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07-17-2021, 12:11 PM   #1
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Limited lens vs. Star (*) lens question

From an engineering point, which lens does Pentax (Ricoh) consider to be their better/best lens - the Limited edition lens or the Star (*) editions - ?

07-17-2021, 12:21 PM   #2
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Star is supposed to be better in pure engineering terms. It contains the most ambitious materials and engineering.
07-17-2021, 12:35 PM   #3
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RIcoh Imaging says that the 'Star' line is their "top-of-the-line lens series."

However, engineering design involves trades and compromises. In the case of lenses, engineering involves optics, materials, structures, mechanics, electronics, and ergonomics. While the Star lenses feature superb optics, precise focusing, and other qualities, they're relatively heavy and expensive. On the other hand, the smaller Limited lenses feature unique optical qualities that can also produce wonderful images.

Which one is 'better' from an engineering perspective? I'd say neither, as each line incorporates design choices that are suited to the goals of each series.

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07-17-2021, 12:56 PM - 1 Like   #4
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Ricoh explained the concept behind the Limited lenses in several of the videos they released in the past 18 months or so.

Many of them reflect the Five Principles of Pentax the main one being "Depicting an ambience undetectable by numerical values". They are not concerned so much with engineering and optical perfection but rather lenses that produce pleasing results for reasons you can't quite define.

PENTAX Limited Lens Special Site | RICOH IMAGING

07-17-2021, 01:03 PM - 2 Likes   #5
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Your question isn't very clear---but then Pentax's position on this is unique I think in the industry, with maybe only Leica now having similar attitudes. Both lines are rigorously engineered, but the Star lenses (the newest ones at least) are the ones more comparable to what people call "modern" lenses with respect to their clinical characteristics. In so-called modern lenses, the goal seems to be to engineer "character" out, sort of like "Cylon" lenses. The Limiteds are engineered to have some character, with maybe more humanistic qualities
07-17-2021, 01:21 PM   #6
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Star lenses reach their optimum at wider apertures than run-of-the-mill lenses. FA* 300 mm f/4.5 peaks in resolution at f/6.3, DA* 50-135 mm f/2.8 and DA* 60-250 mm f/4 peak at f/8. The P67 M* 300 mm f/4 peaks at f\8 and there is no use closing the aperture any more, resolution simply decreases at smaller openings.

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07-17-2021, 01:45 PM - 2 Likes   #7
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So the Limiteds have 'pixie dust' and the Stars have, uh, 'stardust'?

07-17-2021, 01:46 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by Michael Piziak Quote
From an engineering point, which lens does Pentax (Ricoh) consider to be their better/best lens - the Limited edition lens or the Star (*) editions - ?
I think the star-lenses are the top of engineering. From old they used special glass and it was a sturdy build and (very) heavy and for that time extreme wider apertures (bringing a 135mm back from F2.5 and F3.5 to a F1.8). The special glasses are now sometimes also used in standard lenses, such as AL glass and ED (used in the second and WR edition of the 18-55). So you see in the new *lenses more special glasses mentioned than say in the 80's of the last century. Limited lenses are "standard" designs, with which I mean they use standard glass but they are build with sturdy metals in smaller batches than the standard old 50mm's for instance. As Ricoh/Pentax explained they are not Limited Editions, but produced in smaller batches, so Limited in number of copies.
07-17-2021, 02:59 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by AfterPentax Mark II Quote
Limited lenses are "standard" designs, with which I mean they use standard glass
The DA 15 and 20-40 LTD lenses use ED glass.
07-17-2021, 03:09 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Not a Number Quote
Ricoh explained the concept behind the Limited lenses in several of the videos they released in the past 18 months or so.

Many of them reflect the Five Principles of Pentax the main one being "Depicting an ambience undetectable by numerical values". They are not concerned so much with engineering and optical perfection but rather lenses that produce pleasing results for reasons you can't quite define.

PENTAX Limited Lens Special Site | RICOH IMAGING

Thanks for your reply and I'm going to now click and read that link you posted ...
07-17-2021, 03:10 PM   #11
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Both top tier, but perhaps a little different target. The stars have represented the fastest and sharpest top tier with a pro orientation. Typically weather sealed too, and if they got big in the design to have top technical optics, that was OK too. The Limiteds seemed to be oriented more to a top pleasing image quality, but not necessarily the best optical performance from a tech standpoint. Also not so important on speed either, and that in turn I think led to some being in a smaller package. The Limited seem to be an ideal of pleasing rendition in a compact size.
07-17-2021, 03:11 PM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Apet-Sure Quote
So the Limiteds have 'pixie dust' and the Stars have, uh, 'stardust'?
A big smile on my face - good one!

---------- Post added 07-17-21 at 03:17 PM ----------

Gee, Ricoh/Pentax certainly don't produce a lot of lens these days - seems like all of them could be labeled as Limited. With star * reserved for the very best. Just food for thought with a pinch of sarcasm thrown into the pot....

---------- Post added 07-17-21 at 03:20 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Michael Piziak Quote
Thanks for your reply and I'm going to now click and read that link you posted ...
I much enjoyed the short video, http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/limited_lens/top/video/limitedlens.mp4
07-17-2021, 03:30 PM   #13
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I look at it as follow.
Star: When users looking for a technical superiority lens.
Limited: When users looking for lenses with (stronger than average) characteristic and or personality in its rendering.
Will it meets its goals? it is another story.

So "from an engineering point" I guess Pentax (Ricoh) might consider Star to be their better lens.
But which one is a better lens for user, it would be up to the individual user.

Last edited by tokyoscape; 07-17-2021 at 03:35 PM.
07-17-2021, 04:17 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by texandrews Quote
"Cylon" lenses.
Funny comparison, accurate too if you ignore the later humanoid cylons that at least don't weigh a ton
07-17-2021, 04:23 PM - 3 Likes   #15
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For me .... star is technical quality and limited is emotional quality..... head or heart. "Quality" in my context covers both the experience and outcome.
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