85mm FF comparison

Kim Coxon · 10-10-2018, 05:51 AM

Yes there was a slight breeze and yes using live view. I tried to focus on the centre of the flower so there would be OOF highlights both in front and behind. But there was a slight gap between focussing and the photo being taken.
If nothing else, it does show the advantage of manual focus and liveview. It is much easier to get the plane of focus where you want it rather than where the AF system thinks it should be especially when it is so critical to the final photo.
I think it is best highlighted in pic B. The first glance may make it seem a bit softer than the others but when you look at the stamens, that isn't really the case. But in the end, it would have to be a very large print for it to show "on the wall"

Last edited by Kim Coxon; 10-10-2018 at 05:56 AM.

Dericali · 10-10-2018, 06:02 AM

Originally posted by Kim Coxon

Maybe, but I doubt it going from passed "price comparisons". Much will depend on the number of groups elements in the design. I can't see it being only about 9% more than the 50mm.
But we can all dream on.

In Euros the 50mm is 1,200, so 1,500 or 1,600 would be 25%-30% more. (Right now in the UK it's £1,094.80 on Amazon).

I guess 1800 is also possible, but would many people really buy it there or at a price above that?

Update: The Sigma 85mm Art in the Sony mount is at about 1200, so if Pentax wants price theirs at 2000, then the economics of buying the Sony mount lens with a new A7III body are looking pretty good

Kim Coxon · 10-10-2018, 06:29 AM

Originally posted by Dericali

In Euros the 50mm is 1,200, so 1,500 or 1,600 would be 25%-30% more. (Right now in the UK it's £1,094.80 on Amazon).

I guess 1800 is also possible, but would many people really buy it there or at a price above that?

Update: The Sigma 85mm Art in the Sony mount is at about 1200, so if Pentax wants price theirs at 2000, then the economics of buying the Sony mount lens with a new A7III body are looking pretty good

Amazon are cutting the price on the lens. Most dealers are selling it for around £1200 or just under. So yes it might be around £1800 on Amazon.

As to people paying around £2000, I think yes. The Japanese market will and they will buy it at the RRP. Even if it is more.

ChatMechant · 10-10-2018, 07:51 AM

I like the 77 and "C" the best. C seems to have more of a clear, 3d look to it. Maybe it's the Zeiss, I dunno.

**pres589** · 10-10-2018, 08:52 AM

I like A the most.

I wonder how the M 85 f2 would have fared in this test. I quite like mine although I've taken very few shots with it so far.

Kim Coxon · 10-10-2018, 09:04 AM

Originally posted by pres589

I like A the most.

I wonder how the M 85 f2 would have fared in this test. I quite like mine although I've taken very few shots with it so far.

I used to have the 85/2 M. It went when I got the SMC 85/1.8 for good reason. It was not a bad lens, just that the SMC version was much better.

**pres589** · 10-10-2018, 09:31 AM

Understood. What drew me to the M 85 was the small physical size and relatively fast max aperture vs. lenses like the Tamron 90mm f2.5 Adaptall or M 100 f2.8.

What is your favorite 85mm manual prime?

Kim Coxon · 10-10-2018, 10:43 AM

Originally posted by pres589

Understood. What drew me to the M 85 was the small physical size and relatively fast max aperture vs. lenses like the Tamron 90mm f2.5 Adaptall or M 100 f2.8.

What is your favorite 85mm manual prime?

I'll cover my "favourite" later.

Yes, I agree about the size. I do prefer using fixed primes but I'm also getting older and some of the glass today is getting bigger and bigger as well as heavier. I think for size and compactness, it would be hard to beat the 77Ltd even though it is a slightly shorter focal length. Ad to it being AF and it is a very good short primes and like it's 2 siblings, very easy to use manually. The SMC 85/1.8 is not much longer than the 50/1.4's and about the same size 50/1.2.

pinholecam · 10-10-2018, 06:35 PM

Originally posted by Kim Coxon

If the new Pentax 85 is designed along the same parameters as the new 50. It is likely to be very big, probably at least a 77mm filter thread and very expensive. I would guess at least £2000 and probably more.

I'd think likely 82mm

The DFA50/1.4 is bigger in size than the FA*85/1.4.

Originally posted by pres589

I like A the most.

I wonder how the M 85 f2 would have fared in this test. I quite like mine although I've taken very few shots with it so far.

I'd think that the M85/2 will be very poor for these exact wide open shots because it handles highlights, reds and CA poorly wide open.

I like mine a lot though and its probably my most used 85mm lens for the portability and good o/p once I cater for its weaknesses.

**kernos** · 10-10-2018, 09:12 PM

With the new shots, the FA77 and lens A still have a very similar rendering and it is well known that the FA77 and A* have a lot of similarities in design. Lens C has the crudest rendering, so I'm going with the K for C as the oof bokeh on B is nicer. Have to agree with bdery, the FA77 is the nicest rendering with the Lens A next followed by B followed by C.

cyberjunkie · 10-11-2018, 06:48 AM

A is the SMC, it has a visible halo on the lower right corner.
My Auto Takumar 1.8/85mm has more halo, and I like it a lot for portraits.

Guessing about the other two is difficult. It depends on which Zeiss. The ZK? The old Contax one leitaxed?
In the first case I'd say that B is the A* and C the Zeiss.
In the second case it could be the opposite. Because I don't know which Zeiss it is, I stick with my first answer.
Both have not so nice bokeh.
Never tried the Zeiss, but I own the A* since long. Best 85mm of its time, not the best bokeh though.
I had the M 2/85mm long long time ago, across the seventies and the eighties. Not a bad lens but I would get it mostly for collection. The size is its atout. Because of the great size/performance ratio the 4/20mm and the 2/85mm are the only M lenses that really stand out (together with the M* 300mm), and the only ones that I have sold and would be happy to buy back.
The SMC is another interesting lens I would buy, cause it should render quite differently from the Auto Tak, and is also multicoated (better contrast).
If I remember correctly, the design and the speed changed from the Auto to the Super (f/1.9 and one more element), and the Super Multi Coated just introduced the new coating. The SMC Takumar went back to f/1.8 and was substantially the same lens as the one tested.

Now I can read the other posts... I didn't want to be conditioned

cyberjunkie · 11-03-2018, 03:30 PM

The OP forgot to give us the answer!

Kim Coxon · 11-03-2018, 05:10 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by cyberjunkie

The OP forgot to give us the answer!

A is the Pentax 85/1.4A
B is the Zeiss ZK
C is the Pentax 85/1.8 (K)

As most guessed/knew from the character.

10-10-2018, 06:02 AM	#32
Dericali Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: Berlin Posts: 298	Originally posted by Kim Coxon Maybe, but I doubt it going from passed "price comparisons". Much will depend on the number of groups elements in the design. I can't see it being only about 9% more than the 50mm. But we can all dream on. In Euros the 50mm is 1,200, so 1,500 or 1,600 would be 25%-30% more. (Right now in the UK it's £1,094.80 on Amazon). I guess 1800 is also possible, but would many people really buy it there or at a price above that? Update: The Sigma 85mm Art in the Sony mount is at about 1200, so if Pentax wants price theirs at 2000, then the economics of buying the Sony mount lens with a new A7III body are looking pretty good Last edited by Dericali; 10-10-2018 at 06:12 AM.

10-11-2018, 06:48 AM	#41
cyberjunkie Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Chiang Mai, Bologna, Amsterdam Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,198	A is the SMC, it has a visible halo on the lower right corner. My Auto Takumar 1.8/85mm has more halo, and I like it a lot for portraits. Guessing about the other two is difficult. It depends on which Zeiss. The ZK? The old Contax one leitaxed? In the first case I'd say that B is the A* and C the Zeiss. In the second case it could be the opposite. Because I don't know which Zeiss it is, I stick with my first answer. Both have not so nice bokeh. Never tried the Zeiss, but I own the A* since long. Best 85mm of its time, not the best bokeh though. I had the M 2/85mm long long time ago, across the seventies and the eighties. Not a bad lens but I would get it mostly for collection. The size is its atout. Because of the great size/performance ratio the 4/20mm and the 2/85mm are the only M lenses that really stand out (together with the M* 300mm), and the only ones that I have sold and would be happy to buy back. The SMC is another interesting lens I would buy, cause it should render quite differently from the Auto Tak, and is also multicoated (better contrast). If I remember correctly, the design and the speed changed from the Auto to the Super (f/1.9 and one more element), and the Super Multi Coated just introduced the new coating. The SMC Takumar went back to f/1.8 and was substantially the same lens as the one tested. Now I can read the other posts... I didn't want to be conditioned Last edited by cyberjunkie; 10-11-2018 at 07:31 AM.

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10-10-2018, 05:51 AM	#31
Kim Coxon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 135 Original Poster	Yes there was a slight breeze and yes using live view. I tried to focus on the centre of the flower so there would be OOF highlights both in front and behind. But there was a slight gap between focussing and the photo being taken. If nothing else, it does show the advantage of manual focus and liveview. It is much easier to get the plane of focus where you want it rather than where the AF system thinks it should be especially when it is so critical to the final photo. I think it is best highlighted in pic B. The first glance may make it seem a bit softer than the others but when you look at the stamens, that isn't really the case. But in the end, it would have to be a very large print for it to show "on the wall" Last edited by Kim Coxon; 10-10-2018 at 05:56 AM.

10-10-2018, 06:29 AM	#33
Kim Coxon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 135 Original Poster	Originally posted by Dericali In Euros the 50mm is 1,200, so 1,500 or 1,600 would be 25%-30% more. (Right now in the UK it's £1,094.80 on Amazon). I guess 1800 is also possible, but would many people really buy it there or at a price above that? Update: The Sigma 85mm Art in the Sony mount is at about 1200, so if Pentax wants price theirs at 2000, then the economics of buying the Sony mount lens with a new A7III body are looking pretty good Amazon are cutting the price on the lens. Most dealers are selling it for around £1200 or just under. So yes it might be around £1800 on Amazon. As to people paying around £2000, I think yes. The Japanese market will and they will buy it at the RRP. Even if it is more.

10-10-2018, 07:51 AM	#34
ChatMechant Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Matsuyama Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,284	I like the 77 and "C" the best. C seems to have more of a clear, 3d look to it. Maybe it's the Zeiss, I dunno.

10-10-2018, 08:52 AM	#35
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,529	I like A the most. I wonder how the M 85 f2 would have fared in this test. I quite like mine although I've taken very few shots with it so far.

10-10-2018, 09:04 AM	#36
Kim Coxon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 135 Original Poster	Originally posted by pres589 I like A the most. I wonder how the M 85 f2 would have fared in this test. I quite like mine although I've taken very few shots with it so far. I used to have the 85/2 M. It went when I got the SMC 85/1.8 for good reason. It was not a bad lens, just that the SMC version was much better.

10-10-2018, 09:31 AM	#37
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,529	Understood. What drew me to the M 85 was the small physical size and relatively fast max aperture vs. lenses like the Tamron 90mm f2.5 Adaptall or M 100 f2.8. What is your favorite 85mm manual prime?

10-10-2018, 10:43 AM	#38
Kim Coxon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 135 Original Poster	Originally posted by pres589 Understood. What drew me to the M 85 was the small physical size and relatively fast max aperture vs. lenses like the Tamron 90mm f2.5 Adaptall or M 100 f2.8. What is your favorite 85mm manual prime? I'll cover my "favourite" later. Yes, I agree about the size. I do prefer using fixed primes but I'm also getting older and some of the glass today is getting bigger and bigger as well as heavier. I think for size and compactness, it would be hard to beat the 77Ltd even though it is a slightly shorter focal length. Ad to it being AF and it is a very good short primes and like it's 2 siblings, very easy to use manually. The SMC 85/1.8 is not much longer than the 50/1.4's and about the same size 50/1.2.

10-10-2018, 06:35 PM	#39
pinholecam Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: North Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,706	Originally posted by Kim Coxon If the new Pentax 85 is designed along the same parameters as the new 50. It is likely to be very big, probably at least a 77mm filter thread and very expensive. I would guess at least £2000 and probably more. I'd think likely 82mm The DFA50/1.4 is bigger in size than the FA*85/1.4. Originally posted by pres589 I like A the most. I wonder how the M 85 f2 would have fared in this test. I quite like mine although I've taken very few shots with it so far. I'd think that the M85/2 will be very poor for these exact wide open shots because it handles highlights, reds and CA poorly wide open. I like mine a lot though and its probably my most used 85mm lens for the portability and good o/p once I cater for its weaknesses.

10-10-2018, 09:12 PM	#40
kernos Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 456	With the new shots, the FA77 and lens A still have a very similar rendering and it is well known that the FA77 and A* have a lot of similarities in design. Lens C has the crudest rendering, so I'm going with the K for C as the oof bokeh on B is nicer. Have to agree with bdery, the FA77 is the nicest rendering with the Lens A next followed by B followed by C.

11-03-2018, 03:30 PM	#42
cyberjunkie Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Chiang Mai, Bologna, Amsterdam Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,198	The OP forgot to give us the answer!

11-03-2018, 05:10 PM - 1 Like	#43
Kim Coxon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 135 Original Poster	Originally posted by cyberjunkie The OP forgot to give us the answer! A is the Pentax 85/1.4A B is the Zeiss ZK C is the Pentax 85/1.8 (K) As most guessed/knew from the character.