

I believe that is true. While there are a number of adequate lenses in the 50mm range already available there are very, very few in the wider range. So just from the number of choices already available the interest in a 20mm or 24mm prime would have been higher.

I think RIcoh chose the 50mm as the manufacturing prototype. The DFA primes are going to be something entirely new. New materials, new designs, new optics, new manufacturing processes, new design software. Something had to go first and 50mm is a relatively easy focal length to design for. And easy to test performance against. So the 50mm goes out first and is used to evaluate their new processes. I suspect follow up lenses will have a shorter design time because they will be using the design and build path already pioneered by the DFA 50mm.

[normhead]

if only the other wider primes were released first, I am preety sure there will be more than 20% interest we can see here.

That's 20% of the voters who actually voted. There are probably a lot who care so little about a 50 1.4 they didn't even click on the link. There simply is no way to interpret this, except to say as far as we can tell, Pentax is making this lens for 29 people.

I'm guessing it's closer to 29 out of 1000 or 2.9 percent. Or are we guessing that everyone who owns cameras from a K-x, to K-30s etc are going to buy this lens. My guess is, a very small number of K-1 users and an even smaller number of crop body users will be interested.

2 out of 2 camera store owners I recently discussed this with agree.

The only way I look at this lens at all is if the optical quality is so good it presents a clear advantage over my other 50s. I actually aha Tak 50 1.4 that was given to me by a guy who bought a camera from me, and have used it exactly once.

This is s specialty lens. Not the kind of lens where you worry much about the overall consumer response to it. My guess is if 250 people buy it in the first year, Pentax will be happy. It's along term project in terms of break even. It's not like every new K-1 owner is going to rush out and buy one, or it's ever going to be sold as a kit lens.

I'm not even saying I won't buy one ever. But it's going to have to be one heck of a lens in terms of optical quality. I have n FA 50 1.7 and the FA 50 macro, and a number of Tak 50s. It's less than a half stop faster than my 1.7 so it's going to have to be unmatchable IQ.

[BarryE]

That's 20% of the voters who actually voted. There are probably a lot who care so little about a 50 1.4 they didn't even click on the link. There simply is no way to interpret this, except to say as far as we can tell, Pentax is making this lens for 29 people.

It's less than a half stop faster than my 1.7 so it's going to have to be unmatchable IQ.

I do wonder what an 'unmatchable IQ' actually needs to be.

With the characteristics of the DFA 50 mm macro sharp across the frame, the new lens is unlikely to be so much better in those terms, considering price and size. Of course it would be better constructed, but is that where the value will be ? No.

Or maybe it has pixie dust, which to me is the FA Limiteds ability to create the 3d effect. This is achieved, in many ways to not being flat across the frame a characteristic that is less popular nowadays I'd guess. So the new lens isn't likely to have this (and the FA Limiteds other quirks).

Yes the new lens will be quick to focus and ii is a fast lens. It will be heavy (likely) and larger than many that have gone before.

No doubt it will look good on the resolution charts from wide to narrow, which is a selling point. But so much better than the DFA macro ?? Will it have a special characteristic like the Limiteds ? No, as this lens is a starting point for a range of new designs, so no room for quirkiness. Therefore, where's the space for any 'unmatched IQ' ?

I'm not being negative, as Ricoh probably need to create a range of modern lenses that shine out and attract attention. This 50 is the starter of, hopefully, many to come, modern, reliable, fast and accurate primes. Maybe we should think of it in these terms...

[normhead]

With the characteristics of the DFA 50 mm macro sharp across the frame, the new lens is unlikely to be so much better in those terms, considering price and size. Of course it would be better constructed, but is that where the value will be ? No.

I have seen some numbers for Zeiss lenses I suspect would put them a good 50% sharper than even the 50 macro. The problem for me has been, at the size I'm likely to view the image 2650x 1600, the size of my monitor, sometimes I like the "softer" image better. And the AF is fast, but still not comparable to some other companies.



Thats a pretty big lens compared to my Tak 50 1.4.

[jatrax]

Thats a pretty big lens compared to my Tak 50 1.4.

I think you could put TWO Tak 50 1.4's INSIDE it. With plenty of room for padding.

[Fenwoodian]

.
Will the new Pentax 50mm prime lens sell? Without advertising, what the Internet lens reviewers have to say about this lens will go a long way towards answering that question.

As someone said earlier, this new Pentax prime lens will need to make images at least as good as the best 50's from Sigma and Zeiss. Unfortunately, none of the more popular Internet reviewers are currently reviewing Pentax lenses on the Pentax K1 camera. Also, the Sigma 50mm Art lens is not made in the K mount (nor is is readily adaptable to K mount), and while the Zeiss Milvus 50/1.4 lens is adaptable to the Pentax K mount, I know of no lens reviewers who are currently testing "adapted lenses".

So, without having Interent lens testers being able to make comparative lens tests (and little ability/interest in testing just the new lens itself on a K1) this new Pentax 50mm lens will find it difficult to get initial traction in the marketplace.

[Kunzite]

That's 20% of the voters who actually voted. There are probably a lot who care so little about a 50 1.4 they didn't even click on the link. There simply is no way to interpret this, except to say as far as we can tell, Pentax is making this lens for 29 people.

And there are people who will likely buy this lens but didn't vote - like myself. The requirement to know that you'll buy this lens on release is quite restrictive.

Do you believe the K-1 was exclusively sold to the people here, too?

[normhead]

.
Will the new Pentax 50mm prime lens sell? Without advertising, what the Internet lens reviewers have to say about this lens will go a long way towards answering that question.

As someone said earlier, this new Pentax prime lens will need to make images at least as good as the best 50's from Sigma and Zeiss. Unfortunately, none of the more popular Internet reviewers are currently reviewing Pentax lenses on the Pentax K1 camera. Also, the Sigma 50mm Art lens is not made in the K mount (nor is is readily adaptable to K mount), and while the Zeiss Milvus 50/1.4 lens is adaptable to the Pentax K mount, I know of no lens reviewers who are currently testing "adapted lenses".

So, without the ability to make comparative tests (and little ability/interest in testing just the new lens itself on a K1) this new Pentax 50mm lens will find it difficult to get initial traction in the marketplace.

Since many of us who might be interested in this lens already have have multiple 50s it really has to be as advertised "modern glass to take advantage of modern sensors," and it has to more than just a marketing bi-line.

After all, do i really want to pay $1000 - $2000 for a lens just to have some Zeiss owner get in my face saying "na na an my lens is better". With a ZIess user it might be acceptable, but it damn well better not be a Sigma user. As a brand, and for reputation, they have to be better than Sigma to maintain the perception of higher price for better quality. If they can't do that, this line of 1.4 lenses will be dead in the water.

---------- Post added 01-08-18 at 01:58 PM ----------

Do you believe the K-1 was exclusively sold to the people here, too?

My guess is if 250 people buy it in the first year,

29 forum user want to buy it, my guess was 250 first year sales. That sounds like I'm guessing about 10x more sales with 90% not being forum users, but that is so far out in left field it's more of an uneducated guess, than a prediction. It's my answer to if someone said "We know you don't know anything but if you were to make a wild crazy almost certainly wrong guess what would it be?"

If I had one real sales number from even one Pentax lens, I might change that. We know nothing. We don't know how many lenses Pentax considers the minimum to be a successful production run, we don't know how other lenses have sold in the past. We know essentially nothing.

The only thing we do know is that some time in theist 3 years, Pentax sold their 6 millionth lens. They put it in an advertisement. There was no break down, but my guess is the A-50 ƒ2 is their best selling lens of all time, just based on what I've seen available in the used market and that they came on the cameras sold to so many educational institutions.

As a High school photography teacher I purchased close to 40 of them myself (with my school boards money) , so certainly #1 in my book. There were 17 high schools in my board who ran the same program with the same cameras, I expect it will be years befrore Pentax sells as many k-1 50 1.4 combinations before they match the K1000 50 ƒ2s bought by one of seven school boards in the Greater Toronto area.