Indoor sports shooting on a budget

scatron · 02-19-2009, 10:11 AM

Sure, if money were no object, I get the DA 200mm f/2.8 ($856 on Amazon) or the DA 50-135mm f/2.8 ($708).

I've been using a Hanimex 200mm f/3.5 with uneven results:
Flickr: My stuff tagged with Hanimex 200mm f/3.5

Some examples:

200mm worked ok here:

But was a little tight here (and was hard to MF when they were moving around more)

Also, 200 mm is too tight if sitting on the sidelines of a gymnasium for kids' sports.

First preference would be a fast auto-focus zoom in the (approximately) 50-250 range for under $400. Does such a thing exist?

Second preference would be a manual-focus zoom.

Third - a shorter (maybe 100-150mm?) fast prime.

Any suggestions?

Blue · 02-19-2009, 10:26 AM

In that case and based on the price range, consider either the Tamron or Sigma

70-200mm f2.8 AF lens.

scatron · 02-19-2009, 11:04 AM

Originally posted by Blue

In that case and based on the price range, consider either the Tamron or Sigma

70-200mm f2.8 AF lens.

These are $600-700 at Amazon. Are they under $400 somewhere else?

**Canada_Rockies** · 02-19-2009, 11:13 AM

I would seriously consider a 100/2.8. M/K versions are not overly expensive. I tend to use manual exposure for indoor shooting anyway - the light is tricky. For basketball I meter the floor and set it and forget it. For hockey I meter the ice and add two stops.

**Kerrowdown** · 02-19-2009, 12:00 PM

I only use fast manual primes for this type of photography, that extra stop or two can really make a difference, certainly in terms of brighter viewfinder so you can see whats going on.

Blue · 02-19-2009, 01:07 PM

Originally posted by scatron

These are $600-700 at Amazon. Are they under $400 somewhere else?

Not that I know of, but neither are either of the DA* lenses in your OP.

Edit: If you know of a source of DA* 200mm lenses for under $400, I'd like to know!

Blue · 02-19-2009, 01:12 PM

One of the things to keep in mind when photographing indoor sporting events is the lighting. There are several types of lighting that may be encountered from sodium vapor, mercury vapor, florescent (many variations), halogen etc. This can effect your image dramatically if not accounted for.

dave9t5 · 02-19-2009, 01:26 PM

Spend the $400 on a second body and/or short lens. Presumably you have either a short prime (in the 30~50mm range) or a short zoom already (most people have one or the other or both). When the action is in your end of the court shoot with the body with the short-lens. when the action is in the far-end of the court, shoot with your 200mm.

A prime will be faster but one advantage to a short zoom is that when the action is in your end of the court, the working distance (focal length) changes relatively suddenly. At the far-end of the court, the working distance is pretty fixed.

Another advantage of a short zoom is an AF one is relatively cheap, and the AF will probably benefit you more when the action is in your face.

You could find a K10D for $400, or a K100D Super + zoom for similar. An FA28-70/4 is relatively fast.

(It seems you can live with the f/3.5 of your current 200mm...)

Dave

scatron · 02-19-2009, 01:27 PM

Originally posted by Blue

Not that I know of, but neither are either of the DA* lenses in your OP.

Those were examples if money were no object.

You missed this part:

Originally posted by scatron

First preference would be a fast auto-focus zoom in the (approximately) 50-250 range for under $400. Does such a thing exist?

PentaxPoke · 02-19-2009, 02:29 PM

I shoot a lot of basketball. Mostly with primes ( 35mm, 50mm, 70mm). The only zoom I have used regularly is the 50-135 but I still like the primes better because they focus faster, and are lighter so I can be more mobile. Also with a good quality prime, even if your focal length is not long enough, you can crop and yield excellent results.

So with your stated budget and goals, I am with Dave that primes are the way to go. You are already getting some excellent shots with your 200.

I also find that the Katzeye split screen helps me a lot with focusing because with so much action going on, you can't always trust the AF to focus the way you want (Link): https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-dslr-discussion/46978-my-k20d-katz...-pictures.html

DA 70/f2.4 cropped

Blue · 02-19-2009, 02:29 PM

Originally posted by scatron

Those were examples if money were no object.

You missed this part:

You are correct, I missed that. That price range would limit you to some 2.8 manual lenses like the Tamron Adaptall 2 SP 80-200mm f2.8 lens. This lens can be found for <400. There is also a Tokina lens in the same FL and f2.8.

Remember that when picking a lens you can pick 2 of 3 only: Good, fast, cheap.

SouthShoreRob · 02-19-2009, 02:36 PM

The FA 50 F1.4 will do an excellent job for you. I have also been very impressed with how well my new DA 55-300 is handling sports. Given the fact it's paired to my K20, I can boost the ISO to 2000-3200 and overcome it's slow F4 to F5.8 aperture. See examples of my recent hockey pics by following the link in my signature.

Rob

Blue · 02-19-2009, 02:40 PM

Originally posted by SouthShoreRob

The FA 50 F1.4 will do an excellent job for you. I have also been very impressed with how well my new DA 55-300 is handling sports. Given the fact it's paired to my K20, I can boost the ISO to 2000-3200 and overcome it's slow F4 to F5.8 aperture. See examples of my recent hockey pics by following the link in my signature.

Rob

I suggested some lighting issues above but didn't get into the ISO because of his camera body. Otherwise, he could do that with his Hanimex and see how it goes.

reknelb · 02-19-2009, 02:52 PM

Under $400
- Manual focus 80-200 f2.8 Tokina at-x (around $200)
- Manual Focus 60-125 F2.8 Tokina at-x (i watched one on ebay go for about$100)

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/photographers-marketplace/42159-tokina-x-...-f-2-8-pk.html

Combine one of these with a split-focusing screen and your good to go. I believe these are both manual aperture which may not be the most desirable.

PentaxPoke · 02-19-2009, 03:03 PM

Originally posted by reknelb

Under $400
- Manual focus 80-200 f2.8 Tokina at-x (around $200)
- Manual Focus 60-125 F2.8 Tokina at-x (i watched one on ebay go for about$100)

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/photographers-marketplace/42159-tokina-x-...-f-2-8-pk.html

Combine one of these with a split-focusing screen and your good to go. I believe these are both manual aperture which may not be the most desirable.

These look like really good value zoom options. The nice thing about shooting basketball is that the lighting does not change so you can easily shoot M, and set the ISO, aperture, and shutter speed once, and you are done for the entire game. That way, your exposures are consistent for the entire game and you don't get the wild swings in exposure you get by alternately pointing the camera at the dark and light colored jerseys. The only thing you really have to worry about is focus. I often turn off the AF and use MF for games.

02-19-2009, 10:11 AM	#1
scatron Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Sandy, Utah Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 303	Indoor sports shooting on a budget Sure, if money were no object, I get the DA 200mm f/2.8 ($856 on Amazon) or the DA 50-135mm f/2.8 ($708). I've been using a Hanimex 200mm f/3.5 with uneven results: Flickr: My stuff tagged with Hanimex 200mm f/3.5 Some examples: 200mm worked ok here: But was a little tight here (and was hard to MF when they were moving around more) Also, 200 mm is too tight if sitting on the sidelines of a gymnasium for kids' sports. First preference would be a fast auto-focus zoom in the (approximately) 50-250 range for under $400. Does such a thing exist? Second preference would be a manual-focus zoom. Third - a shorter (maybe 100-150mm?) fast prime. Any suggestions?

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02-19-2009, 10:26 AM	#2
Blue Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Florida Hill Country Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,377	In that case and based on the price range, consider either the Tamron or Sigma 70-200mm f2.8 AF lens.

02-19-2009, 11:04 AM	#3
scatron Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Sandy, Utah Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 303 Original Poster	Originally posted by Blue In that case and based on the price range, consider either the Tamron or Sigma 70-200mm f2.8 AF lens. These are $600-700 at Amazon. Are they under $400 somewhere else?

02-19-2009, 11:13 AM	#4
Canada_Rockies Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Sparwood, BC, Canada Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,385	I would seriously consider a 100/2.8. M/K versions are not overly expensive. I tend to use manual exposure for indoor shooting anyway - the light is tricky. For basketball I meter the floor and set it and forget it. For hockey I meter the ice and add two stops.

02-19-2009, 12:00 PM	#5
Kerrowdown PEG Moderator Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Highlands of Scotland... "Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand" - William Blake Photos: Gallery Posts: 57,816	I only use fast manual primes for this type of photography, that extra stop or two can really make a difference, certainly in terms of brighter viewfinder so you can see whats going on.

02-19-2009, 01:07 PM	#6
Blue Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Florida Hill Country Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,377	Originally posted by scatron These are $600-700 at Amazon. Are they under $400 somewhere else? Not that I know of, but neither are either of the DA* lenses in your OP. Edit: If you know of a source of DA* 200mm lenses for under $400, I'd like to know!

02-19-2009, 01:12 PM	#7
Blue Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Florida Hill Country Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,377	One of the things to keep in mind when photographing indoor sporting events is the lighting. There are several types of lighting that may be encountered from sodium vapor, mercury vapor, florescent (many variations), halogen etc. This can effect your image dramatically if not accounted for.

02-19-2009, 01:26 PM	#8
dave9t5 Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Toronto, Canada & Taichung, Taiwan Photos: Albums Posts: 329	Spend the $400 on a second body and/or short lens. Presumably you have either a short prime (in the 30~50mm range) or a short zoom already (most people have one or the other or both). When the action is in your end of the court shoot with the body with the short-lens. when the action is in the far-end of the court, shoot with your 200mm. A prime will be faster but one advantage to a short zoom is that when the action is in your end of the court, the working distance (focal length) changes relatively suddenly. At the far-end of the court, the working distance is pretty fixed. Another advantage of a short zoom is an AF one is relatively cheap, and the AF will probably benefit you more when the action is in your face. You could find a K10D for $400, or a K100D Super + zoom for similar. An FA28-70/4 is relatively fast. (It seems you can live with the f/3.5 of your current 200mm...) Dave

02-19-2009, 01:27 PM	#9
scatron Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Sandy, Utah Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 303 Original Poster	Originally posted by Blue Not that I know of, but neither are either of the DA* lenses in your OP. Those were examples if money were no object. You missed this part: Originally posted by scatron First preference would be a fast auto-focus zoom in the (approximately) 50-250 range for under $400. Does such a thing exist?

02-19-2009, 02:29 PM	#10
PentaxPoke Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 1,411	I shoot a lot of basketball. Mostly with primes ( 35mm, 50mm, 70mm). The only zoom I have used regularly is the 50-135 but I still like the primes better because they focus faster, and are lighter so I can be more mobile. Also with a good quality prime, even if your focal length is not long enough, you can crop and yield excellent results. So with your stated budget and goals, I am with Dave that primes are the way to go. You are already getting some excellent shots with your 200. I also find that the Katzeye split screen helps me a lot with focusing because with so much action going on, you can't always trust the AF to focus the way you want (Link): https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-dslr-discussion/46978-my-k20d-katz...-pictures.html DA 70/f2.4 cropped

02-19-2009, 02:29 PM	#11
Blue Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Florida Hill Country Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,377	Originally posted by scatron Those were examples if money were no object. You missed this part: You are correct, I missed that. That price range would limit you to some 2.8 manual lenses like the Tamron Adaptall 2 SP 80-200mm f2.8 lens. This lens can be found for <400. There is also a Tokina lens in the same FL and f2.8. Remember that when picking a lens you can pick 2 of 3 only: Good, fast, cheap.

02-19-2009, 02:36 PM	#12
SouthShoreRob Guest	The FA 50 F1.4 will do an excellent job for you. I have also been very impressed with how well my new DA 55-300 is handling sports. Given the fact it's paired to my K20, I can boost the ISO to 2000-3200 and overcome it's slow F4 to F5.8 aperture. See examples of my recent hockey pics by following the link in my signature. Rob

02-19-2009, 02:40 PM	#13
Blue Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Florida Hill Country Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,377	Originally posted by SouthShoreRob The FA 50 F1.4 will do an excellent job for you. I have also been very impressed with how well my new DA 55-300 is handling sports. Given the fact it's paired to my K20, I can boost the ISO to 2000-3200 and overcome it's slow F4 to F5.8 aperture. See examples of my recent hockey pics by following the link in my signature. Rob I suggested some lighting issues above but didn't get into the ISO because of his camera body. Otherwise, he could do that with his Hanimex and see how it goes.

02-19-2009, 02:52 PM	#14
reknelb Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Buffalo, NY Photos: Gallery Posts: 323	Under $400 - Manual focus 80-200 f2.8 Tokina at-x (around $200) - Manual Focus 60-125 F2.8 Tokina at-x (i watched one on ebay go for about$100) https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/photographers-marketplace/42159-tokina-x-...-f-2-8-pk.html Combine one of these with a split-focusing screen and your good to go. I believe these are both manual aperture which may not be the most desirable.

02-19-2009, 03:03 PM	#15
PentaxPoke Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 1,411	Originally posted by reknelb Under $400 - Manual focus 80-200 f2.8 Tokina at-x (around $200) - Manual Focus 60-125 F2.8 Tokina at-x (i watched one on ebay go for about$100) https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/photographers-marketplace/42159-tokina-x-...-f-2-8-pk.html Combine one of these with a split-focusing screen and your good to go. I believe these are both manual aperture which may not be the most desirable. These look like really good value zoom options. The nice thing about shooting basketball is that the lighting does not change so you can easily shoot M, and set the ISO, aperture, and shutter speed once, and you are done for the entire game. That way, your exposures are consistent for the entire game and you don't get the wild swings in exposure you get by alternately pointing the camera at the dark and light colored jerseys. The only thing you really have to worry about is focus. I often turn off the AF and use MF for games.