Question about limited lenses.

**DAZ** · 11-14-2008, 05:37 PM

A lens is a tube of compromises. The more you put in one end of the tube the more bad thing squirt out the other end.

Cost is one of the compromises that are made with a lens. With the Limited lenses cost is given less importants over optical quality followed by build quality. That makes them cost more. They cost about 2 times as much as an upper middle quality lens. Is all the additional money going to just a better lens? Probably not, but definitely some of the money is. Is a limited lens worth 2 times as much, or to put it another way is it twice as good? How much something is worth depends on how important it is to you. As to is a limited 2 times as good, no. The things that are getting built now are so good that to get just 10 percent better it may cost 2 times more money. Is a $60,000 car 2 times better then a $30,000 car? People buy cars all the time like this. If someone has the money and appreciates the differents way not? The limited lenses are about as good as lenses get for consumer lenses. To get better you are talking special order, one of or scientific lab use.

This means that the limited lenses are not for everybody. Why drive a $60,000 car off road or on the farm? You may appreciate an expressive car if you drive one but if all you are doing is grocery shopping why pay that much. If you are really into driving you may get the car anyway. If you are really into photography and you use a limited lens you may sell you kidney to keep the lens anyway.

DAZ

Ben_Edict · 11-15-2008, 02:32 AM

Originally posted by avian

Question....

If you look at pentax's page here - Camera Lens - Official PENTAX Imaging Web Site - the first thing that grabs me is that the limited's seem tiny compared to all other prime's on the page.

Is it a requirement that a "limited" lens be physically small.. i.e. perhaps a stop or two slower than they could've possibly been produced at the same focal length etc?

I've also noticed they seem to have fewer elements/groups than other primes on their site.

All coincidence?

There are two Limited series available, the DA Limiteds, which are compact and of a simpler lens design. They are optimised to be compact and deliver high IQ at the expense of being not very fast and only useable on APS-C sensors.

The older FA Limited lenses are made for full-frame cameras, including film and are faster - and not anywhere as compact as the DA Limiteds. There are only three FA Limited lenses (31mm, 43mm, 77mm).

Ben

heatherslightbox · 11-15-2008, 10:21 AM

Another way to look at the "Limited" lenses is that once you buy one, your cash flow will become "limited" for a while.

I've already got one and am expecting the second one to arrive on Tuesday.

My next lens purchase will most likely be the Sigma 105 macro, but after that, it may be time for another Limited.

Heather

**rparmar** · 11-15-2008, 12:05 PM

Just buy one. Then you will know.

Miserere · 11-15-2008, 03:34 PM

Originally posted by rparmar

Just buy one. Then you will know.

Word...

ll_coffee_lP · 11-15-2008, 03:51 PM

You don't even have to touch it...just look at it and smell it (taste optional). On top of that the all metal bodies will stand up to more wear, the IQ is top notch...and the bokeh is generally more pleasing (nicer transitions to in focus and OOF).

I like the analogy above about the 60G and 30G cars. Both will drive you around, but a discerning taste can make you really appreciate the limited's difference. Ultimately they are not for everyone.

c[_]

khardur · 11-15-2008, 04:11 PM

I'm not sure what it is - but whenver the focal length is even close to being suitable for the situation my DA40 is on camera. I can't say anything bad about it, only that it's not the 43...

I seriously almost can't stand using anything else. But then again my lens arsenal isn't the greatest... It certainly is the highest quality lens in my small collection, all personal feelings aside.

pentkon52 · 11-15-2008, 04:16 PM

Put one on your camera, and report back.:-)

Dave

**Eaglerapids** · 11-15-2008, 08:39 PM

Thank you, I was looking for an excuse to post this from the 31LTD I took this evening:-).

Do NOT buy one, the build quality and IQ will forever spoil you and you will go broke buying more Limited and * lenses.

Now, how do I come up with the money for that 77LTD, hmmmmmm.

jsherman999 · 11-15-2008, 10:26 PM

.

The image floodgates have opened.

43ltd

31ltd

hahifuheho · 11-16-2008, 12:56 AM

Thank you all for your responses. At this moment I'm waiting the arrival of a 50mm 1.4 Super Takumar from eBay (I expect this one to be fungus free, not with free fungus included as someone said

), would you say this lens' image quality would be similar to that of a limited?

After having decided to quarantine that SMC-A fast fifty, my best lens at the moment is again the 18-55 kit lens.

Bart · 11-16-2008, 10:34 AM

Originally posted by hahifuheho

... At this moment I'm waiting the arrival of a 50mm 1.4 Super Takumar from eBay ... would you say this lens' image quality would be similar to that of a limited?
...

Super Takumar = coating not as good, so be aware of flare issues.
Build quality: I would say at least as good.
Image quality: I really like it and you could have a look at a test carried out by Forum member Sean Carpenter - The normal shootout.

And don't forget the Takumar club - lots of pictures.

Oh, and the Lens review database might come in handy as well.

ll_coffee_lP · 11-16-2008, 06:31 PM

Yep - I hate my 77 ltd...

c[_]

**Kerrowdown** · 11-17-2008, 01:09 PM

I like others here, I have the understanding that only a limited number are made each day or week or whatever.

They would have us believe that they are built to a higher quality standard (of which I have no reason to doubt) as they do feel beautifully engineered in your hand.

The choice of materials used in their manufacture is also of a higher specification, i.e. metal over plastic as used in the cheaper counterparts.

hinman · 11-17-2008, 01:49 PM

I have been starting to name my recent lens with nick names as they have special purpose in my gear.

I call my Pentax FA 77mm f/1.8 my handsome boys as my boys are insanely handsome when their Dad took pictures with the "Handsome Boys" lens

Pentax FA 77mm f/1.8 limited
nick name -- Handsome Boys

#1

#2
He can look better when he behaves

#3
Even the fish looks more handsome

#4
3D imagery when you play with Av

#5
A bit off focus, unfortunately

#6
Handsome Sea Slugs

I have not given my thoughts in my blog page about this limited lens. I only used it for the last weekend and my first impression -- it is insanely good

11-17-2008, 01:49 PM	#30
hinman Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Fremont, CA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,473	I have been starting to name my recent lens with nick names as they have special purpose in my gear. I call my Pentax FA 77mm f/1.8 my handsome boys as my boys are insanely handsome when their Dad took pictures with the "Handsome Boys" lens Pentax FA 77mm f/1.8 limited nick name -- Handsome Boys #1 #2 He can look better when he behaves #3 Even the fish looks more handsome #4 3D imagery when you play with Av #5 A bit off focus, unfortunately #6 Handsome Sea Slugs I have not given my thoughts in my blog page about this limited lens. I only used it for the last weekend and my first impression -- it is insanely good Last edited by hinman; 11-17-2008 at 01:57 PM.

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11-14-2008, 05:37 PM	#16
DAZ Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Everett, WA USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 744	A lens is a tube of compromises. The more you put in one end of the tube the more bad thing squirt out the other end. Cost is one of the compromises that are made with a lens. With the Limited lenses cost is given less importants over optical quality followed by build quality. That makes them cost more. They cost about 2 times as much as an upper middle quality lens. Is all the additional money going to just a better lens? Probably not, but definitely some of the money is. Is a limited lens worth 2 times as much, or to put it another way is it twice as good? How much something is worth depends on how important it is to you. As to is a limited 2 times as good, no. The things that are getting built now are so good that to get just 10 percent better it may cost 2 times more money. Is a $60,000 car 2 times better then a $30,000 car? People buy cars all the time like this. If someone has the money and appreciates the differents way not? The limited lenses are about as good as lenses get for consumer lenses. To get better you are talking special order, one of or scientific lab use. This means that the limited lenses are not for everybody. Why drive a $60,000 car off road or on the farm? You may appreciate an expressive car if you drive one but if all you are doing is grocery shopping why pay that much. If you are really into driving you may get the car anyway. If you are really into photography and you use a limited lens you may sell you kidney to keep the lens anyway. DAZ

11-15-2008, 02:32 AM	#17
Ben_Edict Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: SouthWest "Regio" Photos: Albums Posts: 3,309	Originally posted by avian Question.... If you look at pentax's page here - Camera Lens - Official PENTAX Imaging Web Site - the first thing that grabs me is that the limited's seem tiny compared to all other prime's on the page. Is it a requirement that a "limited" lens be physically small.. i.e. perhaps a stop or two slower than they could've possibly been produced at the same focal length etc? I've also noticed they seem to have fewer elements/groups than other primes on their site. All coincidence? There are two Limited series available, the DA Limiteds, which are compact and of a simpler lens design. They are optimised to be compact and deliver high IQ at the expense of being not very fast and only useable on APS-C sensors. The older FA Limited lenses are made for full-frame cameras, including film and are faster - and not anywhere as compact as the DA Limiteds. There are only three FA Limited lenses (31mm, 43mm, 77mm). Ben

11-15-2008, 10:21 AM	#18
heatherslightbox Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Gainesville, FL Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,599	Another way to look at the "Limited" lenses is that once you buy one, your cash flow will become "limited" for a while. I've already got one and am expecting the second one to arrive on Tuesday. My next lens purchase will most likely be the Sigma 105 macro, but after that, it may be time for another Limited. Heather

11-15-2008, 12:05 PM	#19
rparmar Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2008 Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,819	Just buy one. Then you will know.

11-15-2008, 03:34 PM	#20
Miserere Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Boston Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,993	Originally posted by rparmar Just buy one. Then you will know. Word...

11-15-2008, 03:51 PM	#21
ll_coffee_lP Inactive Account Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,972	You don't even have to touch it...just look at it and smell it (taste optional). On top of that the all metal bodies will stand up to more wear, the IQ is top notch...and the bokeh is generally more pleasing (nicer transitions to in focus and OOF). I like the analogy above about the 60G and 30G cars. Both will drive you around, but a discerning taste can make you really appreciate the limited's difference. Ultimately they are not for everyone. c[_]

11-15-2008, 04:11 PM	#22
khardur Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: NW Massachusetts Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,560	I'm not sure what it is - but whenver the focal length is even close to being suitable for the situation my DA40 is on camera. I can't say anything bad about it, only that it's not the 43... I seriously almost can't stand using anything else. But then again my lens arsenal isn't the greatest... It certainly is the highest quality lens in my small collection, all personal feelings aside.

11-15-2008, 04:16 PM	#23
pentkon52 Veteran Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: York Region Canada Posts: 641	Put one on your camera, and report back.:-) Dave

11-15-2008, 08:39 PM	#24
Eaglerapids Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Idaho,USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,619	Thank you, I was looking for an excuse to post this from the 31LTD I took this evening:-). Do NOT buy one, the build quality and IQ will forever spoil you and you will go broke buying more Limited and * lenses. Now, how do I come up with the money for that 77LTD, hmmmmmm.

11-15-2008, 10:26 PM	#25
jsherman999 Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,237	. The image floodgates have opened. 43ltd 31ltd

11-16-2008, 12:56 AM	#26
hahifuheho Forum Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Monterrey, Mexico Posts: 71 Original Poster	Thank you all for your responses. At this moment I'm waiting the arrival of a 50mm 1.4 Super Takumar from eBay (I expect this one to be fungus free, not with free fungus included as someone said ), would you say this lens' image quality would be similar to that of a limited? After having decided to quarantine that SMC-A fast fifty, my best lens at the moment is again the 18-55 kit lens.

11-16-2008, 10:34 AM	#27
Bart Pentaxian Join Date: May 2007 Location: WW community of Pentax users Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,646	Originally posted by hahifuheho ... At this moment I'm waiting the arrival of a 50mm 1.4 Super Takumar from eBay ... would you say this lens' image quality would be similar to that of a limited? ... Super Takumar = coating not as good, so be aware of flare issues. Build quality: I would say at least as good. Image quality: I really like it and you could have a look at a test carried out by Forum member Sean Carpenter - The normal shootout. And don't forget the Takumar club - lots of pictures. Oh, and the Lens review database might come in handy as well.

11-16-2008, 06:31 PM	#28
ll_coffee_lP Inactive Account Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,972	Yep - I hate my 77 ltd... c[_]

11-17-2008, 01:09 PM	#29
Kerrowdown PEG Moderator Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Highlands of Scotland... "Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand" - William Blake Photos: Gallery Posts: 57,819	I like others here, I have the understanding that only a limited number are made each day or week or whatever. They would have us believe that they are built to a higher quality standard (of which I have no reason to doubt) as they do feel beautifully engineered in your hand. The choice of materials used in their manufacture is also of a higher specification, i.e. metal over plastic as used in the cheaper counterparts.