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09-25-2008, 03:08 AM   #16
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Interestingly enough there was a similar thread about this recently and as I said in it, today and almost everyday I still use mainly four fast Pentax A series primes, 50mm f1:1.2, 85mm Green Star f1:1.4 (the one we are talking about here), 135mm Green Star f1:1.8 and my most recently acquired little gem, a 200mm Green Star f1:2.8. ED (there's also a 300mm Green Star f1:4 in the Crumpler, along with all the other stuff).

I consider all these lenses to have superb optical quality, produce the results that I need and are just a joy to use. They are still about to buy, but you do have to pay for them now.

Bodies come and go, glass is forever, well at least with Pentax it is.

09-25-2008, 03:45 AM   #17
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I'd stick to my trusty 77 I think. The 85 is out of my reach. I was just curious since the Canon folks think it's the bees knees and rave on and on about it.

Would love to see comparisons between the Pentax and Zeiss.
09-25-2008, 11:33 AM   #18
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The Canon 85mm f/1.8 is ALMOST as nice as the f/1.2, at a (big) fraction of the price. My copy is probably my favorite lens, and it cost me less than $400. From my limited use of the 77mm Limited, the humble non-L 85mm f/1.8 compares nicely.

Never used the 85mm f/1.2 L, but I have shot with a Nikon 55mm f/1.2 and Pentax A 50mm f/1.2 (very briefly while shooting with carpents). Problem is I suck at manual focus...

And I also shot with carpents' FA* 85mm f/1.4, and that was a really nice lens! I think he still owns it.



Probably my favorite shot from that day -
09-25-2008, 12:07 PM   #19
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I have been using the FA 85/1.4 for many years now and it is simply perfect. You can always hint at the lower contrast or slight edge fall-off when fully open - but it is a super-fast lens and any super-fast lens will show some IQ loss when fully open. And most other fast lenses I know, are at least not better than the FA 85.

If I remember rightly, I read a comment from a seasoned photographer on a pro website a couple of months ago, whoi simply wrote along the line, that all fast 80-85mm lenses from all reputable manufactureres share a very high image quality and it would be very hard to decide, which is best. He did count the Pentax amongst CaNikon. I think, there may be subtle differences in performance, like OOF rendering or contrast across the image, but what is better or slightly worse depends at least at much on the application as on the lens.

Ben

09-25-2008, 05:10 PM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by egordon99 Quote
The Canon 85mm f/1.8 is ALMOST as nice as the f/1.2, at a (big) fraction of the price. My copy is probably my favorite lens, and it cost me less than $400. From my limited use of the 77mm Limited, the humble non-L 85mm f/1.8 compares nicely.

Never used the 85mm f/1.2 L, but I have shot with a Nikon 55mm f/1.2 and Pentax A 50mm f/1.2 (very briefly while shooting with carpents). Problem is I suck at manual focus...

And I also shot with carpents' FA* 85mm f/1.4, and that was a really nice lens! I think he still owns it.
You'all couldn't have oversharpened those a bit more could you of?
09-25-2008, 05:54 PM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
You'all couldn't have oversharpened those a bit more could you of?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wheatfield

One of the reasons that I left other photographic forums is the amount of non-productive carping that went on in those forums..

Let me be clear..

There is a nice way & an ugly way to say anything, whether in person face-to-face, or when typing a post over the internet..

If you were going to be critical of egordon99's photo's, then why did you not do so in a more constructive way..

All that your post does is to make a fellow Pentaxian feel worse, without offering him constructive criticism in how you feel that his photos might be improved..

Bruce
09-25-2008, 05:56 PM   #22
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Sharpening in post processing is an art itself. Not easy to do it in a subtle way.

Most of the time, selective sharpening or USM sharpening does not give the effect intended where a lot of attention and time are needed to on each image to give the desirable sharpening.

It is not something like clicking on the Filter-sharpen or whatever the sub-option is, rendering sharpening halo in an image as sharp.

A good lens is like a chef's knife. It is about what works for that particular chef. A chain sword or samari sword would not mean much to most chefs anyway.
09-25-2008, 06:05 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by egordon99 Quote
The Canon 85mm f/1.8 is ALMOST as nice as the f/1.2, at a (big) fraction of the price. My copy is probably my favorite lens, and it cost me less than $400. From my limited use of the 77mm Limited, the humble non-L 85mm f/1.8 compares nicely.

Never used the 85mm f/1.2 L, but I have shot with a Nikon 55mm f/1.2 and Pentax A 50mm f/1.2 (very briefly while shooting with carpents). Problem is I suck at manual focus...

And I also shot with carpents' FA* 85mm f/1.4, and that was a really nice lens! I think he still owns it.



Probably my favorite shot from that day -
Comparing Canon 85/1.2 to 85/1.8 is like the comparison between Fa 35/2 to Fa 31 ltd, the difference is minimal on paper and real life application does show a difference. This is like analysing a cake in terms of flavour, odour, presentation but overall feel is another story. Even with British best menu, an excellent dish that trumped all areas of cooking failed the contest on the basis of irrevelance to the theme set in the competition.

Canon 85/1.8 is fast, small and compact. Again, so much cheaper. But every protrait photographer I know using canon eventually stick to 85/1.2 for the reasons they give up on explaining. Some of them are avid users of 85/1.8 for some time before moving onto 85/1.2. 85/1.2 dampens down highlight very well, forgiving in many outdoor setting where protraits are taken.

Fa 85/1.4 seems more contrasty and punchy in terms of rendition. Again, I could not justify myself owning fa 77 and this lens. This is a matter of personal preference. You see that Fa 85/1.4 images from Sean make me want the lens really bad. He is so adamant to get this lens and we used to bid on the same lens before on ebay. If you ask him what he thinks of the fa 85/1.4, his opinion is unlike a technical one. (Where is he up to these days?)

09-25-2008, 06:57 PM   #24
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To be honest, I just use the AbsoluteSharpeningWeb script for CS3, I generally set it to "Normal" but I might have had it on "High" for these shots. I don't think they look too bad, but I'm far from a photoshop expert. Most of my work is limited to mucking with the sliders in ACR.

I'll try to be more careful next time

QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
You'all couldn't have oversharpened those a bit more could you of?
09-25-2008, 07:24 PM   #25
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Sean and I exchange some comments on the 85s a few days ago and I hope he will not mind my passing along his decision to move to Nikon. He said he is participating in those forums more these days. He is missed........
09-25-2008, 07:42 PM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by John Kovarik Quote
Sean and I exchange some comments on the 85s a few days ago and I hope he will not mind my passing along his decision to move to Nikon. He said he is participating in those forums more these days. He is missed........
Sean Carpenter??? nooooo!!!! his 50 Comparison is legendary
09-25-2008, 09:45 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by egordon99 Quote
To be honest, I just use the AbsoluteSharpeningWeb script for CS3, I generally set it to "Normal" but I might have had it on "High" for these shots. I don't think they look too bad, but I'm far from a photoshop expert. Most of my work is limited to mucking with the sliders in ACR.

I'll try to be more careful next time
Sorry about the harsh reply, but that bottom picture is way overdone, and the top one is pretty crispy too.
There is a tendency for people to go overboard with sharpening tools, and I've found it best to approach sharpening in fairly small increments.
The whole "IQ" fetish seems to bring out the worst in us sometimes too: Sharp is good, ergo sharper is better........
As an example, if you are using Unsharp Mask, for a web sized image, try setting the sliders to something like .25 - .5 pixels, and the amount to 20% - 40%, and hit the repeat button several times.

This way you can see when it starts to hurt your eyes and then just back off a couple of history states
Very good compositions, BTW.

Last edited by Wheatfield; 09-25-2008 at 09:52 PM. Reason: Another thought
09-26-2008, 04:35 AM   #28
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Sean did not say he is abandoning PTX totally, so he may be back from time to time. As I said, I will miss him here; he has been a valued source of info and always a gentleman........
09-27-2008, 02:25 AM   #29
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As for the price tag of a 85/1.2 lens,

I'd probably never get one just to try it out (except borrowing). Would be good to know if real world shots look completely different compared to say a 1.4 lens. I like the close-to-infinity 'out - in - out focus' which has a larger format look.

Here's a nice example for this.

BTW recently I found a 85/1.2 lens from a russian night vision device Cyclop M1, the lens is a Zenith 85/1.2 and looks nice. However, it's definitely unusable for normal SLR (back lens protuding deeply), probably too small an image circle, and has no aperture.

All best, Georg (the other)
09-27-2008, 08:51 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by georgweb Quote
Here's a nice example for this.
holy shit that's an impressive photo technically and compositionally. but i'm sure other lenses can get a similar oof effect :/

in terms of the bokeh comparison, look at this
here is a link to the best canon 85mm comparison http://www.wlcastleman.com/equip/reviews/85mm/
and a bokeh comparison http://www.wlcastleman.com/equip/reviews/85mm/bokeh_2/oof_background.htm

Last edited by k100d; 09-27-2008 at 08:57 AM.
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