[Lev]

I just received my new K1ii and FA* 70-200 and I can't wait to go out and do some breathing.

Breathing and workout
You know what, today, first time I've been shooting with 70-200 all day and, yes it's massive and heavy but when looking at subject and composing... I didn't felt much of its physical parameters, rather fun and pleasing experience!!

[ffking]

Since this has popped up again, I'm going tp chip in. it's not an issue with a high Mp (cropable) camera unless you do video, and since nobody buys Pentax for video, it;s not an issue ( )

Basically, as far as I'm concerned, you take the image you see in the viewfinder, and that's that. Cameraville talks about bring at an event where you can't get closer so you lose out, First, you can crop, second you can use and APS-C body, third, Pentax aren't aimed at press photographers, and fourth, there are,no free lunches - if it were possible to eliminate ficus breathing at no cost, optically of financially, it would be done.

[Lev]

Since this has popped up again, I'm going tp chip in. it's not an issue with a high Mp (cropable) camera unless you do video, and since nobody buys Pentax for video, it;s not an issue ( )

Basically, as far as I'm concerned, you take the image you see in the viewfinder, and that's that. Cameraville talks about bring at an event where you can't get closer so you lose out, First, you can crop, second you can use and APS-C body, third, Pentax aren't aimed at press photographers, and fourth, there are,no free lunches - if it were possible to eliminate ficus breathing at no cost, optically of financially, it would be done.

But they are buying cameras from other brands where the focus breathing is also present. I think these cameras alltogether aren't capable to produce videos at high levels.

[Rondec]

Since this has popped up again, I'm going tp chip in. it's not an issue with a high Mp (cropable) camera unless you do video, and since nobody buys Pentax for video, it;s not an issue ( )

Basically, as far as I'm concerned, you take the image you see in the viewfinder, and that's that. Cameraville talks about bring at an event where you can't get closer so you lose out, First, you can crop, second you can use and APS-C body, third, Pentax aren't aimed at press photographers, and fourth, there are,no free lunches - if it were possible to eliminate ficus breathing at no cost, optically of financially, it would be done.

Focus breathing mainly means that you don't have macro capability with your lens. The max magnification of the 70-200 f2.8 at 1.2 meters is 0.13x. This is really similar to most other 70-200 f2.8 lenses. The Nikon 70-200 f2.8 VR II does 0.12x magnification. At normal shooting distances (non macro) you don't notice it and it is pretty close to the stated focal length.

The DA *200 does 0.2x magnification at 1.2 meters focus. So, it is better, but the difference isn't huge. Focus breathing seems like something to complain about, but I think other aspects of a lens (sharpness, contrast, micro contrast, CA) are much more important in whether it takes good photos.

[TwoUptons]

You can do macro with a lens that focus breathes. You’ll just have less working distance than a lens without it.

So if your 200mm lens turns into a 100mm lens up close, you’ll be half as far away from the subject for the same magnification vs a non-breathing lens. That may or may not be a problem…

Outside of the video issues, I’ve mostly seen this as a corner point issue… most of the time, I don’t even notice.
But it does seem to be something easily quantified for reviews…

-Eric

[Wheatfield]

* Actually, stacking for macro is best done by moving the camera/lens relative to the subject as a unit using a focus rail. One does not want to increase the reproduction ratio (magnification) from one end of the stack to the other.

I must be some sort of heretic. I routinely do focus stacks by turning the focusing ring. I just stack the images in Photoshop and let the software sort things out.
It always seems to work for me.
I take a very relaxed attitude to some of this stuff. As long as what I am doing works, I'm not overly concerned if I am doing it "correctly".

---------- Post added Sep 19th, 2021 at 09:44 AM ----------

Focus breathing mainly means that you don't have macro capability with your lens. The max magnification of the 70-200 f2.8 at 1.2 meters is 0.13x. This is really similar to most other 70-200 f2.8 lenses. The Nikon 70-200 f2.8 VR II does 0.12x magnification. At normal shooting distances (non macro) you don't notice it and it is pretty close to the stated focal length.

The DA *200 does 0.2x magnification at 1.2 meters focus. So, it is better, but the difference isn't huge. Focus breathing seems like something to complain about, but I think other aspects of a lens (sharpness, contrast, micro contrast, CA) are much more important in whether it takes good photos.

One of the guys on the PDML calculated the focal length of the A100/2.8 macro. It was something like 68mm at 1:1.
This was before anyone cared about focus breathing and made it into one more thing to chew our nails over.

[Wheatfield]

Since this has popped up again, I'm going tp chip in. it's not an issue with a high Mp (cropable) camera unless you do video, and since nobody buys Pentax for video, it;s not an issue ( )

Basically, as far as I'm concerned, you take the image you see in the viewfinder, and that's that. Cameraville talks about bring at an event where you can't get closer so you lose out, First, you can crop, second you can use and APS-C body, third, Pentax aren't aimed at press photographers, and fourth, there are,no free lunches - if it were possible to eliminate ficus breathing at no cost, optically of financially, it would be done.

Let's not forget that focus breathing is also a manifestation of focusing close. I've done a significant amount of event photography, I assure you that any talk of focus breathing getting in the way of that type of photography doesn't have any idea of what he is talking about.
I'm not saying outright that the cameraville guy is a clueless idiot, but if it walks like a duck and quacks, we have to accept that it might be a duck.

[stevebrot]

Cameraville talks about bring at an event where you can't get closer so you lose out

Which tells me that Cameraville doesn't know what they are talking about. Focus breathing with significant loss of magnification is not something of concern at moderate distance. What it boils down to is either you know your kit or you don't. If you aren't close enough, you will lose out because you are not close enough (get better tickets?), not because of focus breathing.


Steve

[ZombieArmy]

Basically, as far as I'm concerned, you take the image you see in the viewfinder, and that's that. Cameraville talks about bring at an event where you can't get closer so you lose out

If you're not close enough you should have brought the 150-450.

[pblogic]

So, I have to be honest, I don't think I understand this issue enough to know who is accurate and who is not. I was looking strongly at this lens because I need a fast lens with modern auto focus for indoor soccer games, but according to this guy, this lens is actually only 130mm?? That would be a bit short.

Has anyone tested these lenses to see if his claims are true or false? 135mm.... that's a huge difference from it's claimed focal length.

Sorry, I don't mean to annoy anyone with my ignorance, I just want to understand what's going on.

[mikesbike]

You can do macro with a lens that focus breathes. You’ll just have less working distance than a lens without it.

So if your 200mm lens turns into a 100mm lens up close, you’ll be half as far away from the subject for the same magnification vs a non-breathing lens. That may or may not be a problem…

Outside of the video issues, I’ve mostly seen this as a corner point issue… most of the time, I don’t even notice.
But it does seem to be something easily quantified for reviews…

-Eric

Right- it can be an issue or not be, depending on which lens, what you are doing with it, your subject, and at what distance you are doing it. For most uses, you just get as close as you need to, in order to get he framing you need to get.

[pschlute]

I need a fast lens with modern auto focus for indoor soccer games, but according to this guy, this lens is actually only 130mm?? That would be a bit short.

If you intend to take pictures at your soccer game with a metre and a quarter between you and the subject then the FL may be reduced to 130mm. Would that be an issue ? No..... I mean what FL would you normally choose at that distance ?

Has anyone tested these lenses to see if his claims are true or false? 135mm

At normal focus distances it is a 200mm lens.

[Rondec]

So, I have to be honest, I don't think I understand this issue enough to know who is accurate and who is not. I was looking strongly at this lens because I need a fast lens with modern auto focus for indoor soccer games, but according to this guy, this lens is actually only 130mm?? That would be a bit short.

Has anyone tested these lenses to see if his claims are true or false? 135mm.... that's a huge difference from it's claimed focal length.

Sorry, I don't mean to annoy anyone with my ignorance, I just want to understand what's going on.

Focus breathing is an issue at short focusing distances. Most lenses do this to a certain extent -- some more than others. The Pentax DFA 70-210mm has a little less and so it has 0.32x magnification at .9 meters focus, while the DFA *70-200mm does 0.13x at its minimum focus distance of 1.2 meters.

I think the key here though is that you would seldom be shooting at 200mm and the minimum focus distance and if your subject is 4 or 5 meters way, you are going to be much closer to the stated 200mm focal length. Certainly shooting soccer games your focus will be close enough to infinity that you will be at 200mm.

To me, this is mainly a statement that you aren't going to shoot macro with this sort of lens.

[pblogic]

Focus breathing is an issue at short focusing distances. Most lenses do this to a certain extent -- some more than others. The Pentax DFA 70-210mm has a little less and so it has 0.32x magnification at .9 meters focus, while the DFA *70-200mm does 0.13x at its minimum focus distance of 1.2 meters.

I think the key here though is that you would seldom be shooting at 200mm and the minimum focus distance and if your subject is 4 or 5 meters way, you are going to be much closer to the stated 200mm focal length. Certainly shooting soccer games your focus will be close enough to infinity that you will be at 200mm.

To me, this is mainly a statement that you aren't going to shoot macro with this sort of lens.

Thank you, that helps me very much. I have no need to shoot macro with a lens like this. I have a Sigma with macro that works quite nicely. For this lens I would want to use it for my child's indoor soccer games where the wide aperture is a big help, and then for portraits. Doesn't sound like focus breathing is really going to affect me.

[mikesbike]

For this lens I would want to use it for my child's indoor soccer games where the wide aperture is a big help, and then for portraits. Doesn't sound like focus breathing is really going to affect me.

Probably not, especially for the uses you have in mind. This issue mainly surfaces at shorter shooting distances such a lens may be used for. In the case of a zoom lens of this range, when the action comes in much closer to your location, you might be framing your shot with your lens set to say 140mm, while with a different similar lens not having any FB, you might be setting at 110mm. But the result will be he same. As the subjects move farther out, the two lenses will become more and more equal in the FL setting for the same framing.