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11-23-2008, 05:51 PM   #46
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
Richard

Since we can't get together easily, I propose a challenge of some sort.

the rules are as follows;

One of us proposes a subject, - pets, flowers birds etc. each in sequence, and takes a shot that they feel demonstrates the qualities of the lens, and the other has to shoot under the same conditions (or as close as possible) and we judge based upon the full frame (but resized to post) plus 2 ~10%crops, one center one corner.

I suggest either 6 or 10MP camera as I have an *istD and K10D.

Propose with and without flash if you can do it.
Propose min, max and middle focal length and a similar mix of subject distances, plus macro

I'll even let you pick first. and of course, we should, if you want to go ahead, run this as a new thread. May the best lens win
any takers?

This could be a little bit of fun as well as a learning process for everyone

11-23-2008, 10:35 PM   #47
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
any takers?
This would be very interesting.
In January 2009, I'll get a Tokina 70-210, f/3.5, which I believe is identical to the Vivitar series 1, version 2. I'd be happy to supply my image but that doesn't mean you have to wait that long.
11-24-2008, 12:01 AM   #48
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Lowell,

A photo duel sounds like it would make for a fun thread. I could see it spawning a series of face offs, but choosing 1 focal range to start with is probably the way to go.

If you want to start in the ~80-200 range, I believe that I have the same Vivitar Series 1 70-210 f/3.5 (1st version) that you do, and there are lots of others around here with later versions of the series 1. You/we just have to find a couple of people with an A70-210 f/4, M or K 80-200 f/4.5, or possibly an FA 80-200 f/2.8 willing to step up and participate.

Possible limiting the field to constant aperture zooms that cover 80-200mm (so in theory a 60-250 f/4 or Sigma 70-200 f/2.8 would qualify, but a 50-135 or 50-150 wouldn't) would be somewhere to start. I would be fine with shooting my K10 set at 6mp if you want the same approximate resolution from any/all bodies being used.

Restricting the field to just 2 lenses would be another option and might be easier to manage but the trade off is that it would cut down on the number of people able to participate.

Photos probably ought to be of things that an average person could find in their neighbourhood or house, regardless of where in the world they live (fork, coin approximately 1 inch across, stop sign, house, etc.?).

If you want to draft some rules and start a thread, I'm sure you will find people willing to take the challenge.
11-24-2008, 05:07 AM   #49
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The origonal intent was to challenge the SMC-A 70-210 F4 with my Vivitar S1 70-210 F3.5 Version 1, because although the first version, by many it is reported as the sharpest.

However, I agree that we could open this up to make it more interesting. I will consider the criteria, and post a thread shortly looking to "formalize' the shoot out.

11-24-2008, 06:00 AM   #50
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
The original intent was to challenge the SMC-A 70-210 F4 with my Vivitar S1 70-210 F3.5 Version 1, because although the first version, by many it is reported as the sharpest.
Have a look at Vivitar 70-210 Series 1 Macro Zoom Lenses - Mark Roberts Photography. According to this page, version 3 (f/2.8-4.0) is the sharpest.

QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
However, I agree that we could open this up to make it more interesting.
Yes, that'll be fun.

QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
I will consider the criteria, and post a thread shortly looking to "formalize' the shoot out.
Thanks in advance. Please put a pointer to the new thread here, so that everyone subscribed to this one already definitely will know about it.
11-24-2008, 07:40 AM   #51
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The two lenses I was most supprised by are Pentax-A 70-210/4 and K 35mm 3,5. First roll I shot with the 35mm almost made me fall of the chair... The A zoom really caught me off gard too, looking forward to reading the shoot out.

K50/1,4 and K135/2,5 are also gems, but not as much to my supprise as the two above.
11-24-2008, 08:52 AM   #52
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QuoteOriginally posted by Marc Sabatella Quote
Can I ask a dumb question? I'm pretty up on the various different "K" mount lenses - Stan's and Bojidar's sites are very useful for me in sorting out what's what. But the Takumars are still kind of a mystery to me. I gather most are screwmount, although I know there are at least a few Takumar K-mount lenses. And randomly searching for info hasn't turned up anything nearly as comprehensive as Stan's & Bojidar's site. The Wikipedia entry for Takumar at least helps sort out Takumar versus Auto Takumar versus Super Takumar versus SMC Takumar, but still, I'd love to see some objective and subjective info on all the specific Takumars the way I can for the K's. Best I've found thus far is:

Die Cast Pro - Pentax Lenses

But this doesn't seem as complete or as useful to me as I was hoping for...
The Tak k-mount lenses were sometimes similar in design to other pentax lenses except they had a coating other than SMC. For example there was three 28-80 A zooms F3.5-4.5. One was a Tak, and 2 were a Pentax. One of the Pentax was identical to the Tak and both had non smc coating. They also had 8 elements in 8 groups and weighed the same. The Pentax SMC A had 12 elements in 9 groups and was lighter. All 3 had a similar build and style. The Tak A was built from 1984-88 and the Pentax non-smc A was built from 1989 to 1994. The SMC A was built only from 1986-88. The point is that Tak means something different during the K-mount era than it did during the m42 years. During the m42 years, they were generally the good stuff while during the k-mount years they were typically budget lenses.
11-24-2008, 08:54 AM   #53
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QuoteOriginally posted by acbees Quote
Bsbxl,
I would like to add the Super Macro Takumar 50mm f/4. Excellent little 1:2 macro lens!
Arvin
Another good one is the 50mm f4 macro-Takumar that was only made in 1966 and was 1:1.

12-10-2008, 02:26 PM   #54
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QuoteOriginally posted by Marc Sabatella Quote
Can I ask a dumb question? I'm pretty up on the various different "K" mount lenses - Stan's and Bojidar's sites are very useful for me in sorting out what's what. But the Takumars are still kind of a mystery to me. I gather most are screwmount, although I know there are at least a few Takumar K-mount lenses. And randomly searching for info hasn't turned up anything nearly as comprehensive as Stan's & Bojidar's site. The Wikipedia entry for Takumar at least helps sort out Takumar versus Auto Takumar versus Super Takumar versus SMC Takumar, but still, I'd love to see some objective and subjective info on all the specific Takumars the way I can for the K's. Best I've found thus far is:

Die Cast Pro - Pentax Lenses

But this doesn't seem as complete or as useful to me as I was hoping for...
Marc,

I think most of the answers you are looking for will be found in print rather than online. See if you can find a copy of Danilo Cecchi's Ashai Pentax and Pentax SLR 35mm Cameras 1952-1989. Hove Sussex : Hove Photo Books, 1990. ISBN 0906447623.

The book is translated from the Italian and suffers a bit as a result for English readers. It is a treasure trove of information for Pentax collectors on most things Pentax from 1952 through 1989.

Chapter 8 (pp 87-98) "Takumar - The Eyes of Ashai Pentax" - describes in detail the evolution of the the Takumars, Auto Takumars, Super Takumars Super Multicoated SMC Takumars and the Alpa Takumar series.

I think you will find all you need to know in this chapter. See if your local library has a copy or can get one through Inter Library loan. You can probably get a used copy from Amazon if you are really keen and want one of your own.

Cheers,

Tom G

Last edited by 8540tomg; 12-10-2008 at 04:30 PM. Reason: typo
12-10-2008, 03:12 PM   #55
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I have a mint copy of the SMC A 70-210/4, and had a nice copy of hte vivitar series 1 zoom of the same focal range at constant 3.5. In all honesty, I was disappointed by the performance of the Series 1 lens and promptly sold it, while keeping the SMC A zoom. The SMC A zoom had equal if not better IQ at the same apertures, and has much better handling IMHO. Maybe I had a poor performing copy of the Vivitar, but that was my experience with them.

-Jim
12-10-2008, 04:51 PM   #56
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Here are some of my links to m42 Takumar stuff:

Early Asahi Pentax Cameras and Takumar lenses: Main Page

Photoethnography.com - Classic Cameras

Up until recently, there was an interesting site here, but I see that it has been evicted for rent being past due.

http://www.m-fortytwo.info/ViewAllTakumars.php
12-10-2008, 04:59 PM   #57
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I just checked the Takumar lens site posted by Blue:

Early Asahi Pentax Cameras and Takumar lenses: Main Page

It is better than the Cecchi book on this topic. Save your time and money.

Tom G

Last edited by 8540tomg; 12-10-2008 at 05:00 PM. Reason: typo
12-10-2008, 05:08 PM   #58
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
The origonal intent was to challenge the SMC-A 70-210 F4 with my Vivitar S1 70-210 F3.5 Version 1, because although the first version, by many it is reported as the sharpest.

However, I agree that we could open this up to make it more interesting. I will consider the criteria, and post a thread shortly looking to "formalize' the shoot out.
I have the S1 Version 3 - keep me posted on the shootout, I'd love to participate.
12-10-2008, 06:31 PM   #59
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QuoteOriginally posted by edl Quote
I have the S1 Version 3 - keep me posted on the shootout, I'd love to participate.
I started a thread on the rules but had virtually no respondants. in my thinking, we should all do a series of flower shots at minimum focusing distance wide open, at say F8 and F16, in a greenhouse, since everyone has access to a greenhouse or garden somewhere.

I would also propose a set of shots at perhaps 50 feet and infinity, maximum and minimum focal length.

Perhaps also portrait at about 135mm . once we all agree on the subjects, each different lens owner can do their shots, and post them. As a reality check, i could also do the same shots (except macro) with my APO 70-200 F2..8 EX.
12-10-2008, 06:35 PM   #60
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M42

QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
Here are some of my links to m42 Takumar stuff:

Early Asahi Pentax Cameras and Takumar lenses: Main Page

Photoethnography.com - Classic Cameras

Up until recently, there was an interesting site here, but I see that it has been evicted for rent being past due.

http://www.m-fortytwo.info/ViewAllTakumars.php
Too bad about M42. Before I sold (almost) everything, I made quite a number of entries to the database.

Karen Nakamura's site was the first place I went when exploring Spotmatic history - I still have that in my links list.
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