New video about old Limited

**jersey** · 10-29-2021, 07:34 AM - **2 Likes**

I like their videos. I think they fit the photography as a hobby, where you go around, quiet down, concentrate on what is around you. I think that from all photographic companies Pentax hits the nail perfectly about making videos for photographers and, well, snobs who want this "special" experience from money they spent. It goes hand to hand with the "immeasurable by numbers" philosophy they are talking lately about.

And it is lots better then all the loud and chaotic videos from other companies that are showing numbers, x magnification, xxx MP, this, that... who cares?

BTW - I think 31 and even 21 are closer to human FOV without generating too much distortions then 50mm. Since I use 20-40 I find that I use 20-30 more then 35-40 range.

So no wonder that wide and close to ultra wide lenses feel most natural for people who are photographing more natural subjects.

biz-engineer · 10-29-2021, 07:40 AM

Originally posted by EssJayEff

A 50mm lens on full frame does not represent the human field of vision; it approximates only what one eye sees without magnification in a viewfinder. My field of vision using both eyes encompasses a much broader view than the coverage of a 50mm lens.

Human eye field of vision is at least 120 degrees, so it's clear than even 31mm lens on FF isn't wide enough for the camera sensor to see all what human binocular vision sees. There is always a confusion in forums about what 50mm normal lens means, it never meant to reproduce the same angle of view as the human binocular vision. Simple, 50mm lens gives field of view narrower than human eyes, but what's in the picture contain the same geometric proportion of objects in the frame as the human vision sees it. The whole point of a 50mm lens is to reproduce in images the same ratio of objects as seen in real life, which practically means I don't need to look through the camera viewfinder to compose an image that I will shoot with a 50mm lens, I can compose directly with my eyes, and of course not all what I can see with my eye will be in the frame because I see wider than a 50mm lens.

---------- Post added 29-10-21 at 16:47 ----------

Originally posted by jersey

I think they fit the photography as a hobby, where you go around, quiet down, concentrate on what is around you.

Exactly. He is a professional photographer, but made the video for marketing purpose. This is the good aspect of that video, it's compelling to hobby photographers, the core of the market for such lens.

**BarryE** · 10-29-2021, 07:53 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by texandrews

So, I just started reading a collection of Japanese poetry, and it's pretty fascinating to see the literal translations against the one presented by the translator as an appropriate English translation for good sense. This is really not like translating one European language to another, or even Latin to English!

So some of what we are seeing as quirky in the language used by Pentax that we see in translation I think is reflective of how Japanese-centric the company is. You don't get this sort of thing from Sony, for instance...

What's weirdest to me is that Ricoh, a much more globally focused company, doesn't seem to feel the need to review these marketing materials for an international audience. The closest they came were some of the promotional videos they did for the K3III with the white hipsters in the woods (also showing a bit of tone deafness in this contemporary moment, at least for the U.S. ...)

I'll also add that I find the mood of the video just great---yes, on the melancholic side, but so refreshing AFAIC in comparison to so many things done today that seem like the makers are on meth, and very reflective of the contemplative side of traditional Japanese arts. And with respect to the comment above about the images looking like what they'd get just walking around at lunchtime or whatever----if that's true, then you are very talented.

I like the distinction he made between the 2 versions of this lens.

I wonder what camera they used to make the video?

The differences in cultures defy literal translations. I've been dipping in and out of Japanese literature and culture since I was at university and hoped to travel through the country just before Covid struck. I'm glad Ricoh are not attempting to follow the likes of Sony. It makes them different and after all isn't that one of the things we like about the brand?

**jersey** · 10-29-2021, 07:56 AM

BTW - in the comments some Japanese wrote that Pentax gains fans overseas so go and comment :P Maybe Ricoh will then speed up western information materials and not trickle one a year :P

Wheatfield · 10-29-2021, 07:57 AM

Originally posted by EssJayEff

At the 2:22 mark you can see a glimpse of the camera label, also at 5:05: he is using a K-1 II. A 50mm lens on full frame does not represent the human field of vision; it approximates only what one eye sees without magnification in a viewfinder. My field of vision using both eyes encompasses a much broader view than the coverage of a 50mm lens. Also, the translation reads, "'Standard lens' means a 31mm lens for me . . ."—that's subjective and what feels right for him.

Actually, the 50mm is pretty close in full frame. So much of what we trumpet when we say our field of vision using both eyes encompasses a much broader view boils down to our eyes darting around making it appear that we have a wider field of view, and our useless for anything other than sensing movement peripheral vision.

Class A · 10-29-2021, 08:01 AM - **1 Like**

A "standard" or "normal" focal length is not about field of view at all (neither full or focused field of view).

It is about faithfully producing angles when the image is viewed from a distance that is equal to the diagonal of the image. So if, for instance, you are viewing a 16x20 print, the assumption is that you are going to view it from around 25.6 inch distance. In this case, an image taken with a "normal" focal length will neither show exaggerated angles (as a wide-angle lens would do) nor a compressed perspective (as a telephoto lens would do).

The actually correct "normal" focal length for FF cameras is 43mm, hence the FA 43/1.9 Limited. The "50mm" choice was made because it is pretty close to 43mm but makes it easier to construct sharp lenses.

house · 10-29-2021, 08:12 AM

Originally posted by texandrews

I wonder what camera they used to make the video?

https://youtu.be/SY2yenwmrzU?t=125
See above. I *think* that the footage they are taking above wen't into that other video. Same location, clothes, weather etc. at least.

It's pretty much a behind the scenes video for that "evidence" video.

Jeff · 10-29-2021, 08:25 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Class A

A "standard" or "normal" focal length is not about field of view at all (neither full or focused field of view).

It is about faithfully producing angles when the image is viewed from a distance that is equal to the diagonal of the image. So if, for instance, you are viewing a 16x20 print, the assumption is that you are going to view it from around 25.6 inch distance. In this case, an image taken with a "normal" focal length will neither show exaggerated angles (as a wide-angle lens would do) or a compressed perspective (as a telephoto lens would do).

The actually correct "normal" focal length for FF cameras is 43mm, hence the FA 43/1.9 Limited. The "50mm" choice was made because it is pretty close to 43mm but makes it easier to construct sharp lenses.

When I use my 43 on the K-1 it feels far more natural and easier to 'read' than the 50. I use that when I want to leave things out. And I really enjoy Seo's work for all the reasons that some others don't - he also composes his own music. Talented guy.

biz-engineer · 10-29-2021, 09:02 AM

Originally posted by Class A

The actually correct "normal" focal length for FF cameras is 43mm

Where is the evidence of that? I conducted an experiment with a zoom lens, shot the same street + houses at various focal length, then I ranked the images to find the one most similar in terms of the image representation compared to reality, and to my surprise (I had learned from the forum that 43mm was the normal FL), I found that the focal length that gave the closest to naked eye view was 50mm. I said to myself "wow! so the popular believe that 50mm is the normal lens was right, it's not 43mm". I found that observation amazing.

**BarryE** · 10-29-2021, 09:10 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by biz-engineer

Where is the evidence of that? I conducted an experiment with a zoom lens, shot the same street + houses at various focal length, then I ranked the images to find the one most similar in terms of the image representation compared to reality, and to my surprise (I had learned from the forum that 43mm was the normal FL), I found that the focal length that gave the closest to naked eye view was 50mm. I said to myself "wow! so the popular believe that 50mm is the normal lens was right, it's not 43mm". I found that observation amazing.

Maybe some folk's eyes are closer together than others ...

biz-engineer · 10-29-2021, 09:15 AM

Originally posted by BarryE

Maybe some folk's eyes are closer together than others ...

Maybe. However, it's easy to demonstrate that the diagonal of the sensor has nothing to do with the notion of normal focal length, change the aspect ratio from 3:2 to 1:1 (crop the edges), now the diagonal of the crop is 33.94mm but if the lens is still the same and the photographer hasn't moved the proportion of street vs houses in the picture is still the same.

texandrews · 10-29-2021, 10:00 AM - **2 Likes**

It's his "standard" lens because that's how he sees things naturally---and I agree with him for the most part. My "standard" lens back in the day was a 28.

He is not making any claims about what we consider a "normal" lens and why. So, let's not go off on a tangential argument about what "normal" is and derail this one which was about this video, I thought. We can start another interesting thread about "normal". Looks like it might become the "equivalence" of late 2021....

**BarryE** · 10-29-2021, 10:04 AM

Originally posted by biz-engineer

Maybe. However, it's easy to demonstrate that the diagonal of the sensor has nothing to do with the notion of normal focal length, change the aspect ratio from 3:2 to 1:1 (crop the edges), now the diagonal of the crop is 33.94mm but if the lens is still the same and the photographer hasn't moved the proportion of street vs houses in the picture is still the same.

"33.94mm". Guess I don't think of photography with this degree of precision, but then I was only a software engineer so my world was easier to define with just 1s and 0s

ChristianRock · 10-29-2021, 12:21 PM

I like the video. It's about his journey. I think it was tastefully done and the music fits the mood of the pictures that the photographer takes.

JPT · 10-29-2021, 07:44 PM

On the Japanese Ricoh site they introduce this as the first of their "Evidence" videos, strongly implying that there will be some more to add to the site. I think the word evidence just means evidence of what the lenses can do.

I liked the video. This location is an easy trip from where I've but I haven't been there for years. Perhaps I should go there again and take some shots. It's part of the western Tokyo prefecture that is very natural and mountainous. Obviously Tokyo is very, very urban in most places, but it's easy to forget how easy it is to get in a train and be somewhere completely different within an hour.

10-29-2021, 08:01 AM - 1 Like	#21
Class A Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Wellington, New Zealand Posts: 11,251	A "standard" or "normal" focal length is not about field of view at all (neither full or focused field of view). It is about faithfully producing angles when the image is viewed from a distance that is equal to the diagonal of the image. So if, for instance, you are viewing a 16x20 print, the assumption is that you are going to view it from around 25.6 inch distance. In this case, an image taken with a "normal" focal length will neither show exaggerated angles (as a wide-angle lens would do) nor a compressed perspective (as a telephoto lens would do). The actually correct "normal" focal length for FF cameras is 43mm, hence the FA 43/1.9 Limited. The "50mm" choice was made because it is pretty close to 43mm but makes it easier to construct sharp lenses. Last edited by Class A; 10-29-2021 at 08:34 AM.

10-29-2021, 10:00 AM - 2 Likes	#27
texandrews Moderator Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Baltimore Photos: Albums Posts: 3,393	The photographer was speaking about his personal preference It's his "standard" lens because that's how he sees things naturally---and I agree with him for the most part. My "standard" lens back in the day was a 28. He is not making any claims about what we consider a "normal" lens and why. So, let's not go off on a tangential argument about what "normal" is and derail this one which was about this video, I thought. We can start another interesting thread about "normal". Looks like it might become the "equivalence" of late 2021....

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
JordonDucks CroPPY video about Pentax video.	surfar	Video Recording and Processing	123	10-22-2021 10:05 PM
For Sale - Sold: DA Limited 21mm / DA Limited 35mm Macro / DA Limited 70mm	top-quark	Sold Items	3	04-23-2013 05:01 AM
The Wedding Speech - New HQ K-01 Video + a behind the scenes video	solar1	Pentax K-01	21	05-02-2012 11:24 PM
For Sale - Sold: K-5 + 18-55 + Batt Grip/3 batts, 31mm Limited, 15mm Limited, 70mm Limited	Sperdynamite	Sold Items	7	02-24-2012 12:07 AM

10-29-2021, 07:34 AM - 2 Likes	#16
jersey Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: 3City agglomeration Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,056 Original Poster	I like their videos. I think they fit the photography as a hobby, where you go around, quiet down, concentrate on what is around you. I think that from all photographic companies Pentax hits the nail perfectly about making videos for photographers and, well, snobs who want this "special" experience from money they spent. It goes hand to hand with the "immeasurable by numbers" philosophy they are talking lately about. And it is lots better then all the loud and chaotic videos from other companies that are showing numbers, x magnification, xxx MP, this, that... who cares? BTW - I think 31 and even 21 are closer to human FOV without generating too much distortions then 50mm. Since I use 20-40 I find that I use 20-30 more then 35-40 range. So no wonder that wide and close to ultra wide lenses feel most natural for people who are photographing more natural subjects.

10-29-2021, 07:40 AM	#17
biz-engineer Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 12,232	Originally posted by EssJayEff A 50mm lens on full frame does not represent the human field of vision; it approximates only what one eye sees without magnification in a viewfinder. My field of vision using both eyes encompasses a much broader view than the coverage of a 50mm lens. Human eye field of vision is at least 120 degrees, so it's clear than even 31mm lens on FF isn't wide enough for the camera sensor to see all what human binocular vision sees. There is always a confusion in forums about what 50mm normal lens means, it never meant to reproduce the same angle of view as the human binocular vision. Simple, 50mm lens gives field of view narrower than human eyes, but what's in the picture contain the same geometric proportion of objects in the frame as the human vision sees it. The whole point of a 50mm lens is to reproduce in images the same ratio of objects as seen in real life, which practically means I don't need to look through the camera viewfinder to compose an image that I will shoot with a 50mm lens, I can compose directly with my eyes, and of course not all what I can see with my eye will be in the frame because I see wider than a 50mm lens. ---------- Post added 29-10-21 at 16:47 ---------- Originally posted by jersey I think they fit the photography as a hobby, where you go around, quiet down, concentrate on what is around you. Exactly. He is a professional photographer, but made the video for marketing purpose. This is the good aspect of that video, it's compelling to hobby photographers, the core of the market for such lens.

10-29-2021, 07:53 AM - 1 Like	#18
BarryE Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Hampshire, UK Posts: 1,653	Originally posted by texandrews So, I just started reading a collection of Japanese poetry, and it's pretty fascinating to see the literal translations against the one presented by the translator as an appropriate English translation for good sense. This is really not like translating one European language to another, or even Latin to English! So some of what we are seeing as quirky in the language used by Pentax that we see in translation I think is reflective of how Japanese-centric the company is. You don't get this sort of thing from Sony, for instance... What's weirdest to me is that Ricoh, a much more globally focused company, doesn't seem to feel the need to review these marketing materials for an international audience. The closest they came were some of the promotional videos they did for the K3III with the white hipsters in the woods (also showing a bit of tone deafness in this contemporary moment, at least for the U.S. ...) I'll also add that I find the mood of the video just great---yes, on the melancholic side, but so refreshing AFAIC in comparison to so many things done today that seem like the makers are on meth, and very reflective of the contemplative side of traditional Japanese arts. And with respect to the comment above about the images looking like what they'd get just walking around at lunchtime or whatever----if that's true, then you are very talented. I like the distinction he made between the 2 versions of this lens. I wonder what camera they used to make the video? The differences in cultures defy literal translations. I've been dipping in and out of Japanese literature and culture since I was at university and hoped to travel through the country just before Covid struck. I'm glad Ricoh are not attempting to follow the likes of Sony. It makes them different and after all isn't that one of the things we like about the brand?

10-29-2021, 07:56 AM	#19
jersey Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: 3City agglomeration Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,056 Original Poster	BTW - in the comments some Japanese wrote that Pentax gains fans overseas so go and comment :P Maybe Ricoh will then speed up western information materials and not trickle one a year :P

10-29-2021, 07:57 AM	#20
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	Originally posted by EssJayEff At the 2:22 mark you can see a glimpse of the camera label, also at 5:05: he is using a K-1 II. A 50mm lens on full frame does not represent the human field of vision; it approximates only what one eye sees without magnification in a viewfinder. My field of vision using both eyes encompasses a much broader view than the coverage of a 50mm lens. Also, the translation reads, "'Standard lens' means a 31mm lens for me . . ."—that's subjective and what feels right for him. Actually, the 50mm is pretty close in full frame. So much of what we trumpet when we say our field of vision using both eyes encompasses a much broader view boils down to our eyes darting around making it appear that we have a wider field of view, and our useless for anything other than sensing movement peripheral vision.

10-29-2021, 08:12 AM	#22
house Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 3,306	Originally posted by texandrews I wonder what camera they used to make the video? https://youtu.be/SY2yenwmrzU?t=125 See above. I think that the footage they are taking above wen't into that other video. Same location, clothes, weather etc. at least. It's pretty much a behind the scenes video for that "evidence" video.

10-29-2021, 08:25 AM - 1 Like	#23
Jeff Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Berkshire, England Posts: 837	Originally posted by Class A A "standard" or "normal" focal length is not about field of view at all (neither full or focused field of view). It is about faithfully producing angles when the image is viewed from a distance that is equal to the diagonal of the image. So if, for instance, you are viewing a 16x20 print, the assumption is that you are going to view it from around 25.6 inch distance. In this case, an image taken with a "normal" focal length will neither show exaggerated angles (as a wide-angle lens would do) or a compressed perspective (as a telephoto lens would do). The actually correct "normal" focal length for FF cameras is 43mm, hence the FA 43/1.9 Limited. The "50mm" choice was made because it is pretty close to 43mm but makes it easier to construct sharp lenses. When I use my 43 on the K-1 it feels far more natural and easier to 'read' than the 50. I use that when I want to leave things out. And I really enjoy Seo's work for all the reasons that some others don't - he also composes his own music. Talented guy.

10-29-2021, 09:02 AM	#24
biz-engineer Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 12,232	Originally posted by Class A The actually correct "normal" focal length for FF cameras is 43mm Where is the evidence of that? I conducted an experiment with a zoom lens, shot the same street + houses at various focal length, then I ranked the images to find the one most similar in terms of the image representation compared to reality, and to my surprise (I had learned from the forum that 43mm was the normal FL), I found that the focal length that gave the closest to naked eye view was 50mm. I said to myself "wow! so the popular believe that 50mm is the normal lens was right, it's not 43mm". I found that observation amazing.

10-29-2021, 09:10 AM - 1 Like	#25
BarryE Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Hampshire, UK Posts: 1,653	Originally posted by biz-engineer Where is the evidence of that? I conducted an experiment with a zoom lens, shot the same street + houses at various focal length, then I ranked the images to find the one most similar in terms of the image representation compared to reality, and to my surprise (I had learned from the forum that 43mm was the normal FL), I found that the focal length that gave the closest to naked eye view was 50mm. I said to myself "wow! so the popular believe that 50mm is the normal lens was right, it's not 43mm". I found that observation amazing. Maybe some folk's eyes are closer together than others ...

10-29-2021, 09:15 AM	#26
biz-engineer Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 12,232	Originally posted by BarryE Maybe some folk's eyes are closer together than others ... Maybe. However, it's easy to demonstrate that the diagonal of the sensor has nothing to do with the notion of normal focal length, change the aspect ratio from 3:2 to 1:1 (crop the edges), now the diagonal of the crop is 33.94mm but if the lens is still the same and the photographer hasn't moved the proportion of street vs houses in the picture is still the same.

10-29-2021, 10:04 AM	#28
BarryE Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Hampshire, UK Posts: 1,653	Originally posted by biz-engineer Maybe. However, it's easy to demonstrate that the diagonal of the sensor has nothing to do with the notion of normal focal length, change the aspect ratio from 3:2 to 1:1 (crop the edges), now the diagonal of the crop is 33.94mm but if the lens is still the same and the photographer hasn't moved the proportion of street vs houses in the picture is still the same. "33.94mm". Guess I don't think of photography with this degree of precision, but then I was only a software engineer so my world was easier to define with just 1s and 0s

10-29-2021, 12:21 PM	#29
ChristianRock Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: People's Republic of America Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,910	I like the video. It's about his journey. I think it was tastefully done and the music fits the mood of the pictures that the photographer takes.

10-29-2021, 07:44 PM	#30
JPT Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Tokyo Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,821	On the Japanese Ricoh site they introduce this as the first of their "Evidence" videos, strongly implying that there will be some more to add to the site. I think the word evidence just means evidence of what the lenses can do. I liked the video. This location is an easy trip from where I've but I haven't been there for years. Perhaps I should go there again and take some shots. It's part of the western Tokyo prefecture that is very natural and mountainous. Obviously Tokyo is very, very urban in most places, but it's easy to forget how easy it is to get in a train and be somewhere completely different within an hour.